I last posted back in August. To recap, H and I had a great sex life for the first 5.5 years we were together...then about 2 years ago, it started dwindling. I finally got desperate enough to hang out here.
I mean, what can I do? I don't want to have an affair. The whole thing would just be more trouble than it's worth and end horribly. (I'm speaking from experience - from a past relationship.)
But I need sex more often than once or twice a month. I'm really angry at H for not wanting me.
We talked about it yesterday. There was a time, early in our relationship, when I had to move about 100 miles away for a job, and we saw each other only on weekends. And the weekends were great! Mad sex every Friday, sometimes some on Saturday or Sunday, and we did fun stuff every weekend (went to museums, street festivals, etc.)
Now, we live together, and spend weekends doing boring sh!t like housework and grocery shopping. Thank god we don't have a house with a yard or we'd have to waste precious weekend time on yard work, too. (As an aside - he says from time to time that he wants to buy a house. Well, he's been saying that for a couple of years now, and it's nowhere near happening. I just don't believe him anymore. And frankly, I'm not sure I want a house. Like I said, it will just create more boring, mundane suburban sh!t like yard work.)
What's really frustrating is that he says he loves me, and I believe he does. He even says he finds me sexually attractive and the desire is still there. When we talked yesterday, I brought up how good our relationship was when we didn't live together all the time. He said, the excitement of the early part of a relationship doesn't last forever (that period took place early in the relationship.) But he also said that the desire and the attraction are still there. I said I know the early part doesn't last forever, but I miss sex and romance and the fun we used to have. Then he said we would start doing more of that again.
When people (including H) tell me this line about "the early excitement doesn't last forever" I always feel like I'm being lectured. I feel like what I'm really being told is, "You need to grow up and stop wanting passion and sex and fun. You're immature if you don't think the boring, stable part of the relationship is better." Then I just feel angry and rebellious. I feel like saying, "Fine, then. I'm not doing any housework or any other boring stuff until I get laid."
Of course, in the name of being "mature" and a "good" woman, I don't say any of this. I just shut up and do whatever is next to do (fix dinner, etc.) Yesterday, we had our discussion in the morning (me saying I missed the early part of the relationship, him saying "that doesn't last forever but I still desire you.") A little later, he watched me getting dressed and complimented my body. (I could stand to lose about 25 lbs. BUT I'm in Weight Watchers and it is coming off - I've lost about 11 lbs since July.)
Then during the day, he made a few veiled references to "we might tonight." Now I should add here, he had a miserable cold earlier this week. If he's not feeling good, of course he won't want sex, and I understand that. But when he looks at my body and makes compliments, and then teases me by dropping hints that "maybe tonight" it might happen, wouldn't it be natural for me to think we might have sex?
Not in this relationship, it wouldn't. We ended up going to a movie. Which is nice and fun and all that, but not what I really wanted. Maybe he thought taking me out would be part of "being romantic and having fun."
I'm really feeling angry and hurt. I might as well weigh 200 lbs., smell bad, and never shave my legs, for all the good it does me to look nice. And I know there are times when I look nice. In my job, I have to go to court a lot, and I wear suits and look pretty good. I was getting a lot of admiring glances from men at the courthouse last Friday, and one attorney whom I know slightly even put his arm around my waist just for a nanosecond. He's a good-looking, smart, and funny guy, too. If we weren't both married, I'd do something!
But back to me and H. I'm not optimistic about anything ever changing. This is the pattern - I talk about how I feel. He says he *does* desire me and we *will* do it. We get one quickie. Then two or three or four weeks go by, and the whole cycle starts over again.
I'm really angry and hurt. The kitchen is filthy, but I'm not doing any g.d. housework today. And if H ever dumps me, I am SO moving to a blue state and starting to date sexy attorneys.
Sorry you're back, under the circumstances. But I wanted to chime in, because I know exactly how you feel. I identify with a great deal of what you just wrote, so I re-read some of your last posts for background.
One of the points that resonated with me was the line that he was still attracted to you and desired you....I heard that all the time from my H, too. It's very hard to understand why, if that is the case, that there is no outward evidence to testify to it. Just words, baby, words.
My entire marriage of 20 years has been this type of struggle. Unfortunately for me, I accepted the state of things as being a lack of love and attraction on his part for most of it, never seeking answers to the "why". Nowadays, there are so-o-o many resources, I only wish I had known about or had access to years ago. If I had only known it really wasn't about me.....so sad. But....all water under the bridge now.
The harsh reality is this: how big of a fight are you prepared for? Your H is in denial....about your state of mind and about the health of your marriage.
When I decided not to settle any more--enough was enough--I did exactly as you are doing. I brought the topic up frequently. I expressed myself clearly, that I was dissatisfied with sex once or twice a month, but the net result of those conversations was exactly NOTHING. It wasn't until he knew I was seeking marriage counseling and I gave him an ultimatum about it maybe being over for me, that he sat up and paid attention.
For most of those years of our marriage--he was 40 when we wed--his libido had been terminally ill and he didn't even know it. Men often don't notice a gradual decline in their libido and when my H realized it was gone, he accepted it as "the way things were" and began covert cover-up techniques. When confronted, he blamed his recent medical treatments...like your H, surgery to the groin, and in his case radiation... for the demise of his erectile and testicular functioning. But I knew in my heart it was more than that. The problem with sex in our marriage predated all of the medical junk.
Although a man's libido and the "auto-erection" diminish with age, my H was unknowingly sabotaging himself and our sex life. He was a lifelong smoker, with no outward health problems from it......except for the hit to his libido. Smoking is a big no-no. Secondly, several years into our marriage, I learned he was a porn user. He is still ashamed of that fact and will never cop to any more revelation of the depth of the problem than what I discovered myself. But the harm it did to me emotionally to know he was using it, coupled with the marginalization and objectification of me which inevitably occurred with his porn use--Ugh!! It definitely made an impact on his desire for "real" sex with a live woman who needed some of his quality time, attention, and--God forbid--foreplay. Third, and not the least damaging....he got fat. His weight started to climb the minute we got married...too much wedding cake, I guess...and so it continues, mostly unabated. He acknowledges the problem, is disgusted with the shape of his body, but refuses to alter his horrible diet or to exercise. Well, DUH!!!
In your case, some or maybe none of this may be helpful. If he is age 50, he needs to have a full medical check-up, including a testosterone panel. Go with him if he will agree, and bring up to the doctor yourself that his libido is suffering (because it's likely that he won't or at best, will make light of it). My H is on testosterone replacement gel--he rubs in on his shoulders before dressing in the morning--and it has made a world of difference for him, libido-wise. He still has erectile problems, but at least he WANTS to get it up now, if you know what I mean!!
Margali, your H is in a comfort-zone and rocking the boat will mean change for him. He will avoid it if possible...it's human nature. You must nurture your marriage relationship, enjoy each other's company and take care of each other sexually. The longer you accept the current state of things, the longer you will go frustrated and the more deeply entrenched the sexual problems will become between you. This breeds a host of other marital problems as well....resentment, hurt, anger, stonewalling....you are seeing this already. You will grow apart. Don't let it carry you to the brink of divorce, because I almost did. Don't settle, girl.
The most frustrating and hurtful part of all this, is that he doesn't think there's a problem (or not much of a problem).
As far as his saying he loves me and still finds me sexy and attractive....he is physically affectionate with me. There's lots of hugging and kissing and cuddling. Since a lot of the neglected spouses here don't even get that much, sometimes I feel guilty for complaining.
Sometimes I feel like the fact that I want sex more often, means that I'm a slut. The man is supposed to want it more than the woman does, right? Then the voice of reason in my head says, "Wanting sex more than once a month does NOT make me a slut!"
As far as the physical health stuff: my H smokes. I don't think he smokes heavily, but how much would a guy have to smoke to affect it?
Also, I confess, I occasionally smoke myself, under severe provocation. Hey, life is stressful, and *something* has to give. I'm trying to lose weight and succeeding, so I don't want to eat. I'm not getting laid. I loathe exercise and only do the minimum necessary to lose weight. I have to drive too much to get into drinking. In my job, illegal drugs would be a MAJOR no-no. So what's left for stress relief, except smoking? So, with that in mind, I can't exactly get on his case about smoking.
I did suggest today that he go to the doctor - he has a lot of sinus problems, from time to time he has to have skin cancers removed, and in general seems to be more "delicate" than I am. I had the same cold he did, earlier in the week, but I just took some cold medicine and went to work and carried on as usual. The cold was worse for him (ended up w/ a sinus infection) so he stayed home.
But his answer to my suggestion that he go to the doctor was that he had a complete physical in Feb. when he turned 50. So, maybe if he goes again in Feb. or March, I can then go with him and bring up the topic of the low libido.
If he's into porn like your H, then he's very good at hiding it and has got me completely fooled. God, that has to suck for you, Silver. I imagine it hurts terribly. (((())))
Maybe I should go to counseling. I don't know. I've been in therapy before and I know it did me a lot of good, but god, it took so long and cost so much (not only in money but in emotional energy.) I just want to have a normal life. I remember toward the end of my time in therapy, I began to resent it. I would think things like, "Other people get to go on vacations....because they don't have to spend all their money on therapy." Around that time, this song by the Offspring came out: "She's Got Issues." Google the lyrics sometime. You'll see why, frustrated and fed up with therapy, I thought that song was the funniest thing in the world.
Later today, after I'd calmed down some from being angry, I remembered one of the most important things I learned in all that therapy: I can't make him change. The only thing I can do is to take some steps for myself, change a few things in my own behavior, and hope it has a positive affect on his behavior.
So I went to the local B & N and got a copy of the g.d. SSM book and started reading it. I didn't want to. I had re-read Bagheera's post about the four stages of working on a SSM, and although it makes me angry to admit it, I'm guilty of trying to skip stages one and two and go directly to step three ("getting your mate to buy in" or words to that effect.) Step one is taking care of myself, so I'm going to try to do that.
One thing I'm wondering: I've heard that one tactic that gets results for a HD partner, is to turn down sex when the LD partner offers it. But I'm afraid to do that. I tend to go for it whenever he wants it (even if I'm not in the mood) because god only knows when I'm going to get it again...he controls the supply.
NO....wanting sex more than ONCE PER MONTH is not slutty or off-kilter. Your husband not initiating it or responding to your advances IS THE ABNORMAL PART. Don't seek therapy for your normal sex drive....get marital therapy with your H, since he obviously doesn't see the need for sex in a healthy marital relationship.
Why am I so emphatic about it??? I thought exactly the same way you are thinking, and it's classic sex starved wife thinking.
My H was physically affectionate too. He never stopped hugging and kissing me, and spooning in bed is his favorite sleeping position. If your H never/rarely has erections from any of this activity, even involuntary nocturnal erections that he wakes and wants to "take advantage of".....something is wrong. I speak from experience.
Husbands often DO NOT want to admit there may be anything wrong with their sexual functioning. Be it denial or embarrassment or shame. If he EVER has a sexual urge or an occasional erection, he will claim...at least to you...that everything is OK. Don't let him get away with that. If you are hurting in the relationship...THERE IS A PROBLEM.
For years, my H gave occasional thought to the fact that he wasn't giving enough sexually to meet my needs and commented to that fact. (Poor me, though...what with all my medical problems and all.....sorry honey!) And I sucked it up for years without complaint, because I always hoped things would improve with time. But that kind of thinking goes against the laws of nature.....no nurture = decay.
While it is true that my H's lack of libido and erectile difficulties COULD HAVE come from his medical condition, it turns out they weren't really....they were the result of self inflicted conditions (smoking and overweight) and low testosterone. Treatable conditions, in theory, but my H wasn't willing to seek any treatment until given an ultimatum. With that ultimatum, I had him read the online CH 1 of SSM, since he is a computer oriented guy. Fortunately, it resonated with him and pricked his conscious and he did read the entire book with me.
While the book certainly helped us begin the process of working on things, he still has done his fair share of digging in his heels, and I have had to basically lead him by the nose....to other reading material, to the doctor, to the pharmacy, to Retrouvaille, etc. But....the results have been worth it. There were moments in the process which caused me to doubt, but.....it all takes time. And the longer the relationship spent in a sex starved condition, the longer it takes to dig out.
You're on the right track.....but you're gonna have to confront him on his bullsh!t.
put she and her and you've some up my marriage. I was vocal from the beginning and the fighting hasn't stopped about it...13 years. I FINALLY FIGURED OUT IT WASN'T ME! I am not a perv. for wanting my wife a few times per week.
