Well, I have been lurking around for the last couple of weeks after reading DR and I have to say, reading all of the advice from other people's sitches has really helped me regain some of my sanity! God bless all of the WAS, LBS, MLCers and others who spend their valuable time helping us newbies out by sharing their experiences.
My Sitch:
I have a borderline WAW who seems to have her hand on the door knob but can't figure out if she wants to turn it or not. The bomb (wanting to separate) was dropped about two months ago and I have to say, I have never experienced the depth of pain and broken confidence that comes from hearing this from the love of my life and best friend.
We have been M 6 years and were together for many years prior to M. I would say that we have generally had a good M and I have always thought that I have been a above average H (good job, reliable, loving, don't fight or argue much, really help out around the house, etc.). In retrospect, I guess there have been some clues that not all was well over the past 1-2 years but it seemed like normal R stuff such as not feeling appreciated and feeling like I am not passionate about her. I always tried to make changes after hearing her concerns and always reassured her that what she was feeling was not how I felt. She always seemed to be better after I made some changes so I assumed that while things were not perfect, they were not anywhere near bad enough to place the M in danger. I also have to admit to being in a state of depression over the past couple of years (possible MLC w/o EA/PA)and this definitely affected her (I became a relatively negative person b/c of the depression). Since the Bomb, I have been in therapy to work on the depression so hopefully that helps. She never let on how bad things were getting for her until Bomb day.
Earlier this year, W started spending more and more time with a male work friend as they had a shared hobby. I was nervous at first but she assured my it was only friendship. Bomb day, which came months later, occurred after I found an excessive number of text messaging going on between them and became upset (never saw the content). After the bomb, W started spending a lot of time going out and not coming home until the wee hours of the AM. Again, she assured me nothing was going on, but a few weeks ago, she admitted that she has been with someone but that it was more of a once or twice kind of thing and that it was over. I read some advice on this forum that an unfaithful spouse will cop to one level below what is actually happening so right now, I have to assume that there is OP. I never believed that I would be able to forgive infidelity but through this, I have learned how much I truly love my W because somehow, I am able to forgive her all while my heart is being ripped out and walked on. I want so bad to work on the M and set things right because so much in our relationship is good. She is following the WAW script perfectly and is saying that she doesn't see how she could ever feel romantic about me again and she doubts that the changes that I am making will stick. She has also said that "people can't change".
I need to release one vent and get it over with. I have come to a point where I fully accept my role in the deterioration of the R but one of the hardest things about this for me is how someone who supposedly loves you and, according to them, has been working for years to save the M can reach the point of EA/PA and wanting to separate without ever sitting their spouse down and giving them the hard truth about how they feel. There, now I said it and I can move on with the post!
For the first month an a half after the Bomb, I did the normal LBH thing which was to beg, plead, rationalize, cry, etc. I could tell that she did not like this and she told me that she can't stand to see how much she is hurting me. I have since been following the advice given so often on this forum to lovingly detach, show PMA, do 180s and GAL. for the last few weeks, I have not mentioned the M and have kept a generally good attitude. I am trying to give her the emotional and mental "space" to work things out. BTW, some newbie advice for the other newbies that have trouble with the detaching because they are "fixers" like me: every time I showed pain and groveled, that apartment finders guide came out. Since I have been following DB principles, I have not seen the guide! Don't know if this will remain the case but thought I would throw some of my limited experience out there.
The advice that I need is as follows:
I know that I need to keep up the loving detachment but since one of our problems was detachment due to my depression and her feeling like I did not show her enough affection, how do I make sure that I don't make the sitch worse by doing this. We have not been intimate since the bomb and there is very little hugging or touching right now but sometimes when she feels bad, she does want to be in my arms and of course I always reciprocate and try to comfort her. The touching thing is a complete rollercoaster right now as one day she will want to be close and then for the next week, there is a wall around her. Right now, I don't try to hug/kiss her because I don't want to be seen as pursuing her so I generally only give affection when she shows me that she is open to it. I do think the detachment thing has given her space and made things better but I just don't want to send her the wrong message. How is the best way to balance this?
My other question involves the potential OP. Most advice I have seen on this forum says to not get into the negative trap of snooping, however, I have also read that you can't work on M if W is seeing OP. What's the best way to proceed?
Sorry for the lengthy post, any responses are truly appreciated.
You're in the right place. Sorry to hear of your struggles - you'll find help here.
My advice:
1. Make sure you read DR and DB several times. 2. Snooping is bad, no matter what. So keep that in mind. 3. The balance you seek is very elusive. Depending on how close your think you are to separation, you may need to detach even more. It sounds like you are doing the right thing though - don;t appear to be pursuing. 4. Make sure you work on yourself.
Me: 35 W: 31 D10, S7, S2, S11 months M: 11 years Tricked into separation. In Last Resort.
My story: http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1800530#Post180053
Sorry that you are here HBH. I would suggest not snooping, but I think you are right that there may be OM in the picture. You can keep your eyes and ears wide open without snooping. If your gut is telling you that there is an OM, there probably is. Are you in MC? Have you asked her about it?
It sounds like you have been doing a lot right lately. I agree if she comes to you should recipricate the affection (for now). If there is OM in the picture, then things may need to change. However, do not pursue her. Go out GAL yourself, excercise, take care of your depression, make yourself attractive.
Sounds like you have a very good grip on what is going on around you. Like Tristan said, listen to your gut on the OM. You know your W better than anyone on this board....it is easy to be naive and say this person would never do this but WHAM! - that is when you realize what is really going on.
M 33, W 30, SD 10, D 5, S 4
Made it through the WAW, living happily together now. And I am much wiser for it!
Hi LW - read your sitch and so sorry that you are here as well.
"In the past, it was always vague requests "pay more attention to the family" or "spend less" followed by just as vague promises. Since she stopped complaining a few months ago, I assumed I had finally found the right amount of whatever. Now I know its because she had been planning to leave me for that entire time.
I've been such an idiot. As many others on this board have said, this shouldn't be what it took to wake me up, but apparently it was."
Your quote above is exactly how I feel right now. Definitely working on myself and taking things one day at a time. Going to go buy DB tomorrow and also re-read DR at some point, Thanks for the advice!
Hi HBH. I thought this for a long time too. It's not true. You were thinking that your W would handle problems in a way that fell within the boundaries of your marriage vows. This is a reasonable thought and you want to give the one you love the benefit of the doubt. This is natural. So it turned out to be wrong, it does not make you an idiot. You made reasonable assumptions.
Don't dwell in the past, don't worry about the future. Right now, you need to concentrate on the present.
Hi HBH! So sorry to hear about your situation. I interesting thing is that you seem to be a male version of me...and my H is acting just like your W! We also are still in the same house and our situation is so, so similar to the things you've shared. I am struggling to with how to handle this. Mostly I'm trying to remember to keep up my own life and be as happy as I can be day to day. I treat him according to what I read in Light his Fire and that advice has been spot on so far but also combined with the DB principles of not pursuing or pushing. Our communication is improving more & more which is great! But other than that mostly my situation is just as up in the air as anyones here.
H wouldn't go to MC so I did...frankly it has been a waste of time mostly. The MC would not have been able to get through to H at all if he'd gone! Honestly it probably would have made things worse. Much, much more good advice and value through being on this forum and from reading certain books! (Mars/Venus, Light His Fire, Divorce Busting)
Don't have any brillant advice because it's so day to day here in our home too! Each day brings new challenges.
Hi HBH. I thought this for a long time too. It's not true. You were thinking that your W would handle problems in a way that fell within the boundaries of your marriage vows. This is a reasonable thought and you want to give the one you love the benefit of the doubt. This is natural. So it turned out to be wrong, it does not make you an idiot. You made reasonable assumptions.
Thanks Tristan! - definitely got to keep trying to keep this in mind. It is hard because these WAW situations are so illogical and it is too easy to start thinking that it is all my fault somehow.
I asked about marriage counseling a few weeks ago but she was resistant saying that she doesn't want to hear our same discussions rehashed by a counselor. I did ask W to seek IC and W just did her first therapy session with a psychologist. I hope that it helps her b/c I know that she is confused right now. The only thing that worries me is that she came back saying that the session went well and that she felt "validated". I am still trying to figure out what this means within the context of our sitch.
Do you think it would be a good idea to bring up the MC again? I am concerned that she found one of those "well meaning therapists" discussed in DR.
Sounds like you have a very good grip on what is going on around you.
Thanks to the advice from folks on this board!
Originally Posted By: wanttobebetter
Like Tristan said, listen to your gut on the OM. You know your W better than anyone on this board....it is easy to be naive and say this person would never do this but WHAM! - that is when you realize what is really going on.
Yep, my gut tells me that OP is still in the picture and that same gut didn't steer me wrong before.
