Tricked into seperation

[BeginningAgain]

In other news, her FIL e-mailed me to let me know that he misspoke on the phone when he said it would be okay to visit the kids, even though I can't stay in their house. He told me it was only okay if I gave them plenty of advance notice and asked for permission.

I'm hoping a lawyer can use some of this. They've basically kidnapped my kids and are holding them for ransom. Sunday felt like those scenes in the movies where the kidnappers let the parents talk to the kids for a few moments, just to string them along.

Who the heck does this FIL think he is??? Since WHEN does a Father need to ask for PERMISSION to see his kids. If I was you I would move heaven and earth to make some type of arrangment which allows you to relocate closer to where your kids are. I think your in-laws will use your being in another state as abandonment of your kids. They obviously don't give a rat's a** about you and would love to just see you permanently out of the picture. I see nothing but bad things happening if you don't somehow get in the game down there. Best of luck to you.

S4H

[lonelywolf]

Well, I'm comitted to Alaska till December, but not past then. If I can save up enough, I will relocate to AZ and find whatever job I can. Until then, I plan to apply for every job down there I can.

But we'll have to see. I talk with the lawyers on Monday. Not that I can afford to, but oh, well. At this point, I have to.

[BeginningAgain]

I talk with the lawyers on Monday. Not that I can afford to, but oh, well. At this point, I have to.

Actually you can't afford NOT to talk to a lawyer. You need some very good legal advice in this situation and some recommendations as to what you can do now to slow this runaway train down.

S4H

[Lostforwords]

Wolf,
I agree completely with Searching...your story is getting out of hand quickly. At this point, there is no legal document controlling your visitations with YOUR children. Nobody has a say in when you can see your children other than the court system. Definitely this ask for permission stuff is BS. They are threatening you and using your children as the pawns...really nasty. I hate to be negative, but it looks like you have a war on your hands.

[lonelywolf]

Well, I went out last night with two of my sisters to a community contra dance. I didn't want to go at first (I used to go them with my wife), but I'm glad I did. It was quite fun.

I get to call the kids tonight. Hopefully it will go well. I won't talk to the parents, if it can be helped.

I talk to my lawyer on Monday. We'll she what she says about all this.

[BeginningAgain]

Wolf,

How did the phone call go? Did you get to talk to your children? Good luck with the lawyer meeting today.

S4H

[lonelywolf]

My daughter (true to form) doesn't talk much on the phone, but my oldest son talked to me for about 45 minutes, until mommy told him to end the phone call (I also learned from him that he's not allowed to talk about mommy or her parents on the phone with me). He wanted to keep talking, but I guess it was bedtime or whatever.

The lawyer told me some interesting things, including that technically, while my wife can file after 90 days, it takes 6 months before the courts in AZ have jurisdiction over the kids - as of this point, Texas still has jurisdiction over any custody disputes.

The lawyer recommended filing for court appointed Mediation to work out the issues with access to the kids now. It will take a couple of weeks to work, but then the court will basically order her to talk to me on the phone (in the presence of a mediator) to work out parental custody. If she has actually filed, we are required to do this, but either one of us can request it at any time. So, I'm going to do that for now and then just wait and see if any papers show up.

[lonelywolf]

Got the package from the court today. I have to watch a two hour video and read some materials, then take a test before the court will order the mediation/conciliation.

It's rather depressing. Since AZ is a no-fault divorce state, the materials are 90% focused on getting the left behind spouse to accept that the marriage is over and its time to move on. Of course, most of the time, in AZ, couples have entered this because once divorce has been filed for, the couples have to have mediation counseling. I've requested it before anything has been filed.

Once I've "taken the course" they'll issue me a certificate, saying I've taken the class, and then my wife will be required to spend one hour on the phone with me and a marriage counselor to see if the marriage can be saved at all, and if not, to work out a reasonable compromise on child custody until the courts make a ruling.

I'm not sure what I should say once the session itself takes place. The lawyer I talked to says that, if the divorce goes to trial over things like child custody and spousal maintenance, it could take several months (perhaps even a year) for the divorce to be finalized. That's actually good news, sort of. It may bankrupt me, but it will give my wife time to get her head on straight.

My mother says my best chance is to give my wife time to start missing me. So far, my mother has been right on everything - and every mistake I've made has been ignoring my mother's advice.

When I get paid again, I may just set some money aside for a DB counseling session.

[LolaL]

LW: I think it is truly sad that the courts are so willing to render divorce these days w/o making the couple attempt to work out their differences. If a legal contract is broken, one that is just business, thre are serious repercussions. But if a marital contract is broken, the courts generally just chalk it up to another loss.

I think it is especially hard when their are children involved. I understand that not all marriages work...I was in one of them before I met stbx. But my XH and I did counseling. We tried very hard to resolve the issues, and so when it came time for us to finally chalk it up, we could knowing we had tried. And now, we have a healthy well adjusted D13 because she knows we love her, and that although we are not together, we still work together for her benefit.

Regardless, I think that some kind of marital counseling should be mandatory before a divorce is granted. ESPECIALLY when there are children, and it needs to be more than one hour.

And I think your mother is right. Your W does need to miss you, but you need to let her too . Sometimes that can take a long time, but in the meantime life is short. Enjoy yourself. This does not mean you need to date or anything like that, but go golfing, have dinner and drinks with friends, catch a movie. Spend your time doing things you enjoy.

[lonelywolf]

Just finished the "materials" for the divorce class.

I'm almost regretting this decision. I need it so I can work out access to the children, but the course is so focused on "get over it, your spouse has moved on" and defines "abuse" so broadly that merely getting angry is considered abuse, so it will justify my wife's decision in her mind.

I admit to being angry too much, but it was never abusive, physically or emotional - and she got angry just as much and at the same levels I did. In the DR book, it talks about how its pretty much impossible to avoid anger in any marriage. Getting angry will happen. In the anger management course I took, it discussed that anger is normal, and declaring any and all anger bad is counter productive. It's how you deal with and react to that anger that's the key. I admit I needed better tools to deal with my anger, but this DVD course I just took basically said any time you get angry with the spouse is abuse. Since my wife has convinced herself she never has been angry with me, and I was a raging beast running around all the time yelling at the top of my lungs, this course may just convince her she's right after all.

But, as I said, since it's a no-fault divorce state, the materials apparently won't tell parents its best to stay together.

I don't know. It may help, or not. I don't know anymore. I sent off a brief request for pictures of the kids from her. No response.