On the verge of a meltdown.

[Stronger]

Well, you will. One way or another. You just have to keep your chin up.
Does she want full custody?

[SmileysPerson]

An awful lot going on. IMO that's why you're on the edge of a meltdown -- you're dealing with everything as if it is one problem.

Need to break this down into separate challenges and focus on each in turn.

For example, the boys in trouble. In a weird way, that's the easiest challenge to deal with because -- apart from their acting out -- it's in some respects the least-connected to your experience of the D. Adolescent boys suffer from Testosterone-Induced Stupidity. Corralling them is a no-brainer and would be required whether or not you were in the D.

So let's engage some things here.

came to believe this would pass with time it hasn't.

What's "time"? This is a marathon, not a 100-yard dash.

my D6 asked why we can't be a family together and I just fell apart.

You can't fall apart. It's okay for her to know you're sad -- in fact it's good -- but you have to be a leader. One thing I've used with my D6 is "we are still a family -- Daddy's marriage isn't what makes us a family. How I love you and..... and how you love me and your Mommy -- that's what makes us a family."

I had to hide in the basement so they wouldn't see me in that state.

Save it for later. They're watching you and will model you. If you're good and strong, they'll be good and strong. Your mission right now is to make those children as resilient as possible. Think Charlotte in Charlotte's Web.

we go to court Thursday for spousal support which should push her over the edge.

I'm all-too-familiar with this phenomenon. Too bad for her. As my attorney puts it, she might as well come to grips with the Rule Of Thirds -- one-third for Uncle Sam, one-third for her, one-third for you. Whatever you do, ignore it. DON'T pick that rope up.

All of this is my fault of course because I won't move out of the marital home.

Of course. Blah blah blah-dee-frickin'-blah. And you were the gunman on the grassy knoll, too.

I have tried to talk to my W and voiced my concerns but it falls on deaf ears.

Which concerns?

I don't think that a divorce is the right course of action.

What you think is irrelevant. You have to live -- right now -- by what @Coach refers to as the "brutal reality" of your situation. Don't confuse your philosophical and moral beliefs with guidance for your courses-of-action. Whether you like it or not, it's happening. That's your starting point. Save the philosophical condemnation for later. Let it motivate you to DB your a** off, but don't make it the center of your evaluations.

I have tried to get her to go to counseling but she won't.

Only she can get her to go to counseling. Don't push. Let it go. Focus inward. Focus on you. Focus on that mission of making those kids resilient. The more you ignore her the better off you'll be and the more confounded she'll be. But if you keep pushing, you keep giving her ammunition.

and every time I ask her where are problems are I get a different answer.

Of course you do. Because she doesn't know where they are. Every time you ask a question like that, you make her think. Walkaway doesn't want to think. Walkaway wants to walk. So she's going to reach for anything and everything ("you're not tall enough!") in the vain hopes that she'll find the Magic Bullet that makes you say, "Oh, well then I guess I'll be going."

I need to know

No, you don't. You want to know. That's a different thing.

I havent read any of the DB books yet as I am on half a shoestring budget.

Public library. If yours doesn't have it they can get it on what is called "Interlibrary Loan" -- ask the reference librarian. Also ask for a book called Hold Onto Your NUTs.

I actually gave them to my W to read

Don't give her things to read. Study is for you.

she was very pissed after reading love languages.she said she has been trying to tell me that for 20 years.which I think is total BS

What you think doesn't matter. She might be reaching and rewriting again -- it's what they do. On the other hand, that might actually be her point-of-view. But again, it doesn't matter.

Right now, you can't control her. You can't influence her. All you can do is annoy and irritate her. That's not helpful. So focus on yourself and the kids.
maybe the last two years yes 20 no way.

I gave up cigarettes 18 months ago, and have been clean (weed) for 9 months.I very rarely drink, a beer here and there but that is it. I have lost 12lbs on the(I'm Leaving)diet.and I have been exercising.

Excellent. Keep that up.

The empty nest is killing me.

Understandable. Just keep walking. One step, one yard, one mile, one day at a time.

to much quiet time.and the lack of funds to do anything.

Excuses. And weak ones. Time too quiet? Kick out the jams on the stereo. Too little money? Take a walk. Putter in the yard. Jog. Go people-watching at the mall. Get on the internet, find a star map, try to identify them at night (so you can share it with the kids). Go through each room of the house identifying projects that need doing. Prioritize them. Get your budget under control. Go to the public library, read the paper, rummage around the magazines, read a book about something you never, ever thought you'd read a book about. Check out the community event boards at the library, city hall, Starbuck's -- go to a lecture on some subject you have no interest in whatsoever, attend an art exhibition.

In other words, do SOMETHING. Whether it's your "usual" thing or not. In fact, the less usual the better. Just be out.

And just be.

[harpo]

Well, you will. One way or another. You just have to keep your chin up.
Does she want full custody?

She has Primary Physical Custody,I have Secondary.I have visitation every other weekend,and the weekend I don't have them
I get Tuesday night to Thursday Morning.It is just a very emotionally draining.I am extremely close with my children.and of course D6 is my world.she loves to sing and dance while I play guitar for her.it's just tragic.I think the hardest part is when they have to go and they don't want to.

[harpo]

@SmileysPerson

"For example, the boys in trouble. In a weird way, that's the easiest challenge to deal with because -- apart from their acting out -- it's in some respects the least-connected to your experience of the D. Adolescent boys suffer from Testosterone-Induced Stupidity. Corralling them is a no-brainer and would be required whether or not you were in the D."

True, my concern is lack of authority.the W works midnite shift and works a good amount of overtime sometimes double shifts.so a good amount of time there are unsupervised.


came to believe this would pass with time it hasn't.

"What's "time"? This is a marathon, not a 100-yard dash."

true I am not a runner,some days I can barely walk,I am having a hard time detaching.I will try harder.

my D6 asked why we can't be a family together and I just fell apart.

"You can't fall apart. It's okay for her to know you're sad -- in fact it's good -- but you have to be a leader. One thing I've used with my D6 is "we are still a family -- Daddy's marriage isn't what makes us a family. How I love you and..... and how you love me and your Mommy -- that's what makes us a family."

Good point I will take that approach.

I had to hide in the basement so they wouldn't see me in that state.

"Save it for later. They're watching you and will model you. If you're good and strong, they'll be good and strong. Your mission right now is to make those children as resilient as possible. Think Charlotte in Charlotte's Web."

Man, seen that a trillion times

we go to court Thursday for spousal support which should push her over the edge.

"I'm all-too-familiar with this phenomenon. Too bad for her. As my attorney puts it, she might as well come to grips with the Rule Of Thirds -- one-third for Uncle Sam, one-third for her, one-third for you. Whatever you do, ignore it. DON'T pick that rope up."

No it wasn't a rope it was a shaft and guess who got it.me I filled for spousal support and she filed for child support.it wound up being a wash.and the fact she knew everybody in the office.W is a Corrections Officer and plays softball with them and the Probation Dept.I felt so violated.and my lawyer sent an associate who was late and pretty much worthless.and at the end her lawyer stated that if i move out the W will bring the mortgage current.(2 months past due) yipeee !

All of this is my fault of course because I won't move out of the marital home.

"Of course. Blah blah blah-dee-frickin'-blah. And you were the gunman on the grassy knoll, too."

No but I could use that magic bullet

I have tried to talk to my W and voiced my concerns but it falls on deaf ears.

Which concerns?

I don't think that a divorce is the right course of action.

"What you think is irrelevant. You have to live -- right now -- by what @Coach refers to as the "brutal reality" of your situation. Don't confuse your philosophical and moral beliefs with guidance for your courses-of-action. Whether you like it or not, it's happening. That's your starting point. Save the philosophical condemnation for later. Let it motivate you to DB your a** off, but don't make it the center of your evaluations."

You are right.it was my momentary lapse of reason

I have tried to get her to go to counseling but she won't.

"Only she can get her to go to counseling. Don't push. Let it go. Focus inward. Focus on you. Focus on that mission of making those kids resilient. The more you ignore her the better off you'll be and the more confounded she'll be. But if you keep pushing, you keep giving her ammunition."

Oh no, I want the bullet tug,tug (just kiddin I hear ya)

and every time I ask her where are problems are I get a different answer.

"Of course you do. Because she doesn't know where they are. Every time you ask a question like that, you make her think. Walkaway doesn't want to think. Walkaway wants to walk. So she's going to reach for anything and everything ("you're not tall enough!") in the vain hopes that she'll find the Magic Bullet that makes you say, "Oh, well then I guess I'll be going."

there's that @#$%& bullet again.( again another lapse)

I need to know

No, you don't. You want to know. That's a different thing.

True I can see that now.

I havent read any of the DB books yet as I am on half a shoestring budget.

Public library. If yours doesn't have it they can get it on what is called "Interlibrary Loan" -- ask the reference librarian. Also ask for a book called [color:#000099]Hold Onto Your NUTs.
[/color]
I checked into that Thanks

I actually gave them to my W to read

Don't give her things to read. Study is for you.

Will not forget that one believe me !

she was very pissed after reading love languages.she said she has been trying to tell me that for 20 years.which I think is total BS

"What you think doesn't matter. She might be reaching and rewriting again -- it's what they do. On the other hand, that might actually be her point-of-view. But again, it doesn't matter."

Right now, you can't control her. You can't influence her. All you can do is annoy and irritate her. That's not helpful. So focus on yourself and the kids.
maybe the last two years yes 20 no way.

Yes will do (try to stay focus wax on wax off ).

I gave up cigarettes 18 months ago, and have been clean (weed) for 9 months.I very rarely drink, a beer here and there but that is it. I have lost 12lbs on the(I'm Leaving)diet.and I have been exercising.

Excellent. Keep that up.

Yes one of my finer achievements

The empty nest is killing me.

Understandable. Just keep walking. One step, one yard, one mile, one day at a time.

to much quiet time.and the lack of funds to do anything.

"Excuses. And weak ones. Time too quiet? Kick out the jams on the stereo. Too little money? Take a walk. Putter in the yard. Jog. Go people-watching at the mall. Get on the internet, find a star map, try to identify them at night (so you can share it with the kids). Go through each room of the house identifying projects that need doing. Prioritize them. Get your budget under control. Go to the public library, read the paper, rummage around the magazines, read a book about something you never, ever thought you'd read a book about. Check out the community event boards at the library, city hall, Starbuck's -- go to a lecture on some subject you have no interest in whatsoever, attend an art exhibition."

In other words, do SOMETHING. Whether it's your "usual" thing or not. In fact, the less usual the better. Just be out.

And just be.

this I have been doing,getting outdoors more, jammin on the porch with the bro's (neighbors love me).taking kids to the pool.the nights are what get me empty house and bed just plain inhales.

Also the people here are a great resource and I thank all for being here but wish it was for better reasons.

thanks Smiley you have given me some perspective
God Bless

[Stronger]

Get some information on how to help them cope. Maybe share it with W and it could be something you work on as a team....get that team feeling back. It could be a good starting place.

[harpo]

@ stronger....thanks sounds like a good idea.back to school soon so I hope that helps.

it has been really tough with the kids.over the(my) weekend the kids are on the swim team and it was championships on sat.pretty much a whole long day event.started @ 5:45 am and I think we got home around 6:30 pm.they had fun as did I and by the end of the day they we just wiped out.The W was there also for the hole day and at most said two words to me.it just tears at me that here is a woman I've been with for over 21 years and I don't even exist.

On Sunday when we got home from church the was a message on my machine that they had an awards dinner @ 5:30 PM if I could bring them there and she would meet them there after her softball game so I agreed.while there I get a phone call from her she is going to be a couple of minutes late because she had to pick up S14( which I haven't seen much of because he is in rebellion stage).so I wait.she gets there and I put all the kiddie gear in her car and get ready to leave.I would have stayed but the torment of seeing her dressed to the 9"s just kills me.as I am leaving my S8 comes running over in tears and hands me his trophy and said he wants me to keep it.once again I am just a mess so I kiss him good by and tell him I will see him in a few days.I walk in the door and the phone rings and it the W she lets me know that S8 is giving her a hard time and she doesn't think it's fair.I was just bewildered.I told her it's hard for me too when I have to tell them it's time to go back to G-Ma's and they don't wont to go.then she asked me to tell him I didn't leave because of her.nope you handle that one,and she hung up.

Later on that night on her way to work she called me again and wanted to know what I told him.apparently he became very angry at her, kicking and hitting her and making a scene.and I told her all I said was that mom was here and dad had to go.then she asked me why I left.I was honest and basically told her she treats me like crap,she is cold and it hurts.and she asked how was she supposed to treat me.and went into this big rant about how the kids should be at home and there not because I am there and she can't live with me and I have no where to go and I constantly hound her and she had to go to work.and I said there you go again running from your problems.click she hung up again.(another great night of sleep)

Good day for therapy.my Doctor just is amazed of the amount of life changing circumstances I have had to endure.yet they keep coming.

I return home from the Doc. and there is a message from S8 that he was going to a Yankee game and just wanted to let me know.I thought cool good for him.so S14 stops @ the house to take a shower and I asked why because it was just kinda weird.he had a fight with G-Ma and left the house.great more drama so I asked well were is mom.She went to the game.so like an idiot I asked with who.she went with a co-worker(male-divorced)and a S9.now thing get a little queasy.and the brain starts swelling.I don't have any proof but they seem to spend a lot of time together,play softball, take the kids, out so on so on.I don't know if I should ask her about it our try to find out for myself.either way I think if I find out it is that will be the last event I need to send me to the twilight Zone.I hope and pray I am wrong but the hair on the back of my neck tells me different.

God, grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change; the courage to change the things I can; and the wisdom to know when to just haul off and kick some booty !

Just another rant...Thanks for stopping by.
God Bless.

[harpo]

I am beginning to think my suspicions where right.W did not get home until after 4:00 AM.and she had S8 with her I know the game was over @ 10:30 .and it is a 2 - 2.5 hour drive.I have been up all night unable to sleep.all this crap is just running through my head and it really sucks.God I want a lobodomy.I am not sure what to say or how to atemp to say anything.I want to approach this guy and ask WTF.I know him not that it matters.I'm just torn.any thoughts on this would help because right now I am in a serious fog.

Thanks
God Bless

[harpo]

oh I did send her a text via internet
You know you are married....God
Wish I could see her face when she reads it though.

[Stronger]

Harpo.
It's time to stop. It's time to detach and work on you and your kids. You can NOT control her. So the best way to bring about a change in her, is to change yourself.

Work on you. Work on the kids. Get out of your head.

[harpo]

I am so trying but it's like a roll up shade every time you pull it down it roll's back up and slaps you in the face.I have to just stop grabin the frickin cord.