I am scared that I messed up...

[faithisbelieving]

have been working on myself to become a better man.

Stop saying this. You sound like a salesman and they HEAR YOU as a salesman. It's 'cheesy'. She'll see it if you really are. Men don't sell themselves. It also comes across as begging and pleading.

I hold told her that I am working on improving myself so that "my next relationship" is much superior to our current relationship.

Translated: If you don't come back to me, I'm getting someone else. Nah nah ni nah nah. Please...stop this stuff. You may not see this but you sound like a little hurt boy.

She looked at me puzzled

Duh?
You thumbed your nose at her.

She probed more about my coffee "date" as she put it and I told her about my friends situation and did not reveal any of the advice she gave me.

You basically told your wife that you met up with a woman and listened to her problems, probably reinforcing to her that you don't do that with her. It's almost as if you told her that you had a mini EA. Why?

she decide not to move forward with me then I would find someone else that would enjoy being with the new me.

What a great way to get her to respond to that threat. Ugh. Keep saying this stuff and she WON'T move forward with you.

She questioned who, and I told her a girl I used to work with 20 years ago that I and chatted with on FB that afternoon

Was this smart to do when you are trying to save your marriage? Was it even smarter to tell her? Are you trying to create jealousy and controversy and further push her away?

One of her complaints over the years is that she plans everything and I just follow along.

I texted her asking if she could arrange for the babysitter

I then asked her if she had any ideas then.

Yawn. What do you wanna do? I dunno, what do you wanna do? I dunno what do YOU wanna do?.

Cut this crap. Next time, arrange the babysitter YOURSELF. YOU DECIDE what to do and if she doesn't like something, have Plan B ready.

I had to tell her that I apologize for my mistakes

Stop this. Women listen better than we do. She heard you apologize already. Just listen. You going to apologize yourself into a divorce. Read Wayne Levine's Hold Onto Your N.U.T.S.

FIB

[Tomato]

I guess this is progress. I told her that until she is over her anger that we should not continue with these talks of R and M. But she insists that it is helping us figure things out. I feel that it is not, because we keep talking about the same stuff and she can't move past it yet.

Hi ISLMY,

I hope that your day is going well. I welcome you as other's already have to this awesome resource that we have going on here. Use it wisely to learn and grow.

I cited the above quote because it is semi- perplexing to me. If your W wishes to talk and is attempting to initiate talks, then by all means DO NOT try and shut the talking down because you have internal debates as to how useful to YOU the talks may be. It is NOT about you man. It is time for you to be quiet and listen to her.

Real quickly another piece of advice that I would offer up to you is that you take a big step back from some of these unorthodox strategies that you seem to have a tendency to engage in. I am specifically referring to lunch/coffee "dates" with females. While the word date might seem strong for me to be calling such an encounter, I think that I am seeing it the way that your W is seeing it. That is all that matters after all is said and done. She has and will see any such encounter between you and a member of the opposite sex as being a date.. Very clearly it is WRONG and innapropriate for a man who professes to be in love with his W and wants to see his M be restored to be carrying on in ways that could in any way be perceived as being ready to exchange her for some one else.

I think I may have seen you remark about understanding what it means to detach. Lemme just say that if you think that you have an understanding of what detachment means, more than likely you don't. When talking about this subject, my mind tends to conjure up cinematic images of young "green" 10th degree black-belt wanna be's who make a retreat to some far off Far East remote location for mind and body grueling training. Do you get the image in your mind?

For you to claim that you have even an inkling of what it means to detach would be like the young "green" martial arts trainee to try and tell the "Master" that he is now ready to get moving on with some more advanced stuff.

In a few words, Be patient my fellow DB'er ..be very patient.


You now can say that you have experienced some 2X4's on here courtesy of me and FIB.

Just remember we 'swing the lumber' with love and only love.

I hope a little of what I said made some sense. Take it slow buddythat way your mistakes, which there will surely be many, will not be so advanced.

I will say a prayer for the three of you.

Ted

[Coach]

I feel that it is not, because we keep talking about the same stuff and she can't move past it yet.

You want her to vent on you. She is angry (a good thing) and needs to get it out. As her husband your wife needs to know that she can challenge you emotionally and you won't react poorly. Get a spew raincoat and let her vent. Your job is to listen, validate her feelings and don't try to fix it. She can't move past it because of you not her.
Next time she starts bringing up the past try this: look in her eyes, listen to her emotions and validate how she feels ("I understand why you would feel ___________ about _________.") If she gets angry just remember that I told you that it was good that she spews on you. When she finishes talking ask her, "Is there anything else you want to tell me?" then when it's over ask, "How can I help you?"

This needs to be sincere and heartfelt or it will backfire. You can handle it.

Cheers

[istillluvmywife]

Thanks Coach, Ted and FIB,

Your words and encouragement help. I know that I have a long road ahead and will take your suggestions to heart.

[faithisbelieving]

Just remember we 'swing the lumber' with love and only love.

DB softly and carry a big stick.

FIB

[dburt]

Agree with all above, that band was a missed opportunity. Should have been, hey got a babysitter for Saturday night, get your dancing shoes on, Im gonna cut a rug.

If it ended up being cheesy, tell her, hey lets blow this joint, gonna go somewhere else. Be the leader, be fun, be exciting.

Burt

[futureunknown]

I think your situation is much better than many others here. Reminds me of how my W and I were about two years ago. If I had known what to do then, I probably could have avoided the brutal events since.

I'd say if she wants to talk about the past, listen and validate. Don't comment much, and definitely don't argue. As she works through her anger, she'll be more open to hearing about your hurt.

It's taken almost a year of separation, but my W is only now expressing regret to me about her part in our marital problems. Previously it was all my fault.

[istillluvmywife]

Been a while since I last posted something, things have not changed much, W still treats me like a roommate.

We ended up going out last Saturday night, we went with another couple and had a good time. We did go to see the band and W enjoyed herself.

I have been giving her space by GAL. But I can tell that she is still mad and not ready to move on. How long can this last?

I have been reading many different people sitch and in many threads Sandy2 has appeared and given the following advise.

"Even if a W complains that her H doesn't give her the attention she always wanted, by the time she reaches that "walk away" point...the attention game will no longer work with her. A WAW is totally "turned off" about everything regarding her H and she doesn't want him around her or him paying any of his attention to her. She feels it is all too late for him to be doing that now. He should have done it when she was craving it (in her opinion).

So, what does a LBH do when he sees he has a W who is no longer attracted to him and is close to walking away from the M? He works to become the man who attracted her before the M. What were you like then? What did she find attractive about you when she first met you?"

My problem here is that what I did back then was steal her away from a boyfriend that wasn't paying attention to her by paying attention to her and doing the things she wanted him to do.

So how do I become the guy she fell for back then without paying attention to her?

[faithisbelieving]

But I can tell that she is still mad and not ready to move on. How long can this last?

For some, a LONG TIME....years even.

So, what does a LBH do when he sees he has a W who is no longer attracted to him and is close to walking away from the M?

Get to work:

1. Hold Onto Your N.U.T.S
2. No More Mr. Nice Guy
3. go to making her happy dot com and sign up for the newsletter and buy the pdf

FIB

[istillluvmywife]

My wife started another R talk yesterday. She says that she is sorry for hurting me and can see why we got where we are today because she hurt me, I withdrew and hurt her, and the loop continued until today where I no longer show her love and she no longer loves me and is angry and hurt.

So, I asked what do we do? She says "I don't know, I am no longer attracted to you. Let's start by trying to be friends and see where it goes."

So what do I do, start dating my wife again, or do I continue to GAL and give her space until she starts to come close again.