I am not sure how to say this except to just say it. Please dont take offense. I say things always because I care. But, I am not sure it is in your best interests to say that you are not sure what other changes he wants from you as if you are a job applicant or a shopping list.
You know what problems there were in your marriage. You should be figuring out what changes you need to make for YOU. Those changes are the ones that he will not be second guessing because he will have no doubt that they are for real.
But, I am not sure it is in your best interests to say that you are not sure what other changes he wants from you as if you are a job applicant or a shopping list.
What do you mean? He DID NOT say what other changes he wants from me. I think he's telling me he likes the changes I've made as I made them. I think he knows these changes were NOT for HIM. He often compliments me about the changes in how I handle things now and says he needs to give my therapist a big fat kiss. And I agree, he does. I should have been seeing her BEFORE I got married.
And I have to disagree with this: You know what problems there were in your marriage. You should be figuring out what changes you need to make for YOU. Those changes are the ones that he will not be second guessing because he will have no doubt that they are for real. I did make these changes for me. And he's still second guessing them. He says it point blank in the email that he's not sure it's all bs and "could crumble at any second."
It's a pretty clear statement, at least for me, through out Divorce Rememdy that the spouse who leaves.....once they notice the changes, they'll continue to wait and watch with suspicion that the changes are only temporary. So his reaction is right on with all that I've read and learned.
But, I am not sure it is in your best interests to say that you are not sure what other changes he wants from you as if you are a job applicant or a shopping list.
What she is saying is, now that he has made his list of things that he doesn't like...
YOU have to be true to you....You can't go changing things just because he whimpers...
If i'm thinkin straight here, and correct me if I'm not, there were TWO people involved in this marriage....
She is saying that the things that you can do and YOU realize that you were wrong in.....change them.
But A....YOU are too high a price to pay for this relationship.
I'm totally confused.....maybe I didn't explain myself very well.
He didn't make a list of things he didn't like....He made a list of things he doesn't want to talk about anymore and why. But this was something I already knew and really, not news to me.
But a list of things he doesn't like....they guy is off his game right now, true, but he doesn't have a death wish.
Here's the thing, I have been on this board for two years and I have managed not to ever offend (at least not that I know of) anyone and I dont want to start now.
But, I also have always tried to be honest. My circle on here is small. Once I let someone in, I am there for the long haul.
I say all this because I want to be sure you knew where my post was coming from.
In your words, "Today I got an email from H that pretty much was a "blueprint" (as my fellow DBer called it) as to what I need to do from H's perspective to save the marriage. He was clear what he needs from me."
I know that you are a smart lady. And I wanted to be sure that the things HE needs you to do are things that YOU feel needed to be changed. Yes, they do watch to see if the changes are real. And they can tell if they are being done as a means to an end.
He doesnt get to tell you what you should be doing. You tell you, ya know?
So, sorry if I wasnt clear. Sorry if what I said upset you. I care about you. This steps we take on this journey are a way of life. Sometimes, a marriage is also saved.
You're nutz if you think you pissed me off....I wanted clarification in case I missed something and it's something I need to know with perfect understanding because while this isn't quite life or death, it sure does feel that way sometimes. And I've learned enough to know, if you don't get it, you better figure it out.
No, truly I was confused and not afraid to admit it.
Yes, his "blueprint" was very helpful to me and not insulting. There was nothing like "You need to wash my feet as soon as you stand up from bowing to me once I walk into the house I pay the mortgage for!"
It was more "I see these great changes....but I'm scared it's bs and will crumble at any minute." He went on to say that he likes that he's told me somethings about his issues with our marriage and I've been able to make those adjustments for him. The main thing that comes to mind....I didn't know he wanted to snuggle every night. He does. I was sort of flabbergasted when he told me this as one of his complaints about the marriage.....Really? Something that simple and you didn't mention it? He thought I knew. I had no idea. So when he's here, of course I don't mind snuggling every night. He seriously, seriously never said anything before. I told him that asked why he NEVER mentioned something so simple....he said Yeah, I don't know. I asked, Why didn't you just snuggle up to me? Again, Yeah, I don't know.
Another complaint....he wanted more affection. I knew that. I tried to fix it before, but it was bad timing.....I don't know how else to explain it. But in recent weeks, as he's explained it to me, he said I stopped being affectionate BEFORE the baby. While I really really don't remember it that way, I know he that he does. And therefore, that's how it happened. I apologized and explained I didn't do it to "with hold affection or to punish"....he said sometimes it felt exactly like that. So, while it's been hard to hear some of his issues, there's been great opportunity for me to work on things and he's been very receptive to it.
My basic rule is this when I have a question about changes I want to make or I'm considering it or things H has asked me for or explained he needs: I will not start or do anything I am not willing to do for the rest of my life.
I do the laundry....never bugged me and as a matter of fact H is banned from the laundry. One too many of my sweaters have shrunk. I still ML with H because I am ready to do that forever. I do not make dinner every night in hopes that will bring him home forever because I know I can't realistically do that. I want to play tennis some nights, yoga some nights, go out with friends or hit the bookstore, whatever. I can't commit to that.....and H hasn't asked me to do anything so far that I can't or I'm not willing to do forever.
In terms of the "blueprint".....he asked me for space and time. He went on to say if I can't give him the time to figure somethings out, then he would understand and that would be one less thing he'd have to work out as the decision would be made for him.
I know beginners.....you're looking out. I should have been more clear.
Ok, so we are all good, yes? Good for you on understanding what he needs and what you need. And yes, only make changes that you can do for life.
He has made it clear he needs time so I know you are going to give it to him. He really is all muddled up inside. He needs to figure it out. THe more room you give him to do that, the better.
I just want you to be prepared for the possibility that he may change what he says he needs. He knows he is not happy, unsettled and cant quite figure out why. Dont get discouraged if he does. Thats why it is so important that you keep the focus on you and your son.
I know that could happen and I'm trying to brace myself for that while dropping the walls a little bit while keeping up the guard.....tricky..... And truth be told, he does pull some crap now, I may have to scream and break stuff... Or just come here and vent to you all....no "I told you so"s here. Just 2X4s....
Almost, It appears that you are not very far along in this process (although I'm sure it feels like forever). You need to be prepared for him to "move the goalposts." This is very common in MLC. You hear, "I want you to change X, Y, and Z." You bust a gut to do those things, and then you get one or more of the following responses: -- "Too little, too late." -- "I'm glad you made those changes, but I have no faith that they will stick." -- "X, Y, and Z were just the basics--nowhere near enough to make me happy with you. Now I want you to change A, B, and C too." (Cycle, rinse, repeat...ad infinitum.)
I got all three of those myself. My favorite was when H said to me, "How can I be sure you're not going to become suicidal again?" I wanted to hit him and yell, "How can I be sure you're not going to cheat on me again? And did you ever consider that there might be some relationship between the two things? Of course you did; you keep doing horrible stuff, like bringing OW to sleep with you in OUR HOUSE, and then asking if I'm going to kill myself!" But in proper DB form, I said something mild and non-confrontational instead. I am waiting to receive my Oscar!
I really do hope for the best for you, but be prepared for an excruciatingly long process. I hope this post will help you prepare rather than just upset you.
Peace, Dawn
Me 45/H 47, no kids Together since 1985; M/1992 Bomb1 (EA-OW1, age 22) 2001 Bomb2 (EA/PA-OW2, age 22) 10/2007, A continues H left 11/24/08 minimal contact, no legal action http://tinyurl.com/DawnHope1
