Not saying she isn't doing all kinds of strange, mean, passive agressive, bitcy things. She is, and she has been since the beginning. I have already said so many times. I am just saying that from the outside, SP is also doing some of his own game playing.
Not saying she isn't doing all kinds of strange, mean, passive agressive, bitcy things. She is, and she has been since the beginning. I have already said so many times. I am just saying that from the outside, SP is also doing some of his own game playing.
DQ
With respect to this single question, as I read it, neither SP nor Mrs. SP want to "show their cards" first, and SP acknowledged all of the reasons for that (Negotiating 101). But, to characterize either of their positions with such charged words, IMO, misses the point.
For what purpose would SP agree to give her his number (assuming he EVEN had one, which, per the above, he does not) first? By doing so will she magically come back to him because he's no longer being passive-aggressive? Unless one believes that, not sure I understand the rationale for his stating an amount that may even piss her off more. But, he, just as if the roles were reversed, has a legal right to X amount of support and maintenance.
IMO, @Smiley has the tools to manage this issue on his own. FWIW, and I could be wrong, these types of issues are best "solved" when there is as little emotion on either side as possible and both parties are looking at the matter dispassionately... which, paradoxically, in this type of situation is so hard to do.
Last edited by AlexEN; 07/21/0903:31 PM.
New: What a Weekend
H-48 WAW-49 M-22 S-14,9 D-11 EA disc.-11/07 PA disc.-3/08 EA2?-6/08 to ?
DQ- Yes, we shaking in our boots, LBS who are still reeling from being alienated from our life-partners (he or she having been the one who we swore to go through this morass that life can be together) are a bit paranoid and gunshy and sensitive and that may translate to "game playing" but one might also call it trauma induced strategizing.
I am also not saying he doesn't have perfectly valid reasons for being passive agressive. It is many times a tactic that LBS's need to use. All I am saying is that him doing this is pissing her off and THAT IS WHY she is choosing to whine to her sister about him saying x when he clearly said not-x, as SP put it. I am only responding to the portion that I hi-lited in my other post.
No one is right, no one is wrong. It is all a game and LBS's are playing (usually) to hopefully win back the WAW (not that SP is still doing this but usually that is what LBS's are doing). WAS's are playing the game to exit as simply as possible with as much as they can get away with (ie: they want to just take all the assets, leave all the bullcrap, and blame it all on LBS).
Again - what I was responding to is SP's saying he doesn't understand why she would sabotage any future reconciliation with him and any future relationship he might be able to have with her sister (answer, because she does not intend to ever be with him again, so she doesn't care about the sabotage) and I was responding to "why" she would keep "lying" about him saying x when he said not-x (answer, because he has not given her any number yet and this is making her assume the worst).
Now, it could be that I have a point here and that maybe SP could just accept my point and not go further and try to make it that I am saying he is wrong or right. I am simply saying what it looks like from the outside.
I am also not saying he doesn't have perfectly valid reasons for being passive agressive. It is many times a tactic that LBS's need to use. All I am saying is that him doing this is pissing her off and THAT IS WHY she is choosing to whine to her sister about him saying x when he clearly said not-x, as SP put it. I am only responding to the portion that I hi-lited in my other post.
No one is right, no one is wrong. It is all a game and LBS's are playing (usually) to hopefully win back the WAW (not that SP is still doing this but usually that is what LBS's are doing). WAS's are playing the game to exit as simply as possible with as much as they can get away with (ie: they want to just take all the assets, leave all the bullcrap, and blame it all on LBS).
Again - what I was responding to is SP's saying he doesn't understand why she would sabotage any future reconciliation with him and any future relationship he might be able to have with her sister (answer, because she does not intend to ever be with him again, so she doesn't care about the sabotage) and I was responding to "why" she would keep "lying" about him saying x when he said not-x (answer, because he has not given her any number yet and this is making her assume the worst).
Now, it could be that I have a point here and that maybe SP could just accept my point and not go further and try to make it that I am saying he is wrong or right. I am simply saying what it looks like from the outside.
DQ
I understand and I agree, she may well perceive it exactly as you say. Now, take it a step further and if one agrees that it is neither right nor wrong, how does it translate into next steps? To "play the game" the way she wants, given your beliefs about the WAS's exit strategy, wouldn't seem to have any benefit to SP unless it might bring her back to him IF he wanted that as a possible outcome.
BTW, it was these words that threw me before:
Quote:
I'm not saying you don't have valid reasons, but still from the outside, it is a passive agressive manuver on your part.
... as my inference from that was that was how you thought an impartial third party would characterize it, rather than merely how Mrs. SP might be perceiving it.
New: What a Weekend
H-48 WAW-49 M-22 S-14,9 D-11 EA disc.-11/07 PA disc.-3/08 EA2?-6/08 to ?
I fully understand the WAS has been through their own process long before they drop the bomb. However, in my case my H, to this day (19 months later) still never misses a chance to say we cant be married anymore. I have never asked him to stay married so I am unsure of the reason he needs to say it each time.
Just a few weeks ago he e-mailed me and said this: W, may I come by and pick up a golf club from our storage shed? I still cant be married anymore.
As we were working out some asset division matters he said "ok, I agree to this portion of the settlement but I cant be married anymore". Um, yes, that is why we are working on a divorce settlement, I get it.
My all time favorite was on voting day when he told me he voted for Obama but he cant be married anymore.
Now mind you we have been in a court case since July of 2008. Since Aug. of 2008 we have maybe seen each other 6 times. So why him picking up a golf club needs to be followed with a "I cant be married anymore" statement again is puzzling. It gets old. I get it. And by now he should get it too.
I have no idea what he tells his family or friends nor do I really care. The one thing I dont get is when my attny and his attny had a "closed door meeting" my attny told me that his attny said my H defends me up and down. So, whatever. He cant be married anymore. All clear. And at this point I cant either. I just dont feel the need to remind him of it everytime I open my mouth.
After his bomb dropping and affair and all the other BS that happened its still sort of astounding to me that he thinks I would *want* to be married to him. Arrogance at its finest.
As my dear dear friend FG would say, there is too much drama here still. From both sides. Anger, bitterness etc etc. been there, done that from nearly BOTH sides (LBS/WAA) and I am telling you, unless all this quiets down, the REAL feelings and possible chances for reconciliation will NOT show/come to surface.
This is what I believe and this is what I see. And Smiley, if I were you I would get over with logistics ASAP, (without giving up anything) and see where that leads you from there. Right now, ON TOP of everything else, you have finances and D business bargains to poison your relationship. Even to just coparent, this aint for your favor. My 2 cents (4-5 of yours) K
BTW, I agree with DQ on most things if not all but I can understand how the phases of some of our friends sitches here are still so damn painful they cant step back...., yet. That will come in due time. No shortcuts available.
Helpful post Kalni. Some of us need to rip the damn bandaid off already so we can heal.
Yep. And some prefer to peel it slowly. If SP is the latter type, it seems to me that we should support him in that.
That being said, I also agree with DQ's point, in that she was merely responding to SP's question about why his wife is saying the things she is, and it may very well be that his "peel the Band-Aid off slowly" style is driving her bonkers.
