Hello Kittyfish & Sandi2!

[BigJohn]

Sandi,

That was kind of a silly ending to last nights post, didn't mean to be so melodramatic. My sitch is just such a soap opera sometimes it's ridiculous. Anyways, I'll pick up where I left off last night.

After my W got home from the salon, she immediately took a call on the home phone and walked into our master bedroom and closed the door. I was fixing dinner for the family at the time and naturally she said very little to me when she got in. I didn't comment on her hair. Shortly thereafter, I went into our garage to get some food out of a pantry. (The garage is adjacent to the mater bedroom.) While going in and out of the garage I heard parts of my W's phone conversation with (who I later learned was her best female friend). I didn't hear much but enough to realize that she was joking about her EA. It pissed me off. So when I went in to tell my W it was time for dinner I called her on it and said there was nothing funny about her EA- she was way out of bounds. She made a smart aleck comment and I told her I was quite capable of making some less than kind comments to her that would be guaranteed to wipe the smirk off her face. That nipped her attitude it in the bud. But I didn't stop there.

Recall when my D3 made the comment a while back "daddy (OM's name)"? Well I was feeling similar emotions last night. And, I have a couple of things that I haven't disclosed before to add to the context of my sitch: I am a long time professional investigator in the corporate world who works frequently with private investigators and attorneys. Some of my long time PI friends (who don't have business with my current employer)have taken a personal interest in my sitch and out of concern have offered assistance to me on their own personal time. I disclosed these people as part of my "support group" to my W within weeks of discovery of the EA and she understands the culture in which I work.

As one of my concerns early on was that my W was involved with a grifter- and OM may very well be- I accepted some assistance from these friends. Something that was discovered as a result is that OM apparently refers to his online girlfriends as "b*tches" and/or "Ho's". (BTW, I keep what is disclosed to me to myself- this time was an exception.) I didn't think my W knew this so I decided at the moment that maybe she would appreciate it given her joking about the EA. So I took her into the bedroom after dinner and told her. Surprisingly she wasn't shocked- her only interest was the source of this information. Naturally we had a conversation about this since this is completely contrary to the type of person she is in "real life". Is this part of the dynamic of their R or some sort of sicko role playing? I don't know and didn't get enough information out of my W about it. I did make a point of telling my W that 1) No one speaks about my W in those terms and 2)as my W, mother of our kids and a respected member of our church and community, she is certainly NOT a "b*tch" or a "Ho".

So, we had a R talk. I know Sandi, I can hear it now: Nooooo BJ, Noooooo! But the fact that my W is accepting of this type of verbal abuse from OM really concerned me. And so I heard from my W that because she was skeptical about "getting hurt again" by OM (like she did back when they broke up when she was 18), she broke it off with OM a couple weeks ago....before restarting things up with him again recently after he recontacted her. Next, I heard about how I don't love her unconditionally- like some people do (OM)- and that if I did, I'd in essence be what we (DBer's)would consider aggressively pursuing her and lavishing her with praises, compliments, etc.- while in the midst of the EA. Of course, I received no credit for sticking it out like I have been during the whole sitch. Next, I heard her repeat again how no one ever changes and how our two different personalities just can't coexist successfully within a MR, blah, blah blah. And then she told me how she had asked my BIL to have a conversation with me about a S with her and how much sense it would be to have ME move out of the family home given the sitch with our kids. (BTW, My BIL wouldn't DARE have this convo with me- and my W is a chickensh*t to even suggest it to him.) When I asked my W what she might be doing to "recruit" the OM to support her in getting a D from me in order for them to be together she denied doing anything of the sort.

After I had listened to my W, I told her that me being understanding of what she was going through in this sitch- and I can't relate to what she is going through- was one thing but that being used as a doormat by her was another. So we discussed respect and boundaries and agreed to have a separate convo about them. That part of the R talk went reasonably well- it was a discussion that needed to happen- before things de-evolved into my W getting emotional and stating how she just feels like she is always disappointing me, she always gives in to me, etc. and that "why try to work on our R since it just won't work". To which I replied in part: 1) I have never deliberately tried to make her feel like a let down, 2) I have always seen her as and wanted an equal M partner, 3) my expectation for our R is one that is both mature and where BOTH of us accept accountability, 4)our MR requires and deserves courage on the part of both of us to make it work and 5) If you don't try you are doomed to fail!

(BTW, My W told me that while at camp she had tried feeling optimistic about our R but that as soon as she got home last Friday she reverted back to her same feelings again. Don't know if I believe that or not as I don't think she missed a beat TM OM while at camp. So much for clearing her head- or recognizing that OM has got to go before we can try reconciling.)

So unfortunately I had a backslide the other night. If I hadn't heard what I did I probably would have been fine, but my W joking about the EA like this is some sort of silly high school R sitch really pissed me off. Can't say how much of a setback (or benefit) any of this may have had beyond shedding additional light on my W's R with OM.

If anything all of this crap just underscores to me more the value in detaching.

Well got to go. Talk to you later.