Can anyone answer this? Part 8

[sandi2]

The point I am trying to get across and get advice on is...
First of all, NOW this just validates the reason why my xh left. I KNOW this is probably the main reason. Our son has been spoiled and it is BOTH our faults.

Are you saying that the reason your XH left you is b/c your son is spoiled??? Surely you meant something else besides the fact that both of you are guilty of spoiling your son. People do not divorce b/c they spoil their children!

I have observed parents with spoiled children for a long time. There is a difference in what some people call "spoiling" their kids. I have seen children treated very well and yet those kids are kind, respectful, unselfish, and are willing to get an education and go to work. I have seldom seen kids who get whatever they want as often as they want it....turn out to be sucessul adults. And, btw, you do not have to be rich to have spoiled kids. Undisciplined children turn into brats. When they don't want to do anything but what "they" want. It is bad enough to see little brats, but when they are grown brats......that is very, very BAD!

Children need to be MADE to do chores around the house......and especially take care of their own things (like their room, toys, laundry, car, etc.(depending on their age)and to know what it is to put in a day's work and to helpother people; and to obey their parents without any sass,backtalk, or attitude; and to go to school or get a job. These are only a few things that need to be inforced in order to have an unspoiled brat! Brats are those kids who nobody can stand b/c of their undisciplined behavior and bad attitudes. They show no respect and don't care about anybody but themselves. Later in life when they try to have R's with other people, it usually falls apart b/c they do not have the background of maturity that they need to build any foundation upon.

Renee, you and your H waited too long to try to train your son the way he should have grown up and now you don't have many options left available to you. About the only way this kid is going to turn around is to learn from the school of hard knocks. It will either be from those who love him or those who could care less. I would think it would be better to start with those who actually care about him. They call it
"tough" love for a reason. It is hard! It will not be easy and it will not be fun for you or him. However, it is not completely too late to make adjustments in him and for his sake, I hope you will begin this week. Expect him to resist you and put up a fight. Don't fight with him, just lay down the law.......that being he can no longer live with you and he has to get out. When he asks what he's suppose to do......tell him that is his problem. Sounds cold? Listen, the more suggestions you try to offer.....the bigger the battle will get, so the less said...the better. Don't suggest anything. If he wants to know why he has to get out, tell him he is grown and it's time. Just don't fall into the trap he will throw at you. He may try to make promises......don't buy into it. This is for his good. If you prove to him that you can do this.....it will cause him to respect you.

I don't think your son or your XH has ever respected you and you have lived with that treatment for so long, it feels normal to you, but it ISN'T normal. Please do not sit back and be treated like this in your home.

Basically he stands behind son.

Oh really? Then why doesn't he have his son live with him? Let's see how much daddy stands behind his son after you tell him to find someplace else to live. I think daddy will bad-mouth you.

BUT now that xh is out of the house he thinks he doesnt have to deal with it. Should he???

The fact that you even have to ask us is a sign that you are not as strong as you need to be, Renee. Your XH thinks he is getting a free ride out of this whole deal......and so far, he has! Why boys gets as old as your son is and he's showing disrepect for his mother.....it is high time that dear old dad steps in and get's this boy's attention. I don't think he will b/c he's too focused on what he (your XH) wants at the present. But you can't help that now. All you can do is be firm and don't allow either of them to take advantage of you. I may be wrong in my assumptions but what your H called wanting everything your way, etc., was probably you just making "noise" in protest to how you were being treated all those years. I think you did not know how to stand your ground and make them respect you. You may have complained, but it did not change anything. Now may be your last chance to make a difference where your son is concerned.

After your son is out of the house, never allow him to put you or his dad in the middle of his childish situations. For an example, the way the was on the two-way radio with his dad while he was wrestling with you over the Internet modem. That is crazy. Can't you see that this is his way of playing the two parents against each other? He knows how to work that part!

Doesnt cuss me, but talks to me loudly and awful. (and where would he get that. hmmmmm).

As I told you once before......sons learn how to treat women from their dad. However, even if he learn to show you disrespect from his father.....YOU, Renee, are the one who allows him to continue. You allowed him to get away with it the first time he ever raised his voice to you. So, are you going to be the one to stop him??

Until son gets a job and gets out on his own, or if he works, he can stay here WHILE helping me out.

Renee, get real. He is not going to help out around the house. What are you going to do if he doesn't.....spank him or make him have "time out"? No, it's time he moves....period.

When I said this he got on the phone with dad and said tell her you are getting me a job, of course dad says yep. His dad has said this and said this, I dont believe nothing he says anymore.

Then why do you play this game?

I made son let me have the phone and told xh that son disrespects me and puts his finger in my face and he needs to talk to son about it. What did xh tell me????

You know what? The two of you sound like little kids squabbling over something and call daddy to tattle! What did you expect your XH to do? Really! The man can't stand you, Renee. Did you actually think he was going to chew the son out for showing you the same feelings as your XH has? He probably thought it was funny.

Well...he said "Give my son his phone back, I pay for that phone, DO NOT grab it out of his hand again"...in front of son he said this.

Well, I'm sorry.....but you deserved to hear that b/c you should know better! My gosh, what is it going to take for you to wake up? Why do you put out a welcome mat for him to say these nasty things to you? And.....this was right after you had seen him passing in the car, so I don't think he was sticking his neck out b/c he missed you and was trying to get a good look at you.

I am at the end of my rope, I dont know what to do.

I'm telling you what to do, but we'll see if you have the courage.

How in the world can I stay away from xh and let me go through MLC or whatever he is doing, when everytime my son and I argue, he gets on the phone to his dad and complains about me.

I can't believe you even said that! How can he do it??? Very easily! He does not want you any more. He does not respect you and futhermore, he will never respect you as long as you act like this. He looks at this as "your problems"....not his. Why on earth would you even expect your XH, who doesn't even like you any longer, to say anything to the son about respecting you? It would be a joke! The son knows his own father doesn't respect you and that you took that disrespect all the time he was growing up. He LEARNED how to do it from........guess who!

Like I said this is probably the main reason my xh left and when son does this, it just validates why he left.

I don't think you are being realistic here, Renee. I think you are finding "other" reasons for your H leaving.

If xh would just only say to out son to NOT disrespect me and back me up.

This is pathetic. Do you really think that your son would stop showing disrespect just b/c his dad said to? What do you call "backing you up"? Why would you expect a man, who feels by you the way your XH has made his feelings very obvious,.....support you with a 19 yr old boy? It is not going to happen, and if this experience did not teach you this, then I am afraid to think what your future is going to be like. Time to get a grip on reality and turn lose of this sorry excuse of a father and you make your son show you respect or else he can stop even coming to visit......much less think about living under your roof. You are in worse shape than I realized and you need to make drastic changes. You can do it......if you want to badly enough and have the guts to follow through and stop depending on your XH.

Sandi