The more I look at my situation and listen to feedback the more I'm moving toward pulling out for W's sake. The evidence seems to point at an irreconcilable situation given the mistakes I've made.
It's a little sad because no one here really knows the whole situation. I've gone out of my way to make sure I represent her in the best possible light. Anyway, I made the biggest mistake so I own the whole ball of wax. I need to just suck it up and take responsibility for that.
Maybe my moral compass is off or I have a character flaw but it just seems that I am never worthy of forgiveness.
Stop thinking in absolutes. Google Martin Seligman and "Learned Optimism."
Change your thinking and you will change how you feel. Change how you feel and you can take productive and healthy action.
You can handle it.
Cheers Coach
M22,H45,W45 S21/18D12 Retain faith that you will prevail in the end, regardless of the difficulties and at the same time confront the most brutal facts of your current reality, whatever they might be.
I would ignore it because I have found in my life and observing thousands upon thousands of these things, that ignoring it is what works the best. I am all for what works and totally against what doesn't......
What would I expect the outcome to be?
My attitude is.....
"They ALL come back" grin
"Women are a dime a dozen.. I always have a dime in my pocket"...
"HMMM,,,, Maybe this IS for the best... Now I can watch sports, have my hobbies, be clean or be a slob, go out when I want, stay home when I want, see who I want, not see who I don't want, play golf when I want.. ETC ETC ETC...."
YOUR attitude is... "she is the only thing I want and the only thing I can think about"
No wonder you are depressed thinking like that... Who wouldn't be?
Go get a life and have some FUN... Go out and mingle... Find some fun hobbies. Quit moping.....
What more can I tell you? This isn't rocket science. Do what works.
Let her go. If she wants the divorce.. SO BE IT.. Shrug your shoulders (so to speak) and admit that you may have blown it, let her go and move on down the highway...
FIND SOMEONE ELSE.....
I find it fascinating that you don't see what happened when SHE let go.
YOU CAME BACK...
You aren't going to know UNTIL you let go..
Letting go IS a choice...
Funny thing is that once you let go, you really WON'T care and it is likely that she may come back then...
Check out AFWAW's thread... Pearl Harbor's thread... Joshua Robert's thread... Steve McQueen's thread....
Then go check out the threads of people who can't let go.... Notice and observe that the ones who DO NOT let go are the ones that are NOT having success...
The pattern is CLEAR. Follow reality.. Follow what works...
What works is to STOP trying and to shrug your shoulder and walk the other way...
Go watch the movie with Rob Lowe and Demi Moore... "About Last Night"
They fall in love.. move in together. He suddenly misses the single life and wants some space... She GIVES him the space and moves on with her life (secretly crying her eyes out)
He wakes up and wants her back. Tries desperately. She tells him again and again it is over. He keeps trying. She keeps rejecting him telling him it is too late...
He FINALLY realizes that she doesn't want him. He moves on and starts a business he had already been interested in... Leaves her alone...
Meanwhile, she is missing him still. Her BFF finally tells your to quit whining and crying about him and make an effort....
The last scene is when she COMES to him... when he was playing softball. She goes by on her bicycle..... She stops.. Walks over..
They talk...
The end of the movie they have set up a date to meet again..
As they both walk away from each other....you can feel that they ARE going to get back together...
It WAS the time apart. The time of leaving each other ALONE to their thoughts is what brought them back together...
Let her go RSF.. She told you she wants to proceed with the divorce. By fighting against it you are showing more of the same selfishness that got you here..
"don't get a divorce, give me what I want. Not what you want. I don't want a divorce, I don't want you to see the other man, I don't this....""""
SELFISH.. Give her what SHE wants.
In the over 3 years that I've been here, this is one of the best hardass reality posts that I have read.
Kudos GL.
Bottom line...the one's that win back their wives do so by letting go, grieving the loss, focusing on their lives and having fun again.
The ones that focus on fixing it and continue with the 'I can't live without her' mentality ultimately lose.
FIB
Me 55; XW 47; 2 kids (S13, D11) Bomb 05/19/06 Original thread http://tinyurl.com/yg2ou2t Last anniversary 04/25/10, Divorced 5/12/10 Status: Loving father of 2 beautiful children;
RSF- You know that your marriage devolved due to both of your actions. You know that you aren't responsible for all of this. You know that you tried to take the bulk of your time apart to work on yourself and get your head straight. You also know that she chose to lean on another man to give her a sense of stability. I doubt this will pay off for her.
Everyone deserves forgiveness including you. You both do.
I think your mistake is that you make this all about you and her forgiving you. This is now about her trying to choose a path for herself that she thinks will bring her fulfillment. That's all. She could forgive you and stay with him. She could go back to you and never truly forgive you. There are so many possibilities.
Nothing points to this being an irreconcilable situation. Evidence points to this being a tricky situation that will take time.
If I were you I would work on forgiving her and yourself. Where is the tension and anger coming from if you blame yourself? Why wouldn't you say fair is fair and throw in the towel amicably? No. I think you are pissed that she isn't owning her part, that she seems to be punishing you and your kids for what you believe is forgivable and your M is salvageable.
Look at my sitch. Look at the fear and vulnerability and torment I go through when H comes closer...
Someone made a reference on another thread as to how you get a cat to come sit on your lap...a tentative cat. It takes a little time.
I think you want some stamp of ultimate objective consensus that it is over. No one can do that, not even a judge. It is irreconcilable if you say it is.
I think you should focus on a) diffusing your anger and forgiving her and yourself and b) the logistics of your side of the D
A couple of things stick out when I think back on my conversation with W two nights ago. You all recall that I told her I couldn't stay married to someone who was in a relationship with OM. I told her we needed to move forward with D which she has brought up / threaten with a few times recently (before I get called out for using t he term threatened, I use that term because she has not followed through yet) I told her we needed to get the Realtor going to sell the house, think about property, etc. She was taken aback as if she didn't expect any of that. Later in the conversation when I brought up our agreement that she would not push for with D if I would stop hassling her about OM she launched into complete denial that the agreement was ever in place. It was weird. We had a very specific and heartfelt conversation about it and agreed. After my surprise and a few rounds of debate I kind of called her and said something like, so what did you actually think we were doing? She sat quiet and then said she didn't know. I don't get it and I'm afraid to talk to her about anything at this point.
AKA: "Ben the school teacher" --- Me:45, W:41 | Ds:10,12&14 | M:18, T:20 Me: MLC+PA+WAS+Separated 10/08 My Request to Reconcile Denied 7/09 W w/OM 6/09-11/09
RSF….is this really what you want? You seem to think there are supposed to be immediate answers right now. Why can’t you just sit still and do nothing? Why do you have to be doing something? I was the same way….and I can’t tell you why. But sitting still, doing very little, saying even less has been so refreshing. Sit still.
Stronger...agree. My frank_d once said to me, "Just be."
Stop trying to figure things out and....just be. Live. Drop this. Stop trying to fix this.
FIB
Me 55; XW 47; 2 kids (S13, D11) Bomb 05/19/06 Original thread http://tinyurl.com/yg2ou2t Last anniversary 04/25/10, Divorced 5/12/10 Status: Loving father of 2 beautiful children;
RSF….is this really what you want? You seem to think there are supposed to be immediate answers right now. Why can’t you just sit still and do nothing? Why do you have to be doing something? I was the same way….and I can’t tell you why. But sitting still, doing very little, saying even less has been so refreshing. Sit still.
Stronger, I want to do this. I really do. I just can't seem to make it work in practice. If I were taking care of her or just observing at/from a distance I'd be OK with that. I guess it's the OM that I just can't seem to get past.
I just sent her this email. I have a feeling it heads in the oppoosite direction you are suggesting:
W,
You asked for some specificity after our talk the other night. I don’t have much time right now but wanted to share one of the things that I think is really hurting us. Basically we’re not having any good healthy conversations. I feel that you are deliberately avoiding me. What I’m getting from you is the “talk to the hand” response. You mentioned that you felt I wasn’t hearing you/getting it when we were having conversations and you were consequently afraid to do or say anything for fear of sending the wrong message. I’m sorry you’re feeling that way. That has to be a crappy feeling. I honestly don’t recall us having any healthy conversations (started with a purpose and ended with some resolution) that we could point back to and say one way or the other that I was hearing you or you me.
-rsf
Maybe if she just told me exactly where she is I could be OK with that? Maybe she already has?
She has said that my coming back has opened up new hurt. I think she has said that she doesn't want to talk about or deal with reconciliation. She has clearly said several times that the marriage is over in her mind and that hasn't changed.
So what do I do. Sit and wait? Am I trying to find logic and order where there is none?
Would it be wrong of me right now to just ask her instead if she minds telling me what she needs from me right now?
AKA: "Ben the school teacher" --- Me:45, W:41 | Ds:10,12&14 | M:18, T:20 Me: MLC+PA+WAS+Separated 10/08 My Request to Reconcile Denied 7/09 W w/OM 6/09-11/09
For most people the only way to stop thinking or obsessing on one thing is to focus on another. I doubt you will be able to "just be" unless you can divert your energy.
Like I said, I think you are suffering because you are running on two tracks but don't want to. You insist you need it over but you still want to make it make sense and you argue with her and you want resolution. If you could accept the reality of what you are experiencing both emotionally and logistically, you could have some peace. Again, you want to pound your fist and be "done" but you are still so in it.
How can you slow down? Be more still. Start by always waiting to respond to any call, email or text. Get out of the briar patch. I think you want the contact with her even if it is to argue.
You also tend to kind of ignore a lot of good advice on here. Obviously, you can take what works for you and leave the rest, but what do you think of the messages you are getting here? Is it starting to make sense? Accepting, giving up control, while still taking care of yourself...etc. Anything resonating?
You also tend to kind of ignore a lot of good advice on here. Obviously, you can take what works for you and leave the rest, but what do you think of the messages you are getting here? Is it starting to make sense? Accepting, giving up control, while still taking care of yourself...etc. Anything resonating?
hmmmm...let me think about that.It's definitely not my intent.
Can't feel too good to give advice if the recipient ignores it. Sigh.
AKA: "Ben the school teacher" --- Me:45, W:41 | Ds:10,12&14 | M:18, T:20 Me: MLC+PA+WAS+Separated 10/08 My Request to Reconcile Denied 7/09 W w/OM 6/09-11/09
Maybe if she just told me exactly where she is I could be OK with that?
How much clearer can this be made for you?? She is struggling. She doesn't know exactly where she's at. She just knows that she associates pain with you. She is not on some perch masterminding. I'm projecting here but I think if you can empathize with my sitch, you can get a glimpse into what she is experiencing.
Why is this not registering for you?
And, you keep pushing...
If D is what you want, then cut off all contact and do it. Stop trying to force her to reveal what she a) probably doesn't even know b) doesn't feel safe sharing with you
You are giving her very little choice with this tactic.
