Those are all very good signs. They all show that she is still very much interested in your life. As for your question on inviting her to a day with the boys, I think that is OK. I would suggest asking it in such a way as "I am going with the boys to ???, you are welcome to come along if you like." However, I would not do this too much. Anything more and it would look like pursuing. When she is ready, she will start inviting you to things as well.
Thank you for the confirmation for the day out - already looking to it. I like your answer to the WAW re-day out.
First time in 2 months that my WAW stayed in the house for over an hour. She stayed for 4 hrs in all. The idea was to bring over my first Grandson and let my boys see him as well.
I am unsure if she knows that I have seen my GSon more than she has - I am not counting, but she may be unaware that I have regular contact with my Stepdaughter.
But the positive is that she did spend time in the family home. The longest since she left. Another positive is that she referred to our house AS the family home to our son-in-law on the phone.
Very little occurred between us during the time she was here. A bit of small talk, and plenty of silences - but I was not going to bring up any R talks, and was going to follow her lead in everything. Perhaps she just wanted a unpressurized day in the family home..?
Perhaps I was hoping for too much. After all, her being here is a positive. Her not meeting MY expectations is MY negative. I hoped that she would find some time for us to have a R talk, but now I see that she may not be as close to coming home as I thought..... but again, perhaps this is just around the corner and any backslide I make may put this in jeopardy.
The positives out weigh any perceived negatives. She spent some time in the family home WITH me..!!!
She even offered to go out of her way to allow me to take my Grandson to see my parents !
Cause all of the stars, Have faded away, Just try not to worry, You'll see them someday. Take what you need, And be on your way and, Stop crying your heart out.
Yes you need to keep no expectations. And you do not need any R talks now. These must wait till she is desperate to get back into the relationship, but not until then.
How will she get desperate to get back in? She needs to feel a sense that there is something to lose. Notice she called it "the family" home. She is still taking ownership of it, meaning she has not lost it. I would start calling it "my home", she has left it hasn't she? My W took notice when I started saying things were "mine" including the home.
Then you need to go out and GAL. Move on without her. At this point she will start to think she could lose you too. Until then, she will feel no pressure.
She referred to the family home as 'I am at home with the boys at the moment'.
Perhaps you are right in that she must start to think that she could lose something. When I contacted an old female friend it did seem to shake her - she did admit to doing a lot of crying at the time.
Perhaps I should do more with the boys outside the home - but not ask her to join us, to see that we are doing things without her and that we don't need her....
Cause all of the stars, Have faded away, Just try not to worry, You'll see them someday. Take what you need, And be on your way and, Stop crying your heart out.
Tristan, I have been reading your sitch. Apart from a couple of hijackings from others it is quite informative.
But you mention that I should give her something to lose - or put that thought in her mind.
But you did not do this in your sitch. The big move was I think around pg 61 when your WAW asked to talk and you did in the park.
You were nervous and thought she may be serving you the D papers. You didn't indicate that you were at any point about to reconcile - you still thought that it was over.
How were her moods just before she asked to reconcile - ie the last few days before . How did she talk to you? Any more physical contact, more e-mails, more feeling in her voice...??? What were her indicators that she was going to ask for reconciliation - retrospectively of course.
Is it your anger and feelings of betrayal that are saying for me to put the fear of 'losing' into her mind?
I am not being difficult - I just want to understand more. I agree in principle with what you suggest - how is my WAW going to be shook free from her current tranquil existence otherwise.
You are someone that I am trying to emulate, and I find your advice insightful without being too brash. I do not believe that I need to stand up for myself or reclaim my manhood. Aggression would be a mistake from me, and this is something that you did not advocate during your separation.
I will not push my wife further away, I need to draw her towards me!
Regards, Gyn.
Cause all of the stars, Have faded away, Just try not to worry, You'll see them someday. Take what you need, And be on your way and, Stop crying your heart out.
The first indication that things may be turning was on pg 48. She wanted to talk to me after a couple of weeks of almost no communication. We had agreed to a single e-mail a day, but that was about it. But in our phone call she said the following:
Quote:
M: "So did you learn anything new today." <silence> W: "It hit me like a ton of bricks that I really miss my family. You know D5 is a very smart girl." M: "Yes she is." W: "Tonight she told me she was missing you. I told her that I could get you on the phone. She said that won't help, that she wanted you here. Then she told me that it was the worst day ever. D3 fell down and she was crying for daddy." ... W: "I am a piece of sh__, everything I touch gets ruined."
I have talked to a mutual friend and W was afraid that she had lost everything at that point. She thought I was extremly angry. It was not reality, but it was her perception.
Finally, I will say you should not emulate me. I made plenty of mistakes during the ordeal. I am still making mistakes. I think I am hit daily with the 2x4. If I am a model of anything, I think I proved that we can make mistakes and still recover
I will not push my wife further away, I need to draw her towards me!
Hi Gyn.
The paradox is that you need to let her walk away for her to choose to come near you. There is a difference between being indifferent toward your W and detachment. Have you read the thread on detachment? I would suggest it, it is very good.
I will write a little more about the turn around when I get a chance.
Each of our sitch are different. We all know what has not been working in our relationships. Our recent behavior was not working. We need to change OUR behavior until we find what stops pushing spouse away and then continue changes that draws our spouse closer. Human nature is predictable. One person starts to leave and the other starts to chase. The one leaving is in control of the dynamics. MsR2C stepped away, and I had to step away faster to gain control of the dynamics of the R. All our changes are mysterious to our significant other, and that is attractive.
"What is best for my kids is best for me" Amor Fati Link to quotes: https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2879712
Hi to you all and a warm thank you for your input.
WAW came around today for an hour. She has said that she can't go more than 2 days w/o seeing the boys and she had said that she might come over.
I avoided texting her to see when or if she was coming over. She actually texted me to give me 10 mins notice - unusual in that she never contacts me first.
Straight away I could sense a softer more open attitude from her - I knew that she wanted to talk at some point.
I told her I needed for her to look after the boys next Monday and Thursday. Monday for a Doctors appt, and Thursday I just left blank - I did not tell her what I was doing, just the times I was leaving and what time I would be back. She didn't ask about Thursday directly, but she did ask a few questions around it.
When we did speak she mentioned the worsening sitch at her brothers where she is staying - he can't keep up his mortgage payments and she may need to move back to her mothers.
She complained that she has no time to study as she is back and forth to see the children. She pointed out last year she could study as she was at home and so didn't lose time in traveling.
She complained that her day was spoilt as her EA needed to leave college early due to ill health ,(occurs at least once a week) - and so she had to leave at the same time.
She asked if I had heard from my female friend - I said no and that I hadn't heard from her in a week or more. (Asking about Thursday).
She asked about my parents and twisted my words to seem that they must hate her. I denyed this. I didn't ask after her side of the family - correction - I did ask after her Brother and Sister after all she had brought them up in conversation, and I mustn't seem cold.
I told her I was thinking about taking the boys out to see a local yearly attraction. Every year we go - my family and parents. I did not ask her if she wanted to go. She then asked if my parents were going - I said I am not sure as me and the boys were having a debate over it - this is true. But I still did not offer for her to go. I may do nearer the time.
She then said that she was thinking about speaking to my parents. WOW - this is a surprise! It would never happen in a month of Sundays. And I knew this. So knowing that I should believe 90% of what I hear and 50% of what I see, I couldn't resist. I asked her what she would talk to them about. Give it a 5 second pause she mumbled something or other.
This confirmed that she is still telling me what she thinks I want to hear....... keep up the 90% rule.....
She kept saying 'I have no time to do anything' What would be a good response to this ?? She walked out so that she could find the time to think, but became entangled more with her EA who is now eating up more and more of her time, so now she has less time to think.
S9 asked her 'when can we be a family again mum?' I left that one to her to mumble 'I don't know?'
She asked about what I have been doing all week and what I have planned - (Thursday again ?) I said this and that, I have hardly been home - I did give some examples of what I had truly been doing outside the house - and I told her that I was planning to go out at least twice next week with the boys. I did not offer her to come along.
So all in all, she asked a lot. I responded where I needed. But somehow we did not connect as I felt we could have. I felt that she was a little disappointed. I was disappointed, and I felt that I had missed an opportunity.
She rang me about an hour later with some things we had spoken about - she did not need to ring back. I kept it light and spoke mainly about our ill S7. ( sore throat & a temperature.) nothing too major I hope.....
I had gauged her mood right I feel. I feel that she was pissed off that her EA had cut short her college time and his health had been a problem, again. I feel that she had compared her present sleeping arrangements to being at home. I feel that she had compared her present study arrangements to last years and it pissed her off.
I feel that she is questioning things I feel that she comparing like for like in her life - and the present sitch is coming up short compared to say last year.
I say that it may have been a missed opportunity to connect more - but perhaps this was more about the questions she is asking herself. Perhaps she was not looking for a connection but a confirmation of things in her mind
Did I do / act right or wrong?
Some of what she told me will be the truth - some will be the 90% lie. The difficulty is in finding the truth and the hidden meaning. I feel that there was more than 10% of truth in what she said. I feel it was nearer 90% truth - but some was hidden in 'Female speak'. Why don't they teach 'Female speak' in school !? Chuckle !!
regards, Gyn.
Cause all of the stars, Have faded away, Just try not to worry, You'll see them someday. Take what you need, And be on your way and, Stop crying your heart out.
I thought that I knew it - but - I have learnt a long time ago that things are not the same upon refection and comparison to recent knowledge.
My favorite anecdote;
Mr Einstein, what is your 'phone number? I don't know? But I thought you were a brilliant scientist and you knew everything? Aaawwww, I know where to find it.
No-one can know everything - my Degree told me that. But the knowledge that you can either look-up the answer or deduce it from first principles, tells me that we can learn anything if we want to.
You sometimes need the right motivation.
Cause all of the stars, Have faded away, Just try not to worry, You'll see them someday. Take what you need, And be on your way and, Stop crying your heart out.
