LFH, I just wanted to say congrats on having your wife agree to Retro! I've been praying that my H will go as last resort too (we've been separated for several months). That is a wonderful step to at least experience this and give the rest up to God. I only hope I have the chance to go through this too. My prayers are with you.
I also wanted to say that I can absolutely relate to the detaching and un-detaching feeling.. past couple wks i'd been feeling so much better/stronger/more confident (like i'll be OK either way), and then past day or two i've felt so lonely and sad again (not detached). It is all normal. I try to think of H and I as mere specks in this big, wide universe and that helps me detach a bit...and just stay busy and think of all of the good in this world, too.
I was just sitting here in my cubicle at work (and crying) when I just came across your reply. Thank you from the bottom of my heart...your response touched me.
I truly hope Retrovaille is the missing ingredient in my situation. It doesn't really matter why my W agreed to this function, just the fact she's willing to go. Are you aware of the success rate at Retrovaille? I beleive this is going to be our last resort.
I can relate to your lonely and sad feelings. I cried so much the past two days that I went dry! Guys shouldn't be capable of this. I truly want to save my marriage. We have so much at stake with the kids and all.
Please keep praying for me and I'll do the same for you! I'll give you information about a prayer book my friend is going to purchase for me today. It will make things easier on a day-to-day basis.
Hugs right back to you, LFH
ME: 38 W: 35 D2.5 and S5 Married 12 years Separated (same house, different rooms) INILWYAM by W: 4/16/2009 The day W requested a D: 4/17/2009
I can't help but think that it is a good thing that you have been given this extra time! Even if she isn't a truck load of positive right now....who's to say she won't be by the time you come back from the retreat?
I love to spend hours in the Christian book store! I am not too much into prayer books b/c I like to word my own prayers, but if you can gain insight and they give you peace, then I hope you will get it. There are so many wonderful books in the Christian book store. Gary Smally has dozens! But, don't expect your W to read any of them....b/c you've done been down that road, right? She may not be into reading books anyway, but the idea that it was along those subject areas is why she probably wouldn't finish it. I used to beg my H to do certain things I liked (especially to read something) and do it for my sake--if nothing else. He wouldn't. It hurt my feelings so badly and I couldn't understand b/c he was a good hearted person....but that is one of those strange things about other people!
LFH, if you do the best you can and trust God to take care of "you", then you can count on that happening. Whatever life throws at you....God will take care of you if you trust Him.
Remember that your nerves are raw and so is your W's. Both of you are leary of being hurt. Each of you will be watching the other one at every little move. I think the best thing you could do is totally RELAX! Your wife knows you better than anyone on earth and she can read you very well. When I was a WAW, I saw my H's attitude behind his words and actions. I knew when he was feeling hope and I didn't "want" him to feel hope. Can you understand what I'm saying? I am not trying to see how far down I can pull you, but you wanted instructions, so I'm trying to help.
If you can have a relaxed mental attitude then things will run a lot smoother. She will not think you are forcing a mood or reaction or anything else she's not ready to give. Try to keep the atmoshere light and watch funny movies instead of romantic or sad ones. You can't control every minute or every detail, but do what you can to make the most of things. Don't get nervous if there is a quite minute or two....you don't have to fill every second with words or an activity.
Avoid R talks before the retreat! I think the more you can have fun together with the children, the better things will be. B/c when a family is playing together, then laughter will come and anger will usually leave. Remember, just don't force it.
Your W may feel ill at ease with just the two of you alone, so be prepared with some funny movie to watch or a book you can read if she acts like she had rather be alone. Don't get your feelings hurt if she acts as if she wants to be alone b/c you were blessed with this extra time
I don't think this would be the time to try to put some new boundary in place (or anything along those lines).
One more thing......is her LL giving/recieving gifts? I'll bet that is why she bought those tickets for you. We usually give the LL we desire ourselves. You were disappointed and it didn't mean near as much to you b/c that was not your LL.....but is it hers? If her LL is all about gifts, then maybe you should think about that. Let me know.
It will be hard not to pursue during this time. Even I was thinking of things to do in your stitch and had to go back and delete what I wrote b/c I realized it would be pursuing. I have to remember how I felt when I was a WAW. Just know that if she still has love for you, that is a lot to hope for.
Talk to you later.
It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
The book my friend gave me is a devotional entitled "GOD CALLING." I also received the book called "THE LOVE DARE." My female friend suggests I use the Love Dare over the next 7 weeks on my W leading upto to Retrovaille. I hope it doesn't come across as pursuing, but I think my W needs to know that I'm not giving up. I need to be the strong one now until my W can build enough strength on her own.
-LFH
ME: 38 W: 35 D2.5 and S5 Married 12 years Separated (same house, different rooms) INILWYAM by W: 4/16/2009 The day W requested a D: 4/17/2009
My female friend suggests I use the Love Dare over the next 7 weeks on my W leading upto to Retrovaille. I hope it doesn't come across as pursuing, but I think my W needs to know that I'm not giving up.
BE....VERY....CAREFUL. I haven't read The Love Dare, but I have read about concerns on this BB about it coming off as pursuit.
Do you honestly think your W does not know you are fighting for the M?
I see your point. It's just that my W believes I shot down her attempts at working things out. She believes that I believe nothing she does is good enough. This is simply not true. Like Sandi said, my W wasn't speaking my love language. I was very thankful for my football tickets... it was a very nice gesture; however, it was not what I needed from her at the time. I needed her to show me that she wanted to be with me, and just not the kids. This was the reason I hit my limit a while back and stated to her that I was ready for a divorce.
Since my W "opened herself up", is it simply my turn to do the heavy lifting and "open myself" to her and demonstrate to her that relationship-fixing is going to have its ups and downs...and not to give up? Show her that true love is kind and patient? Knowing her the way I do, this anger wave that she's going through will subside.
Again, my mistake for not getting past my needs and hurt at the time. I wonder if I should write her a letter acknowledging her efforts...again this would me construed as pursuing. I need to somehow demonstrate to her that she does an excellent job on many of the things she does. I wonder if she needs validation from me.
Oh, and another interesting thing happened yesterday. My W bought an airline ticket for my daughter so she can join me and my son on our football trip. She said that she's only trying to be nice...that my mother would enjoy spending extra time with my daughter while we're at the football game.
Is this just her love language of "act of service" coming through again? What gives?
Also yesterday, my W brought from her car an apartment map for apartments near her work. She said, "here you go daughter...here's your map"...as my W was looking at me. Is she trying to get a reaction from me? My daughter left it laying on the family room floor...I completely ignored it.
I'm receiving too many mixed messages!
Thanks, LFH
PS Sandi: A response to your message is next.
ME: 38 W: 35 D2.5 and S5 Married 12 years Separated (same house, different rooms) INILWYAM by W: 4/16/2009 The day W requested a D: 4/17/2009
And one more thing...I noticed that my W is still carrying the "Five Love Languages" book in her briefcase alongside her work computer. This bag goes everywhere she goes. I asked for it back a couple of weeks ago, but she still has it. Hmmm?
-LFH
ME: 38 W: 35 D2.5 and S5 Married 12 years Separated (same house, different rooms) INILWYAM by W: 4/16/2009 The day W requested a D: 4/17/2009
I'm pretty slammed at work today, so I'll have to be brief.
Are you at a point with you that you can live with whatever happens - seems like you are as you told her you were ready for D. If so, why not sit down with her and tell her what's on your mind? Not in a pursuing way, but more in a I have done some soul searching, and here is what I have noticed about me...Let her know you are not perfect and that you would like to work on your M - that if she decides not to, that is her choice and you cannot stop her. But, you don't agree with that choice. I think you can do this in a way that is more clearing the air on something that may have been confusing.
I will defer to the more experienced on this one. But, I think if you couch your discussions in terms of leading you both to a new M, it could be helpful. Just no begging/pleading. Then shut up about any more R talks and start living your changes.
I've already had that discussion Sunday evening. I told her that I wanted to save our family. I disagreed with her choice of wanting to get a divorce (although I thought I was prepared for it 3 weeks ago) and not giving it one last try. We were only 2.5 weeks into working on things and she's already giving up. I asked her if she was truly prepared to only see our kids every other week. I told her I definitely was not. I told that this fact alone is enough for me to keep trying. I told her that it would kill me to see a "step dad" holding my kids one day and that I was sure it would do the same to her if a "step-mom" was doing the same. Yes, this may have been a guilt trip, but I believe these to be tough consequences of divorce.
I told her that if she desired a divorce, she would have to be the one filing...and taking responsibility for breaking up the family...not me. I'll take the blame for putting our family in this situation, but not for ending it all. I also said that she can approach me, even in the final hour, to let me know she had a change of heart...it was never too late.
It was then Sunday night when I approached W with Retrovaille. She gave me an immediate yes to my suggestion. I was shocked...no begging, no pleading, and no convincing on my behalf necessary. I surmise her quick response was due to the guilt that was starting to eat her up inside, if not already. It doesn't matter as long as she's going.
GIMA...I know your busy with work...reply at a convienient time.
Thanks, LFH
ME: 38 W: 35 D2.5 and S5 Married 12 years Separated (same house, different rooms) INILWYAM by W: 4/16/2009 The day W requested a D: 4/17/2009
So, she knows where you stand. Get back to DB'ing and detaching in particular.
Any further R discussions initiated by you are likely to be seen as pursuit.
How long til your retro session? Use the time leading up to that to live your changes/new attitude. She won't buy words (talk is cheap), only your consistent action.
