Dreams of a New Normal...

[aliveandkicking]

Arguing with someone, anyone is a sign of disrespect.
Something in you doesn't respect him and he argues with you because he doesn't respect you.

There is little to no arguing now. The post you quoted was about dealing with the boundaries of our home with his stuff still here even though he lives elsewhere.

I definitely lost respect for him when he was bragging constantly, obsessing about what others think of him, me, our marriage our kids, comparing me and us to other people, spending money recklessly when we were plunging into debt, being inattentive to what was happening in our home when he was here (making things more chaotic, being impulsive and juvenile)...

Knowing that my H was so immature and so fixated on celebrities and the fantasy life, really felt threatening to me. No excuses, I was tough but I felt that I had to be the one to TCB...I wrote at length about it on another thread...to you actually, I think it was ttrose's thread.

How do we fix this?

Who stops fighting first?

It is done. I do not fight with him anymore. Ever. And I absorbed a whole truckload of cr*p when he was leaving.

Question: if you could have your relationship with your husband and have a great marriage as opposed to it's current state, what would it look like?

Painful to even visualize as I have worked my a** off to detach and let him go. But I will try, when it feels do-able . First, I think context is important.

What would he be like if you could have him be a specific way? What good things would he do when it comes to you? What needs would he be fulfilling that aren't taken care of now? What would he want from you that he currently thinks you don't provide?

I know I'm coming in a little late on this thread so forgive me for asking some questions you've probably answered a million times already. Where are you guys at currently? How long has it been like this? Do you still love him? (remember love is a choice you make, attraction may be involuntary but love is a definite choice)

Yes, love is a choice. I do love him. I don't like him right now. I am not "in love" with him. Fortunately.

He left nine months ago (went to sleep at friends' houses and travelled a bunch until finally getting his own place (well,paid for by rich friend) about 2 months ago), tore into me as to how it was my fault. I took the hit. He left town, I lost a bunch of weight, started working out and though I was a frickin disaster inside, I looked good and appeared to be managing well. When he came back and saw me, he flipped out and was angry (oh now you x,y and z) which I now understand is because he had already crossed some threshold (OW perhaps).

Never since he left has he really left me alone. I have stayed out of his business. I have validated, apologized, analyzed, discussed, made myself vulnerable, went on dates with him, had sex with him. It is all documented somewhere on here but it was really awful because no matter what, he felt that his "destiny" was to leave etc. Any positive interaction was deemed negative after the fact because it didn't fit with his decision to leave, so my efforts were futile.

What he wanted was to feel like a "man" to be a big shot in the entertainment biz, to have a girlfriend who could go out with him every night (he doesn't remember telling me this)...he wants to be around important people with fame and money (which he has succeeded in doing)...but, we are broke and in debt.

In our M, I was neurotic, demeaning, critical, withheld sex (not intentionally, I had lost attraction and it was very frustrating and demoralizing for me as well) although, I still spiced it up on occasion and made efforts. Often I was visibly bored and unenthusiastic about sex. I felt objectified and used because our M was cr*p and the s*x became one of the only area he put any effort into.

He has body issues. I fell in love with him with extra weight on him but his self-loathing and lack of connection to his body really affected our sex life and his confidence. I felt I was f*cking a boy not a man.

Toward the end I could feel our M falling apart and I gained some weight and got depressed and was very much like the WAWs here. I looked fine but felt very insecure, especially with him bragging about other women coming on to him, other beautiful, successful, famous women...he says that was a "cry for help"...I felt like a piece of sh*t and started to fantasize about leaving.

But, divorce was totally terrifying to me, I'd almost have preferred death, having experienced both divorce as a child and the subsequent death of a parent, processing the divorce was harder...so, knowing my husband was checked out, I was depressed and I didn't have DB and instead of stepping up my game, I sunk deeper and felt helpless and told him I could see he was so miserable and I didn't know what to do so maybe we should separate. He said, "But you're cute and I love you"...and that was enough for me. I did try to be intimate to reach out to him. I am a very straight forward communicator. I could feel what was happening. I articulated to him what I wanted, a balance, for us to reconnect. That when he looked at me, he didn't see me, that when he touched me he didn't feel me that I loved him and wanted our family but felt I was in purgatory not knowing if I would be married from one day to the next.

If I had to simplify, basically, we were broke with two kids and an unglamorous life of our own creation. He blamed me and us for his lack of success (despite the fact that he is very accomplished and talented, the money has not been what he hoped for)...I was critical and interested in the "reality" of our situation and family life...

I was essentially competing with glamorous people who would a) feed his ego and b) had a lifestyle he wanted but couldn't afford.

I cannot provide a care-free, obligation free life with constant sex and adoration. That seems to be what he wants.

I might add that he was out all the time and I was about as cool a wife as I could be about it because he had left once before and that was a huge issue so I recognized that it was important to him and asked that he just be home a couple of nights a week for dinner (when he stuck to that, things were better).

H has blamed me in the past for just about everything some of it too absurd to even write here. He felt emasculated but as I explained in another post, he was so indecisive that I ended up TCB and I did not feel secure that he had the best interests of our family at heart.

What I could have/should have done in the M- lightened up, procured my own source of income so I wouldn't feel so unstable, cultivated my own interests, had sex more and probably gone into my own therapy to build my self-esteem. I wanted to be a full time mom because a) that is my #1 value and b) with H's crazy lifestyle, I felt it was imperative that my kids have at least one parent who is predictable, available, makes dinner, gets them to bed etc.

Ironically, when I did finally get a job things went down hill fast. I think it was actually threatening to him. I was not readily available to him as I had been from the moment we began dating 14 years ago.

To his credit, he tried to get me to come out with him but with no money for babysitters it was tough. Sadly, instead of busting my a** to try to foray more into his world, I pulled back, felt threatened by all of his "friends" and his preoccupation with them and their money and fabulousness. I was tired of hearing about the fantastic lives of all of these people and being compared to them.

I have clearly apologized for my part and I mean down to the specifics, I have changed so much. I look good, I go out, I have chilled out about the kids (providing utopia is obviously not gonna happen)...he knows from the sex we had that it is possible for us to have it often and good (but not in the cake-eating paradigm). I spent a good deal of time taking an interest in his work, listening like a lover, lauding his work, sharing little of my own life and focusing on him which he seemed to like. But, now he is stuck. He told everyone he knows who knows what to gain their approval and sympathy, he straight out lied to our mutual friend that I was pursuing him for sex and he had to turn me down (was the opposite), that I took my ring off (3 months after he did and had made it clear he was seeing other women), that I never supported him or took and interest in his work (I devoted my life to him and his work), that I called him fat and disgusting while having sex (did not happen)...so, now what? How the heck does he get out of that?

Now, what I want and always wanted was a balance. I wanted one night a week to take a class or do something for myself. He could not commit to that because of his social life which had to take priority (shmoozing), however, if he found a class or something he needed to commit to, he found a way. I wanted him to have dinner home a couple of nights a week. Now, I would want those things AND, I would want he and I to go out together at least twice a week (that's a lot for me but would be worth it).

But, he is still acting like a froot loop with the bragging and self-importance and pre-occupation with what others think...he seems very MLC, desperately trying to lose weight, honing his psychic abilities, glomming on to his rich friends as if they were his family, posting pictures of himself with models on his FB page, new clothes, new image, very poser-like (IYKWIM)...I don't know how I could manage living with all of that insecurity.

What I did propose was that we stay separated and be in the present and look at each other through a new lens. That as long as he insists that any time with me is negative and antithetical to his achieving his destiny, I am not interested. I do not want to discuss his life or other women etc.

When I left town recently, he basically text stalked me..."I hope this guy treated you better than I did"...etc. He tried to bribe me to tell him where I was going by offering to tell me what famous actress came on to him one night I didn't go out with him before he left...twisted.

He is by a couple of therapists accounts likely a clinical narcissist which means that his attention toward me has little or nothing to do with love and everything to do with his ego. I think he would need some serious help to make this work together or even in his own life.

But, I try to just see him as a person because I am not a therapist.

Anyway, that's a start.