GETTING UN'STUCK'

[MrBond]

Kittyfish,

Thanks. I'll see how she reacts to it. I wanted to see if she would notice that I was listening to her when she talked. We'll see how it goes when she gets them on Monday.

[MrBond]

aliveandkicking,

I think you've pointed something out very important. You may be right in that she doesn't know how to love more than one thing at a time. She didn't have a good example of it growing up and just saw her Mom doing everything.

One telling point is that she told me that when we divorced, she wouldn't go out with anyone seriously until the kids were in high school. Which is exactly what the mom did. Of course, she did chase after the OM, so I don't know how true that statement was.

I do have to find a way to break that perception of me being the "burden" and be seen as a partner/lover again. The question is how?

For now I'm going to try the GAL, attraction tips that coach/sandi suggested. They, you and everyone else was right that maybe I just need to treat her like a friend with no pressure. I just think that every time she sees me she feels "pressure" yet she doesn't leave even though she's threatened to in the past. I had already reached the point where I told her go ahead. But she hasn't.

[MrBond]

robx,

Thanks for the suggestion. I'll have to try it after we get much, much closer. THAT will definitely be seen as pressure. Just know from experience. She already gives me an uncomfortable look when I ask how her day was.

I don't think she'll let me touch her feet.

In terms of the massage stuff. Just in general she has a very low pain threshhold. If I gently massage her neck or temples, she's already complaining how sore it is.

[aliveandkicking]

One telling point is that she told me that when we divorced, she wouldn't go out with anyone seriously until the kids were in high school. Which is exactly what the mom did. Of course, she did chase after the OM, so I don't know how true that statement was.

I think the reason she doesn't think she actually had an affair is because she wasn't really, in reality, going to do it. It was a fantasy that went too far. IMO.

Regardless, yes, she doesn't know how to multi-task with her love and attention.

I do have to find a way to break that perception of me being the "burden" and be seen as a partner/lover again. The question is how?

You do not and cannot "find a way" IMO. She has to wake up. You being nice and accommodating can burden her (because then she feels guilty, blah, blah, blah). You can do a trial and error thing for a while, fine, but, the bulk of yur energy needs to be on you. I asked you before, how are you stuck? What do YOU need to do differently for you. The less you are looking at her, the better IMO.

[MrBond]

gucci,

Thanks for chiming in. Actually I've only been in it for about a year and 2 months. We were separated for 6 months before I got her to come back home. Things are much better now than they were a year ago. I think I would have given up too, if I didn't see real positive changes along the way.

You're right about the building value in me and that I shouldn't be working for her, but for me.

If we didn't have any kids, I would have cut her strings a while ago. However, we do have kids, so they are my first priority. Showing them how a father treats their mother with love and respect is the model I want to show them so that they will want the same in their relationships. That also includes me not dating any one.

I'm just going to have to keep building myself up for me and see if she notices. I do have to get to the point of not giving a sh*t what she thinks or not think. Hard to stop the mind reading after doing it for so many years.

[robx]

Secure, confident men that are successful with women do NOT
offer to rub the feet, give backrubs, hope that the woman is "over the OM" etc. etc.... TO WOMEN THAT WANT OUT OF THE RELATIONSHIP. (or ones that are their friend)It is weak.

How many of you men have EVER offered to give a foot rub to a friend?
You are UNDERESTIMATING women, if you believe she won't see through that nonsense.

You have been at this for what? 2-1/2 year?

What you are doing is not working.

A truly confident man would STOP putting up with a woman behaving like yours is. He would STOP making excuses and STOP trying to "figure" it all out....

A truly confident, secure man would give this type of attitude:

I am perfectly fine the way I am. I want someone who WANTS to be with me. I will not share my wife with another man,either phsyically or emotionally. Love in marriage is EXCLUSIVE. PERIOD.

And then he would do everything in his power to move on and stop any and all pursuit and this nonsense of "friendship" that is nothing more than a smokescreen and another method to win her love. Won't work.


Stop this nonsense and admit that this hasn't and isn't working. Two years is more than enough time. You seem to be doing the same things you are giving Kevin 2x4's for.

Time to move on.... Chasing in any form (inclouding the friendship routine) doesn't work.

What works is truly letting them see and FEEL that you ARE and HAVE moved on.

Gucci, I hear what you're saying and I agree with you.
But... (and you knew it was coming).

Stuck seems to be stuck on his wife.
He loves her, doesn't want to give up.

I'm a big believer in attraction, creating attraction, what kills attraction and confidence is a huge attraction switch, if you're confident, you are attractive to everyone around you, it's the vibe you put out.

Yes you're right, he could quit - that's definitely an option.

But it seems that lately he has become "friends" with her again and that would seem to suggest that he is making some type of progress with her.

I agree with you, they're living in limbo but if he is accurate that they're more friendly now, it seems that whatever he has done recently has improved the mood.

I'm not saying that he needs to supplicate her, I'm dead-set against that. Buying someone is manipulating them, true dat! And you are right, women see right through it. I'm not telling him to buy her dinner, presents, nothing at all. All I'm saying is for him to be confident & secure in himself and show some interest in his wife because there is a huge difference between a wimpy wuss who begs & pleads for his wife to love him & take him and a guy who is confident, secure in himself & his life and showing attraction in his wife. Two different dynamics, two different results. He's not begging her to stay anymore, he's not begging for her to change her mind about him, he relaxed, stopped pursuing. But I think to create some energy he will have to put a little in, push/pull, show some interest and then step back a bit, show some more and then stop. Create some light sexual tension, some curiousity, some fun, relax the moods & mindsets of the people involved.

I also believe that physical touch between the two of them in a non-sexual manner might generate a response in her that she isn't aware of. You never know, she may miss it but have so much pride that she doesn't want to admit it. You never know, she may enjoy it, when is the last time she rec'd a footrub from stuck?

We don't any of this.

Time to switch things up, generate some curiosity, push/pull.

Women like the attention of confident men, if stuck is truly secure & confident in himself, he can show a bit of attention to her without acting needy, insecure, wimpy, wussy and if she says NO to him, he's secure & confident in himself that his self-esteem is still high and it isn't his loss, it's her loss at that point.

It's always easy to give up, and maybe he's not ready yet.
I'm a firm believe that you can rekindle attraction between two people when it has been gone for quite some time, you just have to know what to do.

just my 0.02 cents

[MrBond]

Greek,

Thanks for the insight. I think we have been moving positively as a whole. I do get feelings of her coming closer, then drawing away, so that's what confuses the heck out of me. But I'm trying to cut down on the mind reading, so we'll see how it goes.

Right now I think she sees me as a burden (as aliveandkicking has pointed out) in the past and I'm trying to break that perception.

Being lumped in with the kids is a tough thing to break, but I think it's a trap that all couples with children fall for. We forget to see each other as individuals and become just mother/father. Time to shake things up to be seen as husband/wife, lover/lover again. But one step at at a time.

[aliveandkicking]

If we didn't have any kids, I would have cut her strings a while ago. However, we do have kids, so they are my first priority. Showing them how a father treats their mother with love and respect is the model I want to show them so that they will want the same in their relationships.

Stuck, you are a great guy. This is early on and I think you are right to hang in there.

On the physical stuff, I would go so teeny tiny with it when you do. Not even a foot rub. A brush by her or some subtle contact...

How's your R with the kids? Weird as it sounds, it turned me on when H was super attentive super dad with the kids. Really endeared me and made me feel like I was with a "man" rather than a boy. Or, he would handle something with the kids "just right" (I mean with energy and imagination).

Just musing here...

Curious, have you ever in a very manly way looked at her and told her that you are not leaving her, that you are fighting for this marriage, that she is the love of your life and the mother of your children and you are going to do what it takes AND that you hope she steps up too.

I'm NOT saying you should, but, I always wonder what would have happened if my H had...

[aliveandkicking]

Oh and one more time-

I asked you before, how are you stuck? What do YOU need to do differently for you?

sorry if you answered and I missed it...

[Puppy Dog Tails]

I agree with you, they're living in limbo but if he is accurate that they're more friendly now, it seems that whatever he has done recently has improved the mood.

Rob, I haven't followed Stuck's sitch enough to even fairly make this comment about him SPECIFICALLY, but my GENERAL observation has been that too many LBSs put too much stock in "improving the mood," instead of in "improving the marriage."

In the SHORT run, it's not not only not the same thing, but it's often the OPPOSITE. Sometimes the very things you need to do to shake things up absolutely DON'T improve the mood.

And sometimes a wayward spouse's "improved mood" is nothing more than satisfaction at having their way at cake-eating.

Puppy