No, lately, I barely sleep. It is a symptom of menopause. I have decided to embrace it and just stay up and do whatever rather than tossing and turning. Luckily I will soon start working with a woman in Denver. We love working together at night. She conks out at about 11, but that gives me something to do until 1 anyway.
It seems like everytime you talk about a conversation with your wife, she cries about something. I'm beginning to wonder if she isn't chronically depressed. I would expect greater emotional strength from a woman toying with affairs. If she can't handle normal day to day life, how does she expect to cope with potential love and loss in the dating scene? It is a meat-market out there. Has she seen a doctor about depression?
It is true. Every R discussion ends with classic signs of depression. She cries, has no answers to any of my follow up questions. Asked what she is thinking about or what she is feeling, her standard answer is "I don't know", and then she ends the discussion by saying "I'm too tired, crawling into bed and falling asleep."
She refuses to discuss depression, however, or consider anti-depressants. Her answer when I brought it up: "This isn't something you can cure with a pill"
Me 42, W 39, S8, S6, S2 M 11y, A & ILYBNILWY 11/08 Walking away from a bad situation.
Wouldn't the sort of logical follow-on question be, "Well what would cure it?"
One thing I've noticed in my sitch is that whenever WAW appears (to me) to be like her "old self," she seems to throw this switch to become a total B*tch-on-Wheels. Like she's overcompensating for some secret knowledge she has. It really manifested itself yesterday, in fact, when she said more-or-less the same thing Mrs. Thinker said in response to a comment of mine that was more-or-less the same thing Mr. Thinker said.
She had emailed idly about the kids (who are with her this weekend) and how much fun they were having in the pool: "I just watch them. I don't what it is. I just watch. I'm tired all the time. I'm not interested in anything....." and more to that effect.
Well you don't have to be Dr. Phil, right? I mean, pretty classic signs of situational depression. So I said what you seem to have said. Response: Blah blah blah, psychobabble you've been reading, blah blah blah, and anyway this isn't something you can cure with a pill.
So I asked her, "Well what would cure it?"
An end to all this craziness.
And then I dropped A bomb -- "And what would be different about you the day after all this craziness ended? Not about us. Not about the situation. What would change in you?"
The silence since has been deafening.
No, I think @Sara's definitely on to something, and that you've been picking it up as well. I wonder if somehow that's not always the case? I mean, I wonder if The Fog is some kind of mental condition, temporary insanity, something? Someone -- maybe @Sara, in fact -- mentioned up-thread a bit that the death of a parent seems to play a role in a lot of these D-sitchs. Did in mine. Plus so many of us are in the mid-30 to 50 range, where one is conventionally assumed to be getting all comfortable and content and whatnot. Hmmmmm. Makes me think -- and that's always a dangerous thing.
She refuses to discuss depression, however, or consider anti-depressants. Her answer when I brought it up: "This isn't something you can cure with a pill"
And you say- "I agree. A pill wont cure it. I understand that it is much more complicated than that but here is the number that so and so (trusted person) recommended who can help you sort your feelings out and eventually feel better."
Her response, if it is anything but ok...IMO...requires directness-
"You are a wonderful mother and this time with the children is precious and the days of your life are to precious to spend feeling so awful. For your sake and theirs, please consider seeing this person."
... and anyway this isn't something you can cure with a pill.
So I asked her, "Well what would cure it?"
An end to all this craziness.
And then I dropped A bomb -- "And what would be different about you the day after all this craziness ended? Not about us. Not about the situation. What would change in you?"
The silence since has been deafening.
I have been hesitant to be so direct, but have bounced around this topic for a while.
W is miserable, and blames her misery directly on "Us and the situation we are in", but to me this does not explain why she is unhappy when the rest of us are happy; why she is unhappy when there is nothing going on TODAY that she would have any objection to.
I made the suggestion that "I have learned by looking at myself, that often when I am angry at you (W) and and my anger or emotions are disproportional to the situation, that it is normally something else that I am emotional about. Something long ago that has nothing to do with the current situation. It seems to me that your current stress and misery and unhappiness with our M is not proportional to the real situation. Do you think it is something else that is really bothering you."
As you said SP, the silence was deafening. Her only response was something like "I don't want to think about it right now"
Me 42, W 39, S8, S6, S2 M 11y, A & ILYBNILWY 11/08 Walking away from a bad situation.
A bit of change in attitude and tactics on my part.
Historically I have tried to avoid any discussion about Separation or D. I have realized that this was mostly due to fear on my part.
I am now making it a point to talk more openly with my W about it.
For example, today while we were both working in the yard (weeding), I said "Recently you have asked on a number of occasions for a separation to give you more space. What kind of separation are you looking for?" Her response was to think about it for a while and say "I don't know, just some space...but logistically I just don't see a way for it to work"
So the openness on my part changes the conversation. Instead of her throwing it at me and then being angry that I won't grant it, I am willing to openly discuss it and she is finding reasons that it can't work.
She also made a joke about D earlier today. The kids were driving us crazy and I was getting a bit stressed and she said something along the lines of "Are you sure you would want custody?" (with a smile)
I also proposed that in the spirit of openness we sit down tonight and exchange whatever information we each have on the D process here in the state. I am hoping to do it without emotions or conflict - just an exchange of information about the law and the process. I also want to give the message that, although I am definitely not in favor of a D, I am conversant and comfortable with the idea -- and not afraid of it. If she wants to talk about D, then great, let's talk, but she can't threaten me with it, or blame me for holding you back.
To be honest, going into these discussions requires a bit of "act as if" in order to not get defensive and stressed, but it is all a part of my process of releasing the fear of D, detaching from the outcome and dropping the rope.
Me 42, W 39, S8, S6, S2 M 11y, A & ILYBNILWY 11/08 Walking away from a bad situation.
Yes, T I think that is a good tack. My husband did something very similar with me years ago, and it was very successful.
At one point, before my daughter applied to college, I planned to move to CO to establish residency, so my daughter would get in state tuition. I would move and take the kids with me, while my H stayed in LA. He didn't say no. He kept talking to me about it. One night he took me out to dinner with drinks in the bar first. He asked a lot of questions about what our lives would be like. Where would I live, how would I live, where would the kids go to school, etc. He got into little details about what I would do each day, making me visualize the life as we talked. It seemed like he was in agreement with me doing it. Then we went home and continued the conversation. I don't remember what the question was, but we were talking about my impending life alone with the 3 kids in CO. And suddenly, I couldn't breathe. I was having a panic attack. The first time I had ever had a panic attack. I think I started crying and he asked what was wrong. I finally realized that all my bravado wasn't going to be enough, at a gut level, I was afraid of being alone with the kids and trying to cope. That ended my talking about moving to CO. My daughter did go to school there a year later, and we paid out of state tuition.
nearby, grab it and read pages 184-186 ("My Story"). Change a few minor facts, and it's a description of me. 