K4D Rising #2

[K4D]

I did call my father, brother and BIL for fathers day. I did not look at this as being manipulative. I looked at it as making her aware of the impact that it is having on the kids. If it came across as manipulative, then that was not my intention.

It did not honestly look to me like she was putting it together though. I am not trying to control her or manipulate her.

But I do think that she needs to realize the real impact of this.

Ugg... Probably a big setback. And yes I did go to the C yesterday. And yes he recommended AA because they teach you coping skills there.

Kevin

[CityGirl]

It is not your job to make your W aware of things. You have no way of knowing how your kids act around your W when you are not there. For all you know they could be jolly and just fine. Or maybe not. Either way if they are NOT acting fine your W *is* aware and chooses to (A) do nothing or (B) not have the conversation with you.

So while your intention may have not been to manipulate or control you did just that becuase you DONT know what goes on when you are not around. What your kids tell you may not be what is actually happening. Trust me, kids know how to manipulate both parents during a divorce.

Instead of trying to make your W aware (control/manipulation) you should have just said... "W, D7 seems to be having some adjustement issues and I feel she needs to get back to counseling". Simple. You used an "I" statement and it was all you without any attempt to make her aware.

[K4D]

Here is how my night went.

W came over to my apartment to get some stuff for D7. She brought food over also and we had a good friendly chat. She noticed how hot it is in my apartment because the AC is having problems. She asked that I come stay at her house for the night and asked why I didn't ask to come over. I said I didn't want to impose. It is hot at night and I do sweat. I dropped off the key this afternoon so the complex can get in and fix it. So W insists that I come stay with her and tells me I can sleep in D7's bed since D7 will sleep with her. I say ok. Beats paying for a hotel room or sweating at the apartment.

So we come over to W's house and eat cake and I help her load the bikes in the van so her and D7 can go biking tomorrow. I also help with the trash and there is a friend bringing over a golden retriever that W will be watching for the next 3 weeks while his owners travel to India.

W tells me about her shooting range experience with this 55 year old guy and shows me her shots on the target. Cool.

Ok, so here goes. We have a status conversation after. W tells me that she is getting to the point where she can be friendly with me now and not resent me, but isn't ready to go eat lunch or grab coffee yet. She is good with doing stuff with the kids and me. She said I am turning into a decent dad but I still have some things I have to get better on such as making sure the girls don't call her late at night with their cell phone. She says things are improving between me and her but it has only been a month since I moved into my place. W tells me that tonite she would have loved for us to go to Starbucks and bring it back and chat, but its getting late.

All interesting stuff. So that is kind of where things stand right now. It sounds like I am making a tiny bit of progress with her, but it is literally baby steps. Again, its a long journey back.

D7 is excited about the dog being here. She is playing with him.

Its nice to sleep in AC.

This is going to be a very loooong journey. No question it will be at least a year or 2 at the earliest I think before I can even think of seeing any real progress.

Kevin

[K4D]

Oh, and she said that it looks like I am getting a life and making friends and that is really good to see. I guess that is the perception she has since I still haven't really gotten a true life yet. But she seems to think that I always have plans.

Also she said nothing about earlier. She has just been friendly all night.

Kevin

[K4D]

She also didn't bring up the D or it being dismissed either. All in all I'd say things are doing ok at the moment. They are actually doing better than I ever thought to be honest. Interesting that she thinks I am getting a life and is glad to see that.

Kevin

[25yearsmlc]

I did call my father, brother and BIL for fathers day.
Good. Do you know why I asked you that?
I did not look at this as being manipulative. I looked at it as making her aware of the impact that it is having on the kids.
Oh Gee Kev, you were just trying to teach her a lesson...you were just showing her that there are consequences to her behavior....gosh, NO ONE has ever said that here before..Nope, no one ever tried to justify their manipulation..you are SO different than other people are with their controlling manipulations...

Kevin, it's exactly like we said. It's a form of control & pressure, and pursuit, regardless, none of those things like teaching her a lesson, or showing her the consequences of her actions, ARE YOUR JOB anyhow...period.

Life and God do that, not you. And lest you forget, (again), you have plenty of your own work to do. I notice she doesn't spend any time reminding you of that. She has let you go and she doesn't go on and on about what you did wrong, or now need to learn and what she thinks you need to know about the kids, etc.

It's just not your job to be teaching her much of anything nor would she learn it from you even if it were your job. Why don't you get that?


If it came across as manipulative, then that was not my intention.

It did, and intent is irrelevant. Learn to see other POV's or you're doomed to this forever. Use some empathy, so you can realize how you come across. Maybe you'll get that tool from your c or AA or somewhere. But you need to get it.

It did not honestly look to me like she was putting it together though. I am not trying to control her or manipulate her.

Yes you are. See above. And so what if you don't think she is "putting it together". So You are reading her mind and then deciding what else should be in that mind...you just wanted her to think some things that you think...hello Kevin, THAT IS MANIPULATION and CONTROL AND PURSUIT...if that is not the definition, what is?

But I do think that she needs to realize the real impact of this.

Really? You think that? Then I guess YOU ARE TRYING TO SHOW HER...ever wonder if she thought you should have "realized the real impact of your past behavior..."?? At least she doesn't rub your nose in this and say "see what YOU have done Kevin!" Hey, while it may take two, you're lucky she doesn't throw things in your face that way. She could.

Ugg... Probably a big setback. And yes I did go to the C yesterday. And yes he recommended AA because they teach you coping skills there.

Kevin

Hope you go. And listen and implement- so that actual change occurs. Better happen really soon.
j-

[Silent Chrleader]

Hey, 25yearsmlc (Sorry K4D for the hi-jack!!). Can you stop over by my thread if you can? Having a tough day.....

[25yearsmlc]

She also didn't bring up the D or it being dismissed either. All in all I'd say things are doing ok at the moment. They are actually doing better than I ever thought to be honest. Interesting that she thinks I am getting a life and is glad to see that.

Kevin

Why did you accept the offer to stay over??? You asked us yesterday what to do if it happened and We ALL said in answer TO YOUR question about this, "NOT SOON"! We made NO impact on you. Why ask us??

Then You said, "Beats spending money on a hotel"...no Kevin, it does not. You had a perfect opportunity to spend some money wisely, man up and take care of yourself. She made sure she had the power of HER kindness and your gratitude again but without giving you what you wanted....making sure you know where you really stand, as in, "the div is so NOT important to her that it slipped her mind BUT HEY, she does NOT want you to expect anything from her" blah blah blah...

You might have made sure this time in one fell swoop, that she knows you can and will make it with or without her...nope, you didn't.
You couldn't say "no" for ONE night...sighs

Amazing opportunity thrown in your lap...and tossed away.

J-

[MrBond]

So when is your next C appt.? I think you really need it now.

[K4D]

25,

This was a case where she truly would have thought I was an idiot for spending the money or staying at the apartment. I have seen her reactions to people who don't accept her help and she doesn't think to highly of it when she is offering a solution.

I'm not sure what you mean by "without giving me what I wanted". At best I am at the point of getting on friendlier terms with her which is further along than where it used to be. And she does think I am getting a life. I guess that equates to me not being so dependent on her so that she can feel more at ease if we are able to work things out down the road.

She did actually call me to come look at D7 last night playing with the dog. We both watched her. D7 did much better last night. I think between having us both there and having the dog there she felt better about things. Perhaps a bonding moment for me and W? Don't know.

Kevin