My sitch...long but please indulge me

[billclay18]

RSF,

Let me make sure I'm understanding you correctly. If my step D's happen to tell my W they talked to me and I sounded great, happy, etc. that's the impression my W will have of me. If that's what you're saying than my exchanges with step D's have been beneficial.

Here's a question for all of you then...if my W gets the impression I'm doing well and I'm fine with all of this, why wouldn't she just say to herself "Since he's OK with this, let's just get it over with". It seems to me that would relieve any guilt she may be feeling and give her impetus to move forward with the D. Maybe this is where that counter-intuitive thinking comes in.

[RedSoxFan]

Here's a question for all of you then...if my W gets the impression I'm doing well and I'm fine with all of this, why wouldn't she just say to herself "Since he's OK with this, let's just get it over with". It seems to me that would relieve any guilt she may be feeling and give her impetus to move forward with the D. Maybe this is where that counter-intuitive thinking comes in.

I'm not qualified to give advice here but I can share what I've done to date while someone else is writing up the good advice. First, Ive made three things clear to W. 1) I've taken responsibility for and forgiven myself for the mistakes I've made in the past...there were a bunch. 2) I love her very much and I want to save our marriage and make our family whole. 3) Life is short, I love myself like never before and I'm going to move forward in my life making the most out of every minute.

Those three things are on the table with crystal clarity. She has brought up the D thing a few times but I've asked her to hold off for now. She has agreed under the condition that I stop hassling her about seeing OM (In my case I was originally WAS so she has legitimately moved on with her life. I've agreed to stop hassling her for now. It's a personal choice that might not be right for everyone). Even if she asked for D tomorrow that wouldn't necessarily change my approach or my hope for a positive outcome.

In my case W's situation is all about her and what she needs to heal. My hope is that she reaches a point like I did and wants to reconcile. My goal is to be happy, healthy and be the superstar she fell in love with. If I achieve that then everything will work out no matter what her outcome is.

Ha! I see that I avoided a direct answer to your question.

Seriously, I don't know what W is thinking but my impression is that she's experiencing many things as she observes me being happy. Resentment, jealousy, happiness for our kids and for me, I think she is attracted to it a bit. But ultimately her focus needs to be on her. I can't do that work. When it's done, I will be the best option out there

[Phoenixdeux]

Since he's OK with this, let's just get it over with". It seems to me that would relieve any guilt she may be feeling and give her impetus to move forward with the D.

Well, if that's all it took, you seeming to be okay with this for her to proceed with D, then I guess you didn't really have a chance anyway. Do you want her to not finish filling out the paperwork only because she would feel guilty because you are crushed by this? If guilt is the only thing keeping you from divorce, I'd say that it's better you relieve her of that.

Honestly, I believe that many times it doesn't matter what you do, you'll still end up divorced. She's already reached the point she thinks that's the better course. What you need to do is plant a seed of doubt in her mind. Is being pathetically crushed a seed of doubt or does it just make them pity you? Is being strong, confident, driven, and happy make them wonder what they might miss out on? That's the hope. If you try to shove it down her throat by contacting her to show it, she'll just doubt the sincerity of your changes. I truly believe the old saw that if you love something to let it go...if it comes back it's yours. You are letting her go. Now move forward with your life and see if she comes back. If she doesn't, I guess she wasn't your afterall.

[billclay18]

Very good points...all of them.

You are letting her go. Now move forward with your life and see if she comes back. If she doesn't, I guess she wasn't your afterall.

This is exactly what I am doing and there's a sense of peace that comes with letting go of what you can't control.

[billclay18]

Phx,

I just want to clarify something. My W has made a few comments over the past several weeks about hurting me, breaking my heart, expecting me to be mad at her when she leaves, etc...Each time I’ve assured her that I accept this (contacting a lawyer & filling out the D paperwork should have convinced her of that) and that I’m fine. It’s almost as if she doesn’t believe me or is “disappointed” I’m not crushed. Does that make any sense?

I agree with you…no point shoving it down her throat. She’s going to think and believe whatever she wants to. Worrying about it or trying to “convince” her otherwise is just a waste of time and energy.

Now it's time to just enjoy a long weekend with my daughter...my favorite person in the world !

[gucci loafer]

She’s going to think and believe whatever she wants to.

Don't fall for that nonsense...

She is going to think and believe what her FEELINGS lead her on. She will follow what her FEELINGS are telling her...

The key is for her feelings to change. If her feelings would change to not feeling like she could live without you, then she would be justifying why she WANTS to be with you and how it could work and why it would work.. etc. etc..

Her feelings are telling you she doesn't FEEL the right things for you. Thus she now believes the thoughts she is thinking because she doesn't feel the things you want her to feel...

That is why LETTING GO and agreeing with what she "thinks she wants" works the best.. Of course she has guilt. Her guilt now is "she doesn't want to hurt you". Her feelings are that she doesn't feel right about you.

When YOU let her go and agree with what she wants, here is what usually happens..

First a sense of relief.
Slowly she will test you to see if you really will let her go.
Once you convince her that you will, THEN her feelings change because her thoughts change...

Her guilt then starts saying things like this...
"Now that I have what I want, DO I really want THIS?
"Am I making a mistake?"
What if I change my mind and he doesn't want ME back?
"He did try, maybe I should have thought this out more."
"I thought this is what I wanted, but now I am not so sure"
"Why did I do this to him"

It is the same thing that happened to you when SHE let go and dropped the bomb.
Don't YOU remember the panic, the questioning, the sudden decision to make any and all changes to keep her. Why? Why was it only after she let go? (who cares why, just know that it works on all of us)

That won't and can't happen UNTIL you release her and let her go. It puts the relationship on the line, but I have seen this work very very well many many times. The man has to have the confidence and self esteem to believe that chasing won't work, doesn't work and can't work.

[RedSoxFan]

She’s going to think and believe whatever she wants to.

Don't fall for that nonsense...

She is going to think and believe what her FEELINGS lead her on. She will follow what her FEELINGS are telling her...

The key is for her feelings to change. If her feelings would change to not feeling like she could live without you, then she would be justifying why she WANTS to be with you and how it could work and why it would work.. etc. etc..

Her feelings are telling you she doesn't FEEL the right things for you. Thus she now believes the thoughts she is thinking because she doesn't feel the things you want her to feel...

That is why LETTING GO and agreeing with what she "thinks she wants" works the best.. Of course she has guilt. Her guilt now is "she doesn't want to hurt you". Her feelings are that she doesn't feel right about you.

When YOU let her go and agree with what she wants, here is what usually happens..

First a sense of relief.
Slowly she will test you to see if you really will let her go.
Once you convince her that you will, THEN her feelings change because her thoughts change...

Her guilt then starts saying things like this...
"Now that I have what I want, DO I really want THIS?
"Am I making a mistake?"
What if I change my mind and he doesn't want ME back?
"He did try, maybe I should have thought this out more."
"I thought this is what I wanted, but now I am not so sure"
"Why did I do this to him"

It is the same thing that happened to you when SHE let go and dropped the bomb.
Don't YOU remember the panic, the questioning, the sudden decision to make any and all changes to keep her. Why? Why was it only after she let go? (who cares why, just know that it works on all of us)

That won't and can't happen UNTIL you release her and let her go. It puts the relationship on the line, but I have seen this work very very well many many times. The man has to have the confidence and self esteem to believe that chasing won't work, doesn't work and can't work.

EXCELLENT POST!

Glad I wandered in to read it. Many of us need occasional reminders of the basic mechanics of all this. Thanks Gucci for what you do!!

[Phoenixdeux]

My W has made a few comments over the past several weeks about hurting me, breaking my heart, expecting me to be mad at her when she leaves, etc...Each time I’ve assured her that I accept this (contacting a lawyer & filling out the D paperwork should have convinced her of that) and that I’m fine. It’s almost as if she doesn’t believe me or is “disappointed” I’m not crushed. Does that make any sense?

Yes, it makes sense because I heard that same stuff. I'm not sure what it is...I think some WAWs leave still having feelings for the LBS, to some degree, and don't want to see them hurt. I also believe that there is a certain amount of disappointment that we are able to dust ourselves off and move forward, almost like, "well he couldn't have loved me too much if he's handling it THIS well." But the truth remains that we can't own how they choose to interpret our actions. We can't own any disappointment they may feel that we are moving on. To my eye you do the things that put you in position to be someone your wife chooses to come back to, while putting yourself in the position to have a fulfilling life without them should she continue on the present course.

[billclay18]

She is going to think and believe what her FEELINGS lead her on. She will follow what her FEELINGS are telling her...

That's what I meant to say...I realize feelings dictate what she thinks and believes, not the other way around.

Good advice and input from all. Letting go, enjoying my new found freedom and time with my two favorite people...my daughter and me!

[billclay18]

Here's something I'm still struggling with. Since my W already thought weeks ago I'd be mad when she left, doesn't NC on my part confirm that in her mind rather than seeing it as me letting her go? I'm not saying I want to contact her just to "show" her I'm not mad or that I'm letting her go, I'm just thinking out loud. I would think telling her I'm fine with all of this in our discussion before she left, helping her get ready to move and the fact that I've filled out the D paperwork would be a clear indication I'm letting go.

Doesn't matter whether she thinks I'm mad, hurt, brokenhearted, etc or simply letting go, she'll proceed with the D if that's what she really wants regardless. At this point, there is no reason for any contact unless one of us wants to get the ball rolling with the D...or unless things change on her end. Until then, NC is the way to go.