Hello Fran, Although I have been following your thread, I think this is the first time I've actually posted to you.
Your talking 'out loud' about considering taking off your ring to shake things up a bit...brought back a story from from a page in my rollercoaster ride to mind, that I thought I'd share with you...in Reader's Digest form.
Last Valentines Day, which as it turned out was during our failed recon attempt of last fall)my H and I were on our way out for the day and as we approached the bridge we have to cross to get where we were going...I asked H to give me his ring. Perplexed he looked at me and took it off and handed it to me. As we got to the center of the bridge, I opened the window and tossed the ring out. He was SHOCKED to say the least and asked to know why on earth I'd done that....I looked at him quite calmly and said, "That ring was a symbol of our commitment to each other. YOU betrayed that commitment, you even had the nerve to wear that ring while it was on some other woman's body. That ring was rendered as meaningless as our vows when you chose to do that to us." He didn't say a word and he's never brought it up again. I still don't wear my ring either and I wouldn't dream of wearing one unless and until it actually has some real meaning to it again. But that's just crazy me. T2
I follow your thread too! It's hard keeping up around here isn't it?
I actually took the plunge and told H what I had been thinking. That I wanted to take the ring off because it was a symbol of taking him for granted. He didn't understand at first and the kids were around so we couldn't get into a deep conversation.
Later he asked me what I meant, I said I just felt like sometimes being married seemed like a chore, like cleaning the house and paying the bills and looking after the kids. I reminded him that when we ML the other night he called me "girlfriend" and that I want to feel like we are boyfriend and girlfriend. That we are here because we want to be not because we have to be.
I think he understood. He understood that it wasn't a negative gesture, that it was a symbol of trying harder. I put it back on though the next day - LOL.
Fran
if we can be sufficient to ourselves, we need fear no entangling webs Erica Jong
Hi All, Just as I think I am going to get to hang out on the board for a while DD(2) is sick. She has a fever and is restless. Wednesday is my only night when I can get an uninteruppted couple of hours on the board, and stand any chance of bumping into a few of you wonderful people awake at the same time as me.
Anyhow it is 10.20pm here and I got about 2-3 hours decent sleep last night and it looks like tonight will be no better so party on without me guys.
take care
Fran
if we can be sufficient to ourselves, we need fear no entangling webs Erica Jong
As you can see I don't get to be here much. We had our internet access cut off over the weekend so that didn't help.
I am picking up a vibe on the BB at the moment which is chiming in with my own mood. At least I'm not the only one going through a yucky patch. H is being nice as pie at the moment coming out with plenty of ILYs and other pleasant comments. Trouble is I don't feel like saying it back. I'm not really sure what is going on with me at the moment but I feel like I am just going through the motions not engaged here. Feel like I could end up being WAW. Like I've thrown my life away on him and he is just a waste of space. Not sure where all this negativity is coming from Just don't feel right in this R and don't feel like it will ever be right.
Maybe too much focus on R and DBing for me and maybe I should shift that elsewhere, get going with other stuff so I am not constantly niggling away at the problem of R and just get on with other things in life.
Fran
if we can be sufficient to ourselves, we need fear no entangling webs Erica Jong
Yeah, sometimes I wonder if we all have been fighting so hard for our M and then when it seems that we "won" that battle, we think "is this the grandprize?"
Do you know that show, "Let's make a deal?" We were hoping for a car but got a sack of potatoes instead.
The one constant is change. When you feel yucky, just know that that feeling will change. Hang in there. I think your in the valley right now but the hills are coming. You know, the ups and downs of M.
I haven't been here for a while, I've been trying not to obsess about the R too much so decided to stay away for a bit.
My H is bugging the hell out of me at the moment. So I feel the need to vent a bit.
I am trying to keep the kids (S4, d2) on track, not let them run the show and have recently read a couple of (more) books about child-rearing. One of which is the manipulative child. The title is kind of off-putting I suppose but in fact I think it is a gold-mine of good information about keeping kids on track. Anyway H now thinks I am bullying the kids especially S and is sticking up in their defence the whole time When he is not around the kids and I are fine and they do (more or less) what I need them to and we get along great and have fun too. When H is around I only need to say one little thing and he is immediately there contradicting me or "softening the blow" like he is trying to protect them from me. Example: yesterday I took scissors away from D(2) while I went downstairs and put them up where she could not get them but S(4) could reach. I could hear them muttering together and felt pretty sure S was getting scissors back for her. Anyway later on D came out of bath, H still in bathroom with S and I saw the scissors in her seat and the top cut off the teat of her bottle. So I asked her "who gave you the scissors back?", she named her brother. So I called out to S "Did you give the scissors back when I took them away". He says No so I say "I think you did". Straightaway H is backing him up, if he said he didn't then he didn't, just because D says he did doesn't mean he did it, she would say that etc. (I wish there was a roll your eyes up to heaven icon here). Anyway I left it and later talked to S about the scissors, he admitted he had taken them back down.
This is just one among many examples this weekend, seems like every time I tell S to do something, H is there telling him it’s OK he doesn’t have to. This morning I could hear the kids chatting to each other in their room, they chatted for about 10-15 mins before S came into us and said he was wet (in other words, peed the bed). Because they had been happily talking for so long before S came in to us I was suspicious that he had peed the bed while he was awake, because usually if he does this he comes straight in to me to change him etc. So I asked S about when exactly he had peed and he said it was while he was talking to D. I told him (not overly sternly) that he shouldn’t wet the bed, that he is old enough to get out of bed and use potty etc, then I asked him to take the sheets off the bed himself, which he did (with a few grumbles). H decided S was just confused (huh?)
The way he defends S so much makes me think he is using S as some kind of example of himself. (I know he feels S and himself have a lot in common). He allows S to play the poor little me act far more than necessary, in the same way he will play his own poor little me act. If I try to get S to shape up a bit H is on my case. The most annoying part is that I know S is capable of so much more and he does behave well and look after himself, and D and help me out when H is not around. He only reverts to the baby act for H, H then thinks he is doing this because he is feeling sad and vulnerable because I am being overbearing. Some days this week H has looked at me in the morning like he is leaving the kids with a child abuser. It is soooo far from true I could just scream.
Just to add to the mix, last night when D woke up about 2am I was trying to settle her and H banged on the wall or the bed or something (as if saying shut that racket up!). So I call out to him "Thankyou, that helps". With that D quiets down, so he says "It does actually". I am laughing now but let me tell you I was not laughing last night. The kids got in our bed this morning and were climbing about and jumping over us. H acts like they are not there and he is some kind of log. Sunday morning is the one morning a week when he is supposed to get up with kids so I can have a lie in. Finally D jumps on H which actually hurts or something, so he sits up suddenly, growls at her and flounces off. D is in tears. 15 mins later he is finally back to get kids out of my hair. So much for ME being the child abuser. At least when I am stern with the kids, there is cause, I am not doing it just because I am feeling pissy. AAAAAARRRRRRRRRRRRGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!
Sorry about the long vent, I just needed to get this off my chest.
Fran
if we can be sufficient to ourselves, we need fear no entangling webs Erica Jong
Thanks for your post. H has to live with himself if he is lying. I will not take on that burden!
I agree with you about the parenting. You and your H need to talk about it when the kids are not around. Can your H agree to back you up until you 2 can talk privately? That's parenting 101, not to let the kids work the 2 of you and that will happen if he keeps undermining you.
I'm with you all the way. I wish I had better advice. My H and I agree with parenting, that's about the only thing that isn't an effort these days.
Just don't feel right in this R and don't feel like it will ever be right. 
When he is not around the kids and I are fine and they do (more or less) what I need them to and we get along great and have fun too. When H is around I only need to say one little thing and he is immediately there contradicting me or "softening the blow" like he is trying to protect them from me. Example: yesterday I took scissors away from D(2) while I went downstairs and put them up where she could not get them but S(4) could reach. I could hear them muttering together and felt pretty sure S was getting scissors back for her. Anyway later on D came out of bath, H still in bathroom with S and I saw the scissors in her seat and the top cut off the teat of her bottle. So I asked her "who gave you the scissors back?", she named her brother. So I called out to S "Did you give the scissors back when I took them away". He says No so I say "I think you did". Straightaway H is backing him up, if he said he didn't then he didn't, just because D says he did doesn't mean he did it, she would say that etc. (I wish there was a roll your eyes up to heaven icon here). Anyway I left it and later talked to S about the scissors, he admitted he had taken them back down.