In Utter Agony...Long 1st Post

[25yearsmlc]

sorry if you see it as" bullying" but there are two reasons...one is by mistake since when I try to bold something for emphasis, it seems to cut off the words at the end and then it messes up the rest of the texts.

Second is that as a teacher and lawyer, I find that people see some points more easily in long posts, which mine often are, and that's why I use them.
J-

[dburt]

An attorney using alot of words, no way! j/k with ya...

Burt

[dncrm]

Let me ask you this, why is it necessary to hit anyone over the head with what you believe? Why not state your case and leave it at that? Is it that important that everyone agrees with your point of view? Personally, you've given lots of advice that I flat out don't agree with, but I would never think to use bold print to get across to someone.

All we can do is to lend our support and give our take. Just because you believe a certain way doesn't make it right for everyone.

[Ready2Change]

I believe in natural consequences. My Spouse left me for reasons only her and I should know about. Even then she left me for reasons only she knows about. She made her choices. I made my choices. I am exactly where I am today based off of every choice I have made.

If saving you R with spouse is important, DO NOT DO ANYTHING that will HURT or push spouse farther away. Patience and forgiveness are your tools. Michelle has great tools. Many other people have great tools. Find the tools that work for YOU and use them.

[25yearsmlc]

Dncrm

are you kidding? do I "talk too much for a woman"? I've posted here for years and you're the first to be so insulting.

As I said, I had just read an important book that really resonated with me, so I posted what I posted, as a confessional, not a diatribe. Why the personal and insulting attack?
j-

ps... the bold print is for clarity, fyi, and I just explained why I use it.

[eternaloptimist]

Hi, Everyone. Been awhile since I've posted and have some updates to share...Oh, and no worries at all to anyone who posted on my thread.

My husband and I separated on August 4th. It was truly one of the saddest days of my life. Everyone cried, even my sister-in-law and all of his college buddies who came to help him move out.

No matter how hard I tried over the past several weeks to not get drawn into conflict with him, he decided that he could not live here anymore. The stress was so bad that he became quite paranoid, accusing me (after I visited a lawyer with my Mom) of trying to build a custody case against him (which I was not), and invading his privacy by looking through his wallet, cell phone, car, office, etc. I have not snooped since I found out about his emotional affair with the therapist in May. Nevertheless, he was convinced that I continued to invade his privacy. He even went so far as to "plant" a condom in his pants to make me think he was having sex with the therapist...and probably countless other "booby traps" as he put it, that I never found out about. It got very crazy as I'm sure it typically does when people separate. When he was packing and me and our son were several states away visiting friends, he accused me of stealing his Dad's rifle and selling it or giving it to family. He threatened to call the police. Fortunately, I stayed calm through all of this and when his Dad's rifle was in fact at his parent's house, he sobbed and apologized for accusing me. I never yelled at him about it at all and just quietly accepted his apology. Still, he took off his wedding ring and has never put it back on since.

Things are now in a proverbial limbo land although he said, on the day before he moved out, "You know I'm not coming back! This is not a trial separation!" The only reason he hasn't filed for divorce is money; neither of us can afford the divorce and our mortgage is upside down. Looking back, I totally screwed up with my behavior and made things worse. It might not have come to this if I could have just stopped freaking out. I totally own how I reacted to everything with panic, anguish, fear, and judgment. Now that I am coming out of the initial shock and have been in my own IC sessions for awhile, I realize that our old marriage was not good for either one of us. I'm still the only one committed to starting over though.

The man whom I have loved for 21 years is now living in an apartment with almost no money to eat. I'm trying to just be his friend right now and limit contact as much as possible. I'm resolving to be positive, that every action I take can influence my future. I'm getting a life. I'm being happy so that no matter what happens, I'll have a great life for myself and our son. I'm turning my anger into compassion day by day. I never email him or call unless it is urgent regarding our son. I didn't fight him on taking anything that he wanted. He took our collection of 3,000 CDs, and basically everything a person would need to set-up a new house. When he moved out, I hugged all of his buddies and only said "Thank you for coming to support my husband today." I hope that everyone saw my sincerity and realized that my wishes were completely selfless. I don't think the day could have gone any better in terms of the impression I made on everyone. For that, I'm very grateful.

Whenever he comes to the house, I offer him any extra food that we have. He's even agreed to having "pizza Fridays" at the house even though my therapist does not think this is a good idea.

Everyone keeps telling me to just accept that he is "done" with our marriage and start dating. I think this is bad advice. Dating is the last thing I want to do. I haven't even taken my wedding rings off. I just don't think in my heart that it is over. He says that he still loves me but that our marriage is over. We made love on the day I found out about the therapist. How can someone go from having sex in May to moving out in August? And we were a couple that didn't have sex more than a few times each year, so this was significant.

His best friend, on the day of the separation, told me that my husband is "confused right now," that he's not sure what will happen but that he needed to do this. I've been doing a lot of reading and two different therapist think he possibly has aspects of something called borderline personality disorder. I am finally feeling a sense of relief to be away from his rage and the daily conflict. I lost 32 lbs. and can now eat again. So that is good. Our son seems to be doing ok too, for that I'm extremely grateful. I don't know if this time apart will do anything to help save our marriage, or if it is truly over. I guess only time will tell.

Thanks for reading this post and thanks in advance for any reflections you might offer.

[eternaloptimist]

Just wanted to post some other thoughts while I still remember them...

Hard to believe my life is in this place when just last summer we were talking about having another baby. Hard to believe that he really moved out when in mid-May he gave me a single rose as a "peace offering" after I found out about the therapist. I pray every day that I will continue to focus on positive rather than negative feelings and that our son will be ok no matter what happens.

[eternaloptimist]

Sigh...just want to journal my feelings here. It's been almost a week since my husband moved out and I'm trying to stay positive. Is there any hope? I know it is too soon to tell and I have to be patient. Not a problem. Patience is definitely one of my strong suits, as long as I'm not in panic mode. Fortunately, I'm not in panic mode anymore. So, I read DB and DR but feel like I need more advice on how to cope with the separation b/c no one seems to want to encourage me to have any hope that we might reconcile. It seems like most of the DB and DR strategies are for people who are living together. And most of the marriage help books are not for people who are separated. Anyone know of any good books for coping with separation? Maybe that could be Michele's next book????? Please?

Nevertheless, I'm not pursuing and NEVER call or email him, unless it is really critical/timely regarding our son. I make sure every face-to-face and telephone interaction we do have is positive. So far, I have seen some tiny changes. He's less hostile towards me but will try to take some verbal jabs at me. I resist. When we're briefly on the phone, he rages at me that his landline and cell phone connections are horrible. I try to be supportive about that and just say that I hope he can get it resolved soon. At least I don't have the 24/7 rage anymore and me and our son don't have that stress everyday. Still I am getting used to not walking on eggshells all the time.

On Saturday, he took our son for the day. When he picked our son up, my husband asked me where I was going and who I was going with. I did a 180 and didn't share as much as I usually would have and only said I was going canoeing with friends. Going canoeing is a 180 too. He's been surprised at my choice to do more outdoor activities (which was always a frustration for him too since I'm naturally more of an indoor gal) and then he asked if I was going with a "new boyfriend." Boyfriend? I said, no, I don't have a boyfriend. Then at drop-off, literally on his way out the door, he probed me again and asked if I had gone canoeing with a boyfriend! I calmly said, no, I don't have any boyfriend and I'm not looking for one. His response was, well, I was hoping you'd get one so that I don't have to pay the mortgage on the house anymore. Arrrggh...I wanted to scream. All he seems to care about is money. But I should only believe 1/2 of what he says right? And not analyze anything? I didn't get mad. I just said, well, I'm still married to you. So until that is no longer the case, I don't plan on getting into any new relationships. Is this a test? For any of the guys here, is this a test of my loyalty? When he planted a condom in his pocket and set some other as-yet-unknown booby traps for me, he was testing my trustworthiness. Or so that is what he said. I have not taken my rings off and I am keeping my marriage vows. I'm not about to get involved with anyone because right now I need to work on myself and focus on taking care of our son, getting tenure in my job, etc.

The more distance I get from our situation now that he's moved out, I realize how he's held back so many of his feelings from me and been so dishonest with me. Don't get me wrong. I've done my share of lying too. But I was always open about my feelings with him, even if it rocked the boat. The emotional affairs (which he still denies were even emotional affairs) don't even matter in his mind because, as he puts it, our marriage was over anyway. Isn't this just his shame and rationalization to make what he did OK in his mind? He's projected/displaced so much of his anger and resentment about his disappointments and losses on to me. Some of it I deserve (financial infidelity) but definitely not all of it (the loss of his friend to cancer, our friend's violent murder, our miscarriages). I have reached out to him with kindness and loved him through so many crises and he's held on to so much resentment, even about things that happened 12 years ago. I see that now. It's no wonder that we are in this horrible place.

I'm trying to be the kind of woman that any man would be crazy to let go of---confident, sexy, smart, sweet, thoughtful, kind, mysterious, generous, organized, domesticated yet fun-loving too. Gosh, without wanting to seem egotistical, I know that I have a lot to offer, especially love. I bring home a very nice paycheck, I'm very well educated, and I'm loyal. I think all of his friends see that and even his best friend is worried about him because he's going to throw away his family and his life...for what? To be alone, living in a basement apartment with no money or friends. (All of his friends live at least 2 hours away. So me and our son are literally the only people that he knows here because he's not made efforts to make any other friends.) It's not normal to blame your partner for all of your unhappiness, and that is what he's doing. He says that I and our marriage made him a worse person, that I should have made him a better person. To that, I have no answer because it's just such an unhealthy attitude. Unfortunately, I played right into his hands over the past year and got drawn into all of his internal conflicts. I did things, said things, and acted in ways because he triggered my insecurities. So I just reinforced in his mind that I was to blame for all of his rage, when I know that I am not.

Well, back to working on myself so that no matter what my son and I will have a good life with or without him.

[eternaloptimist]

Just bumping in case anyone missed my posts from the past few days. Anyone have any advice on dealing better with a separation? It seems pretty hopeless, but I'm an eternal optimist!

[Dia]

I'm separated too and yes, it sucks. It's cold comfort but GAL, don't pursue and keep DBing.

Keep yourself busy. Do stuff you always wanted to but couldn't when you were both under the same roof. Stop at a new restaurant for dinner after work. Go to a movie without worrying if he'll like it. Reconnect with your girl friends or family that you don't otherwise see. Take up gardening, bellydancing, painting, rock-climbing, etc. Check out your local university for free lectures, movies or other shows. Go to the symphony or visit your local playhouse. Take a book, a baguette and bottle of wine and have a picnic in your local park.

And so on. It does suck less with time.