K4D Rising #2

[Puppy Dog Tails]

I thought I might be making a tiny bit of progress with W based on last nights conversation. Am I reading things wrong? Is it possible I haven't made any and I just think I have? She isn't angry with me anymore. She is just still uncomfortable spending one on one time without the kids right now. But she did say she has noticed some changes.

Kevin

There's your clue, Kev.

'nuff said. Move on back to focusing on YOU.

Puppy

[CityGirl]

See, this is why I really do feel you are not understanding what you need to be doing.

Everything you do seems to revolve around what sort of progress you may be making with your W. Since that is ALWAYS your focus then you are halting any progress on yourself.

You keep saying she let the D go. Yes, for now she did. As much as I hate to say this you need to think of the worst case scenario as to why she let the D go. It will help you detach. Lets say she let the D go for her financial gain. You will have more income this year and she might be losing her job while you may be keeping yours. So, she lets the D go for now so when she does file she wont owe any support and actually may be able to get support from you. Or, lets say she is shopping around for something better (another man) and knows you will sit around and wait. If nothing better comes along then maybe you are her fallback. Both cases suck but if you think in those terms you will detach much faster.

You are like a detective, always looking for clues about your W and that puts you in a place where you have NO CLUE about you.

Honestly, until you take your W out of the equation nothing will change. Big deal she is not angry anymore. What does she want.. a cookie?

As far as you not wanting to plant seeds in her head about where you may have been going with an overnight bag it just goes to show you want to control what she thinks. Who cares what she thinks? You are a grown man who was kicked out of his house and told you were no longer wanted. Where you go overnight is no business of hers. She can think what she likes and a little mystery never hurt anybody. You owe her no explanation. EVER.

[25yearsmlc]

Kev,

When people said you two deserve each other, in case you didn't catch the intent, it was not meant as a compliment. It's b/c you both play crazy sick games with each other.

Re-read CG's post b/c it was very clear. You are in denial about your w's motives AND you shouldn't focus on them anyhow, but what's ironic is that you DO focus on her motives AND then you get them wrong! Stop it. No divorce yet...so what? You keep thinking she changed her mind but didn't tell you? Really? You think she'd hide that? You think she's testing you? And if only you do such and such, that all will be well and it will happen FAST!!! BUT of course, she isn't telling you this? Couldn't it be Kevin, that she is indifferent to it and that it serves HER purposes to not get the divorce yet? Couldn't it be that she likes the control this gives her over you? God knows you won't do ANYTHING that remotely suggests getting a spine, or disagreeing with her or not obeying her, b/c she knows you are terrified she'll file again...isn't that just as likely? Isn't it more likely?
and if we are all wrong, and are all missing these signs of wonderful things to come around the corner, my "guess" is that it is we remember some things YOU forget fast b/c you were not at her birthday just a few DAYS ago b/c she excluded you, and you were not welcome to be around ANY of her family just a few DAYS ago..b/c [i]she excluded you, but she saw fit to tell you about the sex she hoped to have with OM....did we imagine this? are we making it up or confusing your w with someone else? It that the behavior of someone who is progressing towards reconciling with you? (no it is not).

.... Isn't it true that SHE did not want you around but has been using her mother as the excuse and confessed this to you??? Didn't that happen in the past 10 days? Did this happen or are we all hallucinating? [/i] but b/c you both comforted the troubled child, you see HOPE?? Sorry Kevin, but I see a concerned mother who spent a few minutes in the same room as you...period. You have NO patience and you know this is a huge obstacle in your life. So fix it!

That's why you see small signs of civility and pity (and her need to feel magnanimous towards you in front of the kids especially so she can tell herself and the kids, she's the one who took the high road and you are the needy clingy one she still has NO respect for -- but you see that comforting of d7 as something to JUMP ON...

Kevin, arguing about the hotel issue is ridiculous. How can you NOT See this? You think you looked stronger to your w by making that choice? Two things to say to that; 1) you should NOT care what the heck she thinks of your choices; and 2) once again, you guessed wrongly anyhow. She did NOT respect your choice; she looked good in front of the kids and felt good about her pitying gesture towards you...but back to #1...who cares what she thought? Can't you say "no" to her one time? Why oh why do you ask for our opinion only to ignore it one day later? What did you think that discussion we had was about? You waste my time and energy. Can't you grasp the concept of detachment?

You don't seem capable of restraint of any kind around her...and the whole post about delayed gratification--read that again Kevin b/c I put a lot of time into that. If you could learn how to do that and detach, you would solve 90% of your problems...

of course they would lead you to go to AA meetings and c and btw, have you gone to ANY AA meetings yet? How many people will need to say that and how many times, before you'll go? We know you agreed it was a good idea but the thing is, for YOU, agreeing to do something and then actually DOING it, are FAR FAR APART... so why not tell us now, will it be 4 of us saying it 23 times, or what? You know, before you actually do it? Like the c? That was 9 of us saying it >45 times....with you agreeing EARLY ON to doing it...so how long and how many of us will it take this time? I can't say you'll have all of them around, my guess is you won't...but what do you think it will take for you to DO a thing you agree to do...

Lastly, for the record, For you to fear that she might think you have a gf or that you have moved on and GAL, if you act like it, OR DO IT, is hilarious. So is the idea that it would hurt your chances of a reconciliation...Kevin, you don't get this whole concept of GAL and revealing nothing to her about your life, b/c you are GAL and it is not any of her business, at all? DO you? She will never worry about you GAL or not wanting a reconciliation....she will never worry that you are not waiting and waiting for her. She has no reason to move towards you b/c she is exploring "other options" (OMs) and you made it perfectly clear you are waiting there, in case she some day changes her mind... She does not fear you GAL or moving on at all. (Good God, we wish. )
You are SO predictable.
Re-read CG's last post, the post I wrote about learning to delay gratification-a life skill which you sorely needed two decades ago and need now more than ever, and the piece on Detachment over and over...and good luck.
j-

[K4D]

Well, let me at least clear one thing up. I never said my W told me she was going to have sex for her birthday. What I said was that she had dinner plans with a friend that is flying back in from out of town. The only friend she has that travels is OM. She had sex with him for his birthday. So my thinking was that he was probably going to return the favor. But she never once said anything about having sex with him.

I don't have anything to offer to her to make her want to come back. I don't have any boundaries that if I set would mean a of beans to her. She doesn't need me for anything. She doesn't love me. And she doesn't want me. I can set whatever boundaries I want. It isn't going to affect her one way or the other.

As far as the rest goes, I am so tired of being in limbo. I want to ask her so badly why she held off on the D and what her plan is. But I know that would be bad. I guess you all are right. Her actions just last week don't show a softening of the heart. She is out tonite with D7 and the 55 year old guy riding bikes. They are spending quite a bit of time together these days. I wonder if his W even knows. Eventually one thing can lead to another even with the age difference.

So yes, back to me. I stopped in at the church and prayed again. I came home and made dinner for myself. I baked a peice of chicken and had some ritz crackers. And I don't have didly to do tonite so maybe I will just read and pray some more. At least my AC works now.

I am still keeping faith. And yes, I will reread those things again. And I am thinking of going to an AA meeting on Friday night since I have D7 tonite.

Kevin

[MrBond]

"I don't have any boundaries that if I set would mean a of beans to her. She doesn't need me for anything. She doesn't love me. And she doesn't want me. I can set whatever boundaries I want. It isn't going to affect her one way or the other."

This is what you don't understand. The boundaries are for you. Not for her. You make a boundary like, I will not be insulted by my W. It's not going to stop her from doing it, but it empowers you to walk away before she starts. Again, all of your efforts are revolving around what SHE does.

On top of that, you don't have to keep mentioning she doesn't love you, want you, need you, etc. It sounds like you're purposely punishing yourself as a kind of penance. You're destroying your own self esteem by doing so each time.

[25yearsmlc]

"I don't have any boundaries that if I set would mean a of beans to her. She doesn't need me for anything. She doesn't love me. And she doesn't want me. I can set whatever boundaries I want. It isn't going to affect her one way or the other."

This is what you don't understand. The boundaries are for you. Not for her.

POOF! THIS IS IT KEVIN...DO YOU UNDERSTAND THIS? THE BOUNDARIES ARE NOT ABOUT HER... IT'S LIKE HOW GAL IS NOT ABOUT HER OR GETTING HER BACK...IT'S ABOUT YOU. IF YOU CANNOT UNDERSTAND THIS, OR THAT THE ONLY WAY TO GET HER BACK - IS TO LET HER GO AND MOVE ON WITH YOUR LIFE, THEN YOU ARE DOOMED...And we are definitely wasting our time...Do you understand this Kevin? Please tell us yes or no.

You make a boundary like, I will not be insulted by my W. It's not going to stop her from doing it, but it empowers you to walk away before she starts. Again, all of your efforts are revolving around what SHE does.

Same old same old. What has changed?

On top of that, you don't have to keep mentioning she doesn't love you, want you, need you, etc. It sounds like you're purposely punishing yourself as a kind of penance. You're destroying your own self esteem by doing so each time.

Kevin- you go from one extreme to the other and that is odd. You go from thinking you are a step or two away from a reconciliation based on a few minutes of decent behavior with w, OR to how little you mean and what a piece of nothing you are to her. Why the mood swings? Have you discussed the meds you take with your doctor? Have you discussed these outlooks of yours? They are really telling to me. Such huge swings. Both are unlikely to be accurate. Get some balance And moderation. Maybe that is a key for you.
j-

[Puppy Dog Tails]

Yep.

[K4D]

Oh. I was thinking the boundaries were for W. I guess I didn't realize they were for me. I understand that GAL is for me.

I thought that maybe I was making some progress with her after our talk last night and how nice she was. But after listening to you all and even my BIL telling me the same thing you all said that her recent actions don't suggest anything that I started thinking that I had read things wrong. What you all said makes sense and I guess I just thought or wanted to think that maybe we were getting somewhere but with baby steps. But the truth is, she does not contact me at all even now unless it has something to do with the kids. For instance I can see her on IM right now. But she isn't talking to me. During the day it is the same way. Not a peep unless it has to do with the kids. Meanwhile, I know that she is chatting it up with other people. I guess I just wanted to believe that maybe we were getting somewhere. Perhaps we are not.

I thought maybe there was a crack in the brick wall because she isn't resenting me anymore. But she still isn't initiating talking either. Maybe it really was nothing more than pity again.

Kevin

[K4D]

Do you understand this Kevin? Please tell us yes or no.

Yes.

Kevin

[25yearsmlc]

Well life must totally suck again...

Kevin, read about detachment. Get a grip. See your doctor and a c asap. Take care of your kids. Stop thinking about your wife so much. Stop taking the imaginary temperature of the R b/c you have no concept of it, so don't take it for a few months/years....

Live your life as if you are not going to be with her for a long long time, and yet will be happy, and as if it will be a long journey like you keep saying you know...WELL -DO IT.

(SIGHS)
j-