My Intro: Thanks for Reading!

[aliveandkicking]

I just need to get the right boundaries set up and get comfortable with things.

It is a process. Don't expect to be comfortable, but I know what you mean.

[RedSoxFan]

Option #2 is the way forward. I just need to get the right boundaries set up and get comfortable with things.

Actually, the boundaries may be fine. Maybe I'm just fussing at boundaries and feeling humiliated as a cover for my issues with not being in control.

BTW. I have pushed back on the control thing a lot and I figured out why in session with PC this a.m. Its because I don't feel mean or like I'm intentionally trying to dominate or control other people. I've always thought of controlling people as being intentionally so with ill intent. I'm not that at all.

[aliveandkicking]

Actually, the boundaries may be fine.

Do you have a financial agreement that you would settle for in the case of D? Just curious.

[RedSoxFan]

Do you have a financial agreement that you would settle for in the case of D? Just curious.

Definitively NO. Original agreement was crafted when I wanted out. It preserves the family in our house with me subsidizing way over what state would order me to pay in a situation where W has custody. If D is the route we go I would not be willing to settle for anything less than 50% custody. I am blessed with a respectable income but W's is not bad either. 50/50 custody would leave her with little subsidy and cause her to move. Actually, if she maintained custody and I paid state ordered child support she would still have to move. She has maintained that she doesn't wish to stay in house anyway. I would envision a scenario where I end up subsidizing until house is sold which may take some time. Also, mortgage is very close to being underwater so there may be a small loss.

[aliveandkicking]

I think you should consider what kind of custody and financial arrangement works for you. The timing is your call, of course but the reality of D can only be avoided for so long IMO.

[RedSoxFan]

I know exactly what I want...mostly outlined above. 50/50 custody and state mandated child support to account for income inequality. I will probably have little choice but to continue subsidizing until the house is sold. W has clearly stated that she does not agree to 50/50 custody so there may well be a battle.

What I haven't defined is timing. How long do I go on in current sitch, etc. Once we move into the financial and custody discussions I expect things to degrade rapidly. I hope I'm wrong but I'm not counting on it. Either way, I don't want to go there but living in denial without planning is not an option. I will really feel like a bad guy if/when I have to move in the D direction.

[aliveandkicking]

I will really feel like a bad guy if/when I have to move in the D direction.

Well, me too. And I never left H or cheated on him. It sucks but you've got to be in the here and now.

If you can handle the finances and the custody as is, than give it time. Only you can decide what is reasonable for you.

Personally, I see the way H is living and I feel humiliated. I stand to lose a lot financially if we get into it (I am dependent) but my sanity has some value too. I just don't want to be motivated by ego either...

There is no utopian solution and discomfort comes with the territory. It is a matter of which discomfort you can live with.

[RedSoxFan]

I never did get around to following up on how this went.

[...]

W: I'm OK with them going. I like them to have fun and that family seemed nice. They seemed excited. We can do something tonight and then the race in the morning. It's up to you.

Me: Well you know what my preference is I'll RSVP that we'll attend.

W: What time on Saturday

Me: Party starts at 8. You are really an awesome Mom.

Follow-up text an hour or so later:

W: Do you plan to keep them for the night or bring them home?

I didn't answer the last text right away, she then followed up with another one later in the evening that was a bit nasty. It said something to the effect of I really don't care, I just need to know for planning purposes. Later that evening I responded saying I was sorry for missing her texts, let her know I was at a festival, had left my phone in the car, thought her text wasn't nice, it was up to her about the kids staying the night, and again thanked her for being a great Mom and thinking of them. Next morning She responded saying NP and that the issue was a Sunday event and she had moved it out to the afternoon so it wouldn't matter either way if the kids stayed.

Later in the day on Saturday she texted again saying she needed to know if they were staying or not. I text back that I thought we had already covered it. She kept asking me but then saying she really didn't care one way or the other. I told her that she should just decide which one she wanted. She texted again saying she might find something to do if they were staying but she didn't know. I texted back and said no big. Just decide or you can let us know if you do find something and I'll take them home with me. I think she said something about the kids needing to pack and needing to know where they're going to sleep. I reminded her that they have everything they need at my place. I told her at this point the conversation is making me very uncomfortable.

Finally I called and got her on the phone. I said look just tell me whats going on. She said I'm having a bad day and I don't want the kids to see me crying when they come home. She said I feel like getting shi*t faced. I told her that wasn't the answer, that she'd feel worse tomorrow and offered her to come along with us. She declined of course. Somewhere in there she said something about needing to stand on her own two feet, or stand on her own, or something. I texted her later in the evening to see if she was OK. She asked me to stop worrying about her. I responded that I wasn't worrying I was just being there for her as any friend would be and that I'd leave her be. She said thanks. I ended up dropping 2 kids off and taking one home with me. She was in bed watching TV when we arrived at her place just after midnight. She came down to greet us. I left. Dropped daughter off next morning, was cordial, left quickly and haven't spoken to her since.

[Coach]

Later in the day on Saturday she texted again saying she needed to know if they were staying or not. I text back that I thought we had already covered it. She kept asking me but then saying she really didn't care one way or the other.

She wanted you to make a decision. She tested you.

How do you try to control people?

[faithisbelieving]

Hi RSF...I just read your intro link today and I commend your courage in presenting how life went off course.

1) Actively engage with W in pursuit of agreement to reconcile.
2) Minimize engagement, focus on me, allow things to play out.
3) Disengage with W, go after divorce full force.

I was not successful in staying out of divorce court so I will not present myself as having all the answers. I can give you some thoughts, but, as a man, you already know that the decision is totally yours as to how to direct your marriage.

Recall the time that you were out of your wife's life and your feelings about reconciling with her. Now...put her in that place.

Scratch number one. It is pursuit. Not only that, does it allow your wife to see you as someone who knows himself? You have to be careful about straddling the fence...hanging between the "I love you, I want to reconcile and you can walk all over me until you do" property and the other side which is the "I love you but I have boundaries and a marriage is 2 not 3".

My only real piece of advice is don't become an enabler.

My close friend from childhood recently went through a nasty divorce. Suffice it say that his XW went into MLC and bee lined for an old HS BF, wanted to keep the status quo except "pluck me out and simply replace me with Darren (from the TV show Bewitched)." Of course, 3 years later that relationship is dead and over. They remain divorced. Similarly, this R of hers may burn out, but, after how long?

What I am saying is what you already know: pursuit and enabling is doomed to failure. You need to find a pathway that does not permit affairs, does not enable them, draws lines and allows your wife to realize that she could lose you forever...ALL THE TIME allowing the door to stay open.

Michele does NOT condone affairs NOR does she counsel anyone to hang out and wait. She counsels an LRT or last resort technique. Frequently, that is not purveyed here in our forum. Fear is a powerful thing. Hope for reconciliation can be a form of denial. Dr. Gray of Venus and Mars fame says in one of his books that one can never truly reconcile unless the old R/M is destroyed/terminated/ended and then rebuilt from the ground up.

RSF...what do you want? How do you see your life as a man and husband in this played out? Is hanging on and pursuing...or just waiting around....better than grieving it and letting go or even filing?

Sometimes a long walk on the beach with a beat up pair of sweat pants and your oldest worn out sneakers can help.

Supporting you.
FIB