Anyway, I agree wholeheartedly that AFWAW shouldn't date until he is D. I wouldn't put it past his WAW to turn HIM in for "cheating" on her.
Silverado
AFWAW, Listen to Silverado...
Please. Even a perception of an improper relationship will ruin your career. You are in a great position to be promoted at least one more time...do not ruin it...I know you know what I am talking about.
When I was 26, a 40-yr-old man in an unhappy marriage told me that he was getting divorced and asked me out. I told him that I was sorry about his marriage, and that I wished him well in bringing that relationship to a close and building his new life. I also said that I was flattered that he asked me out, but that I wouldn't consider beginning a R with him until his divorce was final and he was living on his own. I knew enough to make wise choices for myself at that age. I know many girls who aren't that wise, and no matter how I've tried to counsel them, they will make their own decisions and suffer the consequences. Funny... That man didn't get divorced until 10 years later when he finally found a woman that would seriously date him (not just have sex with him) while he was still married. He just couldn't find the b*lls to leave and stand on his own two feet without having a woman to hold his hand through the transition. He hasn't spent one day as a man who stands on his own. This is NOT a differentiated man.
John,
While I agree that you should not jeopardize your career and let it become yet another casualty of your W's vagina, I am more concerned about the fact that you are incapable of getting rid of your W based on her disgusting, lowlife behavior *without finding a girl to use as a crutch.* You are emotionally fused, and if you haven't read Passionate Marriage by Scharch, it should be a priority.
You haven't taken a moment to decide what you want in your next woman because all you want is to have your W back. This 27-yr-old hit on YOU. You were not seeking her out. You let your W dictate everything and you respond to the first woman that comes on to you. I worry about the type of woman that you attract, frankly. What is wrong with the 27-yr-old that she even wants to get with a man who hasn't even filed for D yet....
1. Come to a resolution about WHAT YOU WANT. UNTIL you determine what you want in your life, even if there are a couple of prioritized scenarios, YOU ARE LACKING SUBSTANCE AS A PERSON.
2. If you want your W, fight for your W. Don't be a scumbag and use a girl (I don't care WHAT age) to get back at her or to get her to come running. Nothing wrong with being dark and making her wonder. The 27-yr-old may want to get married and have babies someday... Don't use her like garbage just because your W uses you like garbage. Don't ruin karma for your sweet daughter.
3. If you are DONE (God please please please make this man done,) tell your W she's out and file for D. Be a noble man and do things cleanly and dignified. THEN, start formulating what you wish for in a woman. I would hope the characteristics of your new woman look a bit different from your W.
Your W has really done a number on you. I am astonished to see how willing you are to lower yourself to her level. Don't be a snake. Be the proud man that your daughter looks up to.
All of my input to you is from my heart even though it is harsh and may not be what you want to hear. It is what I would tell my boy if he were in your shoes. I am begging you to please rise above all of this filth and game playing. You don't belong there, John.
I am praying that you stay the dignified course.
I am praying that you get over your W and that you tell her what's what. Sorry to be harsh, but... She is DIRTY, man, stay outta there.
I am praying for a very GOOD and loving woman (who happens to be hot) to grace your life and show you and your daughter that these mythical magical creatures DO exist. I know they exist because I and many of my beautiful friends are GOOD and DECENT and LOVING and HOT too!
There is a better place for you and your daughter, and it is up to you to put you and your babe in that better place. Protect you and protect her.
I am astonished to see how willing you are to lower yourself to her level. Don't be a snake. Be the proud man that your daughter looks up to.
Not a bit of truth to those statements.
Time to be happy and do what YOU want to do. There isn't one bit of truth that you are "lowering" yourself just because you decide to head in a more positive and smarter direction and deciding to stop trying to win a woman back that cheats, lies and gives you the run around.
It IS NOT being a snake to go out with a woman that wants to go out with you. It doesn't mean you are using somebody for a crutch just because you decide you WANT to see her.
I know plenty of women that are younger than their husbands that things worked out very very well. I know plenty of younger women that are dating or dated older men that were very happy.
I realy don't think the women on here have much room to talk about making wise decisions when their very own husbands are in an affair. Does that mean that nobody should get married since their marriages are not working out?
As I keep telling you. There is NOTHING wrong with you. There hasn't been. You have only thought that there was something wrong with you because of what your wife has done.
Your WIFE is the one that is the snake and has lowered herself. NOT YOU. IT is a total lie and a way of tryingt o control what you do that anybody could evfen hint that you are a snake or you are lowering yourself by taking another path because you CHOOSE to after what has transpired. A man that is a snake is one who is pursuing other women when his wife or lover thinks she is in an exclusive relationship. A man who is a snake PURPOSELY lies to both women to have his cake and eat it too....
Don't let other opinions and control tactics discourage you.
You are a fine man that has tried his best to work this out with your wife. Your WIFE is the snake in this. You have nothing to feel "guilty" about. NOTHING. Your WIFE has chosen this route and now you are accepting it.
Don't buy into the naysayers and gloom and doomers. They are trying to bring you down and push their morals on you. Nobody is tellng them to date or not to date.
Gucci: Not that you have any interest, but my marriage is working out. My husband has never cheated on me. I was a near WAW who found this board that saved my marriage. I'm not a miserable woman who is trying to bring John down. I'm trying to help him move forward in a healthy way.
John is not a snake but he have the option to be one if he chooses to start his own affair for the wrong reasons. Dating with the intention of moving on from a decided divorce is different.
This isn't naysaying and gloom and doom. I'm trying to help John live a life without regrets. His daughter is watching him.
My God, Gucci. What are YOUR morals? How could you think these things of me? Do you hate women or what?
As I keep telling you. There is NOTHING wrong with you. There hasn't been. You have only thought that there was something wrong with you because of what your wife has done.
I have been helping to save relationships for years and years. I have a wonderful wife and marriage. Just wonderful. I came on here to help save relationships. I have studied and observed for years how to save them. I have read anything and everything on relationships. I have spreadsheets of who comes on these types of sites. I have data to back up what I have found works the best.(around 6% success rate on this site using the "hang in there method)(quite low I might add) The success rate is much higher with other methods, according to the "data" and reality I have observed. I have personal relationship experience with women.(and it confirmed what I have found works) I was very successful with women when I dated. I have helped many of my friends, many women or men that I have worked with over the years and yada yada yada.. I have helped my own children when they have come to me for relationship advice.....
So, I DO know what I am talking about. You are making a lot of assumptions. You ARE trying to bring John down. I have observerd you on Kevin's thread. I have seen you say to Kevin "WHO CARES WHAT SHE THINKS"....
Same goes for me. I don't care what YOU think. For you to try and push your opinions as the "correct" or "moral" or "more healthy" way is just not true.I think it is quite rude of you to try and make this about your way being the "correct or moral" way. On top of that you were a near WAW. I can't see where you have room to tell me or others about morals.
Now you want to try and use the "hate women" card. Won't work. I love my wife dearly. I have a great marriage....
However... IF.. IF she had an affar and was doing what John's wife was doing... I WOULD follow the advice I give. I would not hesitate to tell her I don't share, I would not hesitate to date others if I so chose. There is nothing wrong with me NOW. I already know I can live alone. I already know that I am not perfect,but if she leaves or has an affair, that it is HER issue. I am already healthy. This makes YOUR ADVICE WRONG.
I don't really agree with the way your are handling Kevin on his thread. I don't see your advice working over there. I believe you should have stopped posting to him a LONG time ago. You seem to keep wasting your time with him, but keep coming back for more. Do you hate men so much and you know Keving will keep taking your 2x4's and yelling at him and telling him how stupid he is and such?
I don't approve of people that try to use their argument and self righteousness of "moral" highground.
Johns' wife is the one who is wrong in all of this, and not John. He has no reason in the world to have regrets at this point whether he dates or doesn't date. It is long past regret time. It is the farthest thing in the world from the truth that he would be a snake by going out with this woman now.
HE would find out very very quickly how silly he has been in the last few months, once he actually has experience with another relationship opportunity.He would suddenly feel as healthy as ever. He would suddenly feel joy again. Hope again... Now THAT is HEALTHY
I really don't think it is your responsibility to tell him when to date or if he should date. He does not need your permission or my permission. It doesn't mean he is a snake just because you say so.
It doesn't mean I have less morals than you because my way works better than yours. You seem quiter angry about this subject. You seem quite angry on Kevin's thread. Maybe you need to do some personal work. Do you take 2x4's as well as you give them?
You must not be there yet. When he gets there he will KNOW how much he has grown. Introspection doesn't mean we have to constantly look at faults or beat up on ourselves. It also can mean we accept ourselves as we should accept others. It is time for John to start giving himself the correct self talk. "There is nothing wrong with me now. I only thought that there was something wrong with me because my wife rejected me and rejection hurt my self esteem."'
Tiume to stop beating up on himself and calling it introspection.
It is a good feeling and very mature when you can get to the point that you can accept yourself unconditionally and be able to tell yourself that you ARE ok. Just the way you are....
You must not be there yet. When he gets there he will KNOW how much he has grown. Introspection doesn't mean we have to constantly look at faults or beat up on ourselves. It also can mean we accept ourselves as we should accept others.
It is a good feeling and very mature when you can get to the point that you can accept yourself unconditionally and be able to tell yourself that you ARE ok. Just the way you are....
Would you prefer that we beat ourselves up?
Growth never stops.
I agree with all of that. Still, so many people just move on without really making any changes and just relive the same sh*t over and over. Each situation is unique.
John, My advice has nothing to do with morals...it is because you are an active duty SNCO in the USAF. Even if you do not know it there are CMSgt's and 0-6s looking at you and asking questions of your CC and Chief's to consider your stratification among the other SNCOs...with your Bronze Star you will rank high.
Have you been able to decide what you want to do? You really only have one option if you can settle down and think about it...are you going to continue to accept her attitude or not? If not go file and ASK for everything and I mean everything...it is much easier to "give" back than it is to try and ask her for help later...
gucci loafer...for the record. I think you are correct...but AFWAW (as is his wife who is also a SNCO) is in a position where he could be punished or marked down on his performance report and ruin his career if he were to become involved with another woman right now...and should he get a poor reputation as a SNCO he will have trouble finding a civilian job...as big as it is the Air Force is small and everyone knows someone who knows someone who knows your business...there is much more to this than just finding another girlfriend...as long as he is still married.
