Question

[ClingingToHope]

Awest, what if he doesn't start paying?

Money stuff is tough. I'm handing over more than $1,000 a month but W, when she gets stressed starts complaining about not having any money. It seems like she's fishing for more and I'm tapped out.

Money is always an issue. I remember that's what my parents argued about for six years after they divorced. Then when I started college, my dad moved away because he'd fallen off the wagon and gotten too many DUIs in Illinois.

[awest1217]

H has not come out this weekend and said he is going to the game with OW, but he has gone to every home game this year with her, plus two away games. He has said in the past that they were going. And if you are wondering...yes he does tell me when they are doing things because he wants me to be comfortable with the relationship so that they can be "just friends". Tried that...when he came back for two weeks and he told her "I love you" and never me so yea not being fooled again by that. My H is the master manipulator...but no more. I have my boundaries with OW and I will not let him cross it ever again because I deserve better.

[LolaL]

You do deserve better. But in the meantime, the financial issue is pressing.

Is there any way you can get some kind of temporary support order put in place? I am not sure what the laws in your state are, but this is a definite possibility, especially with a child involved. Check out the Attorney General's office in your state, or possibly a domestic relations office. At least then you might be able to get child support and maybe even some spousal support.

[Lucky11too]

My H is the master manipulator...but no more. I have my boundaries with OW and I will not let him cross it ever again because I deserve better.

Good for you! You're smart for making and sticking to boundaries. That R with OW just can't continue. It does amaze me though how these spouses on here can just think we are so stupid to actually believe the 'just friends' BS. Please.
And yes, you do deserve better. You don't deserve to ever be 'second place' to that OW.

[ClingingToHope]

I'm with Lola, check to see if there's some kind of legal action you can take on support short of divorce. Your boundaries on OW are good but he is cake-eating big time on money. He can see OW with you as a backup plan, and he doesn't even have to pay for the backup plan.

Trust me, as a guy, we are attuned to mathematics. He needs to realize the financial impact of his actions on HIM not you.

Sad to say part of the reason I'm almost welcoming D papers rather than sitting in limboland is that a D would be better for me finacially than just waiting things out. I went the opposite route from your H and have been giving generous support.

Men are bottom-line driven.

Have a good day. I can't remember if you ever told me what grade and subjects you teach.

[awest1217]

I teach high school chemistry and physics.

About the court order, in IN especially the county where I live, I cannot get anything legal without filing for separation or divorce, and on top of that everything has to be negotiated before going to a judge, and on top of that H would get visitation no matter what. L said even if he went to jail, when he got out, he would still get visitation. I know IN is not good when it comes to this. It is good for dads who are there for their children and W is being vindictive, but in my case, dad does not care by his actions (of course his words are another thing). I had my last session with my counselor (I get free ones and now that I have to pay, I have to stop). She asked why I am allowing this, and I said to protect S. As long as he is not paying, but not asking to see S, that is ok with me because then I know S is protected with me. It is if H starts asking to see S that I will have to take the next step, but right now he may pay. He has seemed to change a little since coming home so I am hoping for the best, while expecting the worst, if that makes sense.

About H knowing how it will cost him, he knows. He said he has not paid so far because he does not have the extra money to give me (wasting it on OW). He also knows that if it comes to D he will have to get an appartment so he will have even less money, insurance will go up, he will have to get a large amount of life insurance where S is the sole beneficiary (my brother is an insurance agent in the state and sees many men having to do this), pay utilities, food, etc...plus about $500 in child support and possibly lose part of the savings (I don't know how much because i am keeping the house). Overall he knows it will be bad for him, which is why I think he quickly came home when I said L in the first place. He will not have the luxuries he does now, and sometimes I wonder if he is worried without those luxuries if he will lose OW. I am assuming there so I am not going to put much into that. He knows it will be hard, which is why I have to set a deadline for myself.

I realized yesterday after my counseling appointment that his "codependence" his counselor and him keep talking about is all about "saving" girls for his gain. If he saves them, then they will be grateful to him and he will look like the good guy and he will get their affection...etc. As you can tell it is all about him. The same with the money, S, and me. As long as he is ok then nothing will change. He is self-centered and everything has to make him feel good or he won't be into it, which is why he won't "save" S and myself because he will have to do it and get nothing from it to begin with. He will have to either sacrifice the relationship with OW in hopes of being happy with me and S, or give money which he gets nothing for.

The good part about this that I realized is that he really does love me. Let me explain. I have never been one of his projects. I never needed to be saved. He was with me not because it helped him or for any other selfish reason. He was with me because he loved me. He truly loved me. I am the only person he sacrificed for without gaining anything himself besides my love in return, but it didn't help his stature or anything selfish like that. He loved me because he loved me. I hope one day he realizes this like I have. If not at least I know, he did love me.

[Lucky11too]

She asked why I am allowing this, and I said to protect S. As long as he is not paying, but not asking to see S, that is ok with me because then I know S is protected with me. It is if H starts asking to see S that I will have to take the next step, but right now he may pay.

Wow. That’s definitely where my mind is too. Most people don’t get this. That is one of my greatest fears about D. CA is a no fault state, so unless I can somehow show that H is a danger to S or himself (which is very difficult to do), he’ll get at least partial custody. And that seriously scares me. He is not a good father. Yes, he loves S a lot, but he is selfish. He doesn’t look at what is in the best interests of S – he just acts. It almost “works” right now b/c H just comes over for a few hours a week when he feels like it and that’s it. No overnights. Nothing. If it wasn’t for the money issues, I could let it ride like this forever. Well I guess not really – limboland is still not an easy place to be in.

He is self-centered and everything has to make him feel good or he won't be into it, which is why he won't "save" S and myself because he will have to do it and get nothing from it to begin with. He will have to either sacrifice the relationship with OW in hopes of being happy with me and S, or give money which he gets nothing for.

I hope these H’s can figure out their priorities sooner rather than later. I don’t know if it’s just because they are still young and immature or what. For me, when my S was born, it wasn’t about me anymore – it was about my S and I know I would do anything for my S. How could these H’s let their own flesh and blood go so easy, for their own selfish reasons? Well, I think it’s good that we understand this that way we can manage our expectations of them for the time being. We should be able to expect more out of them as fathers, but that’s something they’ll have to discover on their own journey.

[awest1217]

I agree with you Lucky, but what is worse in my case is that H was completely all about S until about the time he turned 1. At that time, S started to talk and remember things, and I think this scared H because he was (and probably is) doing stuff on the internet that he is ashamed of so he started to withdrawal from S. Him leaving has been a surprise to everyone because he was so involved with S and always talked about how proud of S he was. For the first few months, S wanted H unless he was feeding. I have decided to let go of all expectations, and hopefully his desire will come back to be with S and be a good father again.

I also agree with I could do this forever, honestly I am ok with this limboland because I have finally let go of having expectations. Of course finances will be the deciding factor. I am not expecting to date any time soon so staying married is not a big deal to me if I don't have to deal with him I can wait until he is ready.

I am still holding out hope that things will change and have changed from the last time he left.

[LolaL]

I can understand what you mean. My first husband, the father of my two oldest kids, was a drug addict and abuser. Ultimately I did not ever seek c/s from him because he had no rights to our daughters, and I wanted to keep it that way. Years later, after getting to know XH as adults, both my daughters stated that they were really glad that I had made that decision.

Has he seen your son at all?

[awest1217]

Not since last Wednesday when he saw him for 2 hours to take him to the doctor, but according to the phone records he was on the phone with OW the whole time besides when he was actually in the doctor. Otherwise nothing. Since he left the first time he has never asked to do anything alone with him or stuck to a consistant schedule. Usually I have to be the one to ask him over to see S or in-laws call so he sees him there, but since DB and LRT, since I am not pursuing, H sees S only if something out of the ordinary happens, ie his grandma's viewing and funeral, me not being able to take another day off of work,etc.