K4D Rising #4

[Tomato]

they who have ears but do not hear kevin ..eyes but they do not see

make sure your time is being spent wisely kevin. re-evaluate where and on what you are spending your time. You do not get it back you know.

[K4D]

How long did you and your W pray together about whether it was God's will for you to M?

Thanks Tomato, I did misinterpret the question. We did go to marriage counseling with the pastor that married us. As far as how long we prayed before we got married? I don't know or remember. We may not have. I am not sure on that one. But that has no bearing on the fact that once we got married, the covenant was made.

Kevin

[Serenity13]

Catholic stance on divorce is as follows...(I am not catholic just trying to help Kevin)

The Old Testament did allow divorce, but then it was mostly Hebrew scripture. Divorce was disallowed at the time of Jesus Christ (the New Testament).

The official position then of the Catholic Church is that marriage is a sacrament that cannot be dissolved. A valid marriage has to endure until one spouse dies. The surviving spouse then is allowed to remarry. The Catholic Church does not grant divorce decrees nor does it recognize divorces issued by other religions or institutions.

The Catholic Church can, however, annul a marriage if there is sufficient proof that the marriage was invalid to begin with. Grounds for annulment include being forced to marry someone, not having enough information about that individual – as an example – if the party was an abuser, a convicted rapist and if the individual lied (about wanting children as one example). A marriage can also be annuled by the Catholic Church if the sexual act was not consummated.

If Catholics divorce and remarry, they are still welcome to worship but they cannot receive the Holy Eucharist.

[MrBond]

Wow this has got to be one of the most philosophically-laden post in the history of DB.

Aside from what Kevin believes, remember the issue is that his W doesn't want the M.

Period.

Everyone can try changing Kevin's POV, but it comes down to what the W wants. Not what Kevin does. Whether it's God's Will or not, his W doesn't want the M.

It's not temporary insanity, it's not because she doesn't know what she wants (she had a list of valid R problems), and it's not because she

She is a WAS who felt hurt for a number of years in a co-dependent R who finally made the break to live for herself.

The more fervently Kevin gets pushed into a debate about God, the more it's going to sound like you're fighting against the devil rather than it simply being the matter of a woman whose needs weren't met.

All heavenly debates aside, that's what it boils down to.

He neglected his W, she put up with alot of sh*t until she couldn't take it anymore and feels she can now live the life she feels she missed out on.

And let's face it, we all don't blame her. Seeing Kevin's obsessive R with her even now would make the majority of us run away too. Kevin, just stop with the obsession and let her live her life. Let her free and if she comes back it was meant to be.

It doesn't matter what you think or what you believe. It matters what she thinks (even though you adamantly believe she's wrong) because until you acknowledge that, you will not have the compassion to get her back or anyone else for that matter. Compassion is what it comes down to. Understanding things from HER point of view.

All we've seen here is how judgemental you can be to people you don't agree with. If you don't change that, your W will NEVER come back. Why would she want to stay with someone who is judgemental all the time about what you do? You insist on having God on your side yet you make side comments about her and always say "I can't see why she can't..." That's just it. YOU can't see why. You say you can, but you keep cutting down her character here on these boards.

Even in the scenario of if it was one of your D's in a relationship like yours, you insist on pushing on with the M without understanding the sitch through your D's eyes.

Start learning compassion and you'll be a better person. Or if you want a biblical reference "let he who is without sin cast the first stone".

[K4D]

Look,

I choose my stand based on the bible, God, and church. I know what it says. The world hates what it says because it does not fall in line with what they want. It is very very hard to stand in the face of what W is doing. But she is my covenant W. And I must do it if I am to follow what God says about M. It would be far easier to hook up with someone else. But it would be wrong. I can't do that with a good concious knowing what I know. It would eat at me and I would never feel comfortable in that situation because I would know it is wrong. Therefore I am doing the hardest thing I can do because I know it is the right thing to do. And I do truly love her.

Kevin

[Steve McQueen]

you called her a whore, kevin.

she hates you.

[K4D]

Stuck,

I admitted my mistakes. I also do not pursue her anymore or contact her. I leave her alone. She contacts me.

Regardless of the mistakes that were made on both sides of the M and mostly were mine, it does not change the fact that a covenant M was created. You can call it judgemental all you want. But our M was valid and we do have a covenant. I'm not sure why that is so hard to understand.

You can call me the devil all you want for me standing for our covenant. I know I made mistakes. I repented of them and do daily. It doesn't change that I still stand for our M. I'm not forcing her to stay in it. I'm not doing anything to her. But I myself am standing for it.

Do I understand why she wanted separation? OF COURSE I DO. SHE NEEDED IT.

Do I understand moving forward in an adulterous lifestyle? I understand it is what she wants. But it doesn't make it right. Am I her judge? No. I am simply stating my position on where I am standing and why I am standing. If it is judgemental to defend my stance, so be it.

Kevin

[aliveandkicking]

Look,

I choose my stand based on the bible, God, and church. I know what it says. The world hates what it says because it does not fall in line with what they want. It is very very hard to stand in the face of what W is doing. But she is my covenant W. And I must do it if I am to follow what God says about M. It would be far easier to hook up with someone else. But it would be wrong. I can't do that with a good concious knowing what I know. It would eat at me and I would never feel comfortable in that situation because I would know it is wrong. Therefore I am doing the hardest thing I can do because I know it is the right thing to do. And I do truly love her.

Kevin

Then do it Kevin and stop flippin' complaining about it! You should be the model of contentment with the degree of certainty you espouse. So show us. Don't you want to impress upon all of us that your view of God and the Church is the right path? Perhaps inspire more of us to follow? Then do it. You hold yourself up as some kind of outstandingly devoted Catholic. So, show us how it is done. It should be absolutely fulfilling to you to exhibit the glory of God's word. And, you should certainly have no reason to drink or say stupid things to your children or your W. You should be on your game with your level of conviction. Anything less makes you look like a lazy, dogmatic, unstable and delusional man.

[K4D]

you called her a whore, kevin.

she hates you.

Yes, in a drunken stupor, I said that after she called me things. I also apologized and repented for the whole situation.

Kevin

[K4D]

Then do it Kevin and stop flippin' complaining about it! You should be the model of contentment with the degree of certainty you espouse. So show us. Don't you want to impress upon all of us that your view of God and the Church is the right path? Perhaps inspire more of us to follow? Then do it. You hold yourself up as some kind of outstandingly devoted Catholic. So, show us how it is done. It should be absolutely fulfilling to you to exhibit the glory of God's word. And, you should certainly have no reason to drink or say stupid things to your children or your W. You should be on your game with your level of conviction. Anything less makes you look like a lazy, dogmatic, unstable and delusional man.

Understood. I am not perfect as nobody is.

Kevin