Over the Shock and GALing 6

[Thinker]

Coach, anyone,
W just emailed me that her sister and brother-in-law want to go camping next month, do I want to go?
WTH?
It would be them, their girls, us and our boys. I said yes because I keep promising the boys we will go.
Just two nights ago we were arguing over who keeps the house and custody of kids.
Am I missing something here?

Hi Orich,

It sounds familiar, and maybe I can help.

Your W want's to BE a FAMILY. She just does not want to BE with you as your W. This is a huge conflict, and this conflict is what is keeping her (and you) in limbo.

When you are talking to her about your Relationship, as when you are discussing the future, custody, who gets the house, etc, then she is focused on the Romance part of your R, on the idea of having you as her H, and right now she is running from that part of your Relationship. Those discussions are always going to be negative.

But your W still wants to be a family. She doesn't want to break it up yet. She doesn't want to go out in the world openly as if you are no longer married. If she did, you would not be talking about separating any more, because she would be gone.

You W still wants to do things as a family - like the camping trip. This is the same as the way my W tells me that our M is dead and she wants me to move out, but at the same time she still wants to be invited to my family's events and still brings me along to hers. She still wants to go on family vacations, etc.

Your W is running away from the Romantic part of your R, but you still have the part of your relationship where you can be friendly, do things together, have fun with the kids, etc. I have been calling that the Partnership (as opposed to the Romance). Focus on the Partnership with your W and stay away from the Romance.

Go on the Camping Trip. Have Fun.

At the same time, remember that it is not a sign from her that she is ready to work on the R yet. Don't build up your expectations here, because that will drive her away further.

[Orich]

Thats exactly my point. I know it isn't a sign of her turning around. So I couldn't figure out what it was. You hit it on the head, I think. She had already told me she could continue living in this limbo like this because it doesn't affect her, she has no feelings for me. Family gatherings, days out with the boys, dinner together each night. I am conflicted, though. I like the idea because of the kids and possibly being there as her heart softens (if, if, I know, IF) but also it is hard for me to not be in the romantic relationship. I miss that terribly. But I have her as a friend. So stay in limbo, keep DBing, LRTing and hoping while I become a better stronger person? Or push for closure, move on, try to find another romantic relationship? It's tough, but I kinda lean twords staying.

[Thinker]

So stay in limbo, keep DBing, LRTing and hoping while I become a better stronger person? Or push for closure, move on, try to find another romantic relationship? It's tough, but I kinda lean twords staying.

If you look at the bottom of my signature, you can see what my recommendation is.

[Orich]

Excellent.

[Thinker]

Just got a text from my W: "I got a babysitter for us tonight. I want to go see a movie."

It makes me happy - I want to go - but to your point Orich, this is one of the things that would drive me crazy. I would think "She wants a date! She wants to work on things!" and I would start building expectations. Then she would start talking about D and I would be crushed.

It's a bit of a juggling act, but I am starting to be able to compartmentalize. On one side, I have to accept that she is not (currently) interested in me Romantically, and on the other side accept that she still wants to be part of a couple and to do things as a couple.

[Greek]

Sounds like Mrs. Thinker might be focusing on the partnership a little here I wonder how much she liked that bit where you included her - sort of called her by name - to attend the family function with her. BTW...what is her relationship with your FOO been like?
Cheers~~~

[Sara]

Funny, when the conversation is dating, everyone says, "you are married til you are divorced." So, when the subject is doing things with your spouse, why be confused? The same thing applies. You are married til you are divorced. Go to dinner, go to the movies, go camping with friends, you are a married couple, that's who you should go with. How is this different than the other discussion?

[Thinker]

Greek,

In response to your question re my W and my Family:

We have always gotten along pretty well with each other's families. Her family is larger, more boisterous, and people in it tend to get angry, yell, etc. My family is smaller, quieter, and more introspective (Ya Think!! : ). Both families are pretty inclusive of in-laws and since we got married she has always been a part of our family events and vice versa.

There has been some tension between Mrs. Thinker and my sister in the past, and my mother (being very passive aggressive) annoys Mrs. Thinker to no end. For the most part, however, everyone gets along.

My family events are a bit uncomfortable for her simply because the families are different. It is also clear that she would always rather be with her family and resents (a bit) those holidays we spend with my family. She keeps score - how much time with my family, how much with hers, etc. and can get angry / resentful if she thinks she is getting shortchanged in the time we spend with her family.

She has also told me once (during MC) that I "used to treat her family like sh_t". She was emotional and overstating at the time (I was always polite and respectful) but she meant that I did not make a big effort to get to know her family members, did not really court her parents approval, prioritized work over time spent with her family, preferred spending time with my family, etc. Fixing this has been one of the changes I made (now I get accused of being too perfect in the eyes of her family )

My family knows that things are not going well, and a while ago I had to ask them to back off a bit because they all started being overly solicitous, overly nice to her, etc. It was putting her under a lot of pressure.

[Thinker]

@Sara,

I agree with you completely.

I think the confusion comes in two forms:

First, there is a lot of DB advice out there that says "Don't be so available, be busy, be mysterious, don't jump at every invitation, etc" People hear this and say "He/she invited me, should I go??"

Second is the confusion I was referring to - "How can he / she be Ding me AND inviting me out at the same time??" Until you keep the romantic relationship (or lack thereof) and your partnership as a couple separate and compartmentalized, the LBS has a lot of trouble here.

[volleydog]

My question is, and I've gotten mixed advice on this, does it affect the kids positively or negatively? I know the kids want their parents together but does it give the kids hope that the parents are going to get back together...If they've already been told about the D.