GETTING UN'STUCK'

[MrBond]

Hi Greek,

Thanks for your insight. I think the eye contact thing is more a matter of trust or confidence for my W. When she feels comfortable...contact. Not comfortable...no contact.

Drives me nuts though because even in the beginning of all this talk of her wanting to leave, she wouldn't look at me but would sound just P.O'd.

As a whole my W doesn't like drama or confrontation. When she told me she wanted out, that was it. When I asked her why, she would say that we discussed it already or that she told me why when at the time she didn't.

When you were wanting out, was it a done deal for you in your mind? Did you not even want to face Coach and the sitch in general?

It's been a long time since I read yours and Coach's sitch. I remember reading it when I first got here and it was so inspirational and helped me to decide to stand for my M.

[Coach]

I really don't think that it's the money issue. One of the things she told me was that her mom raised her and her sister as a single parent with very little money, so she can too. Before she would tell me stories about how they were so broke that the three of them would share one pack of dried noodles between them. Money's never been an issue for her.

I think it is a big issue. I am a financial advisor and I see this a lot. How people were brought up around the kitchen table speaks volumes about how they feel about money. I can understand how she could want to be frugal but if she was literally hungry because if a lack of money it is a source of insecurity. Does your W understand about your finances? Could be a great way to connect emotionally to her.
Cheers

[MrBond]

Kittyfish,

"Okay, so why doesn't she just move out and file for divorce then if she doesn't want to be married to you?? That's confusing as heck for me."

Yeah that's the puzzling part. I mean, her sister's a lawyer so it's not like she doesn't have the resources to find out what's needed for a speedy D. She also still has much of her stuff at her sister's house so it's not like she can't just run away there again at a moments notice.

When I tell her that if she's that unhappy, she can leave, I get the "just leave me alone comment" or "I just want out don't you get it?". Never got a concrete reason why though.

Actually all of those things that your current H does now, I was doing to my W before the bomb. I was beginning to wonder that since I was her first and only boyfriend/husband, if she took it for granted.

It's like she has this mechanism in her that if there's something wrong, then it's not right, so I should bail. I mean when we had that talk a few weeks ago about how I thought she was going through a depression after the birth of our first D because she made a comment about seeing herself as a single mom, she told me that she should have left at that time. When I asked her why and the what the problem was at the time, she said she didn't know, but should have left.

I think alot of it depends on what and how she "feels". It's a very immature way of looking at things. Just the idea of throwing away your kids' lives, your H's life, heck even your life and everything you've built up because "something" doesn't feel right.

Ah who knows? It could be because she's still hung up on the OM.

I was wondering though, if it's not too personal, while you were separated from your first H, did you ever feel, um, in the mood? My W has not seemed to be "in the mood" for over a year. I know for men, sex is an important biological need. How about for a woman? It just doesn't seem right for her to not have any feelings in that aspect. I don't think she has any sexual drive at all.

[Greek]

Hi Greek,


When you were wanting out, was it a done deal for you in your mind? Did you not even want to face Coach and the sitch in general?

When I left, yes, it was a done deal in my mind in terms of "I cannot live this way anymore." In fact, that is STILL the way I see it - and Coach does, too. Neither one of us will tolerate a marriage like we had. So, yes, I was finished with the marriage as it existed when I walked out.

Did I want to face him and our issues? No...then yes. I didn't contact him at all really except to deal with the kids. We had grown so far apart socially that our paths really didn't have to cross otherwise. My best guess at the time was that he would not change. This guess was based on experience, things he'd said and some general hopelessness on my part. Then I'll be damned - when we did have to see each other, there he was looking like a million, acting like he had his act together, eye contact....you know, DBing on me. So when I saw these little glimpses of change, the shade changed from an intolerable marriage that I could never return to, to a small offering of hope. The more I saw of that, the more I reached out to address the issues with him - b/c it was feeling safer.

[Kittyfish]

I will echo what Greek said about being "done" For women, or at least for the ones I know and have talked to on the subject, we're done way before you men know "we're done".

I most certainly didn't want to face the issues. We had financial problems- partly because he spent so much on his hobbies. I was tired of doing without when he didn't. I handled everything- so that pressure was on me. I felt that he would never change. Plus- I was in the fog! Not of the affair- because that was over- but honestly, having the affair showed me I wouldn't have to be alone the rest of my life- that I could attract other men- and I had hopes of having a new relationship at some point.

I kept contact only to about the kids. Yes, I thought, "I cannot live this way a minute longer".

It's all about feelings. You don't think you're ripping your kids lives apart- you don't think about the home you worked hard to build- it's all about how you "feel"

It's not too personal to ask either- was I ever in the mood? Of course I was but we were separated and I didn't want him to meet that need for me. He actually asked me that as soon as I told him I wanted a divorce- ie, "Can we still see each other for ML?" Which totally grossed me out. That was actually his first statement after "Well you know this will make it hard for me to get a promotion now because I won't be able to relocate because of the kids" I took care of that need myself for a bit.

[givingitmyall]

Kittyfish, sounds pretty similar to my W - financial issues, and I left too much responsibility upon her. Have changed that, but only time will tell if it is too late - hope it is not.

[MrBond]

jaguilar,

Thanks for the encouragement buddy. I saw you trying to give our friend kevin a kick in the butt too.

I'm praying for all of our M to be healed.

[MrBond]

Thanks Greek.

From your POV, how long were you 'done' before you actually said it? Were you S for long?

I think your feedback of seeing Coach as being the "confident" individual is great. I'm at the stage of still trying to shake off the "hey look at me" line of thinking and making the changes REALLY for me. Sincerity and honesty to myself is the biggest thing to accept.

[givingitmyall]

Stuck, I am right there with you and would love to hear what Greek, Kittyfish and anyone else has to say.

[Greek]

How long was I "done" ~ this is hard to say. We both knew there were problems. Of course, we didn't talk about them b/c the 'image' of the happy, perfect family - once achieved - is tough to pry your fingers off of. So pinpointing exactly when I decided on "done" is tough. I will say that there were some compelling events - really bad arguements - that helped me to articulate what we were really dealing with.

The road to unhappiness in a marriage is sooooo long - it's hard for either one of the poor souls in it to identify where the wrong turns were made. Often when WAS begins to talk about those wrong turns, folks say that's rewriting history. Perhaps. But some of those wrong turns really were...wrong turns.

We were not separated long - maybe 4 months.

Making changes for YOURSELF is the key. Why? Well, when I began to notice Coach's new, fab self, I doubted it. I was very cautious, thinking this might just be him reeling me in with fresh paint, only to get back to the same weak M we had before. But I observe that Coach heard what I said as I was screeching out of the driveway, took his share of the responsibility and did the work to be a better man. So the changes were not just fresh paint, but real structure. Big difference.

Cheers ~~~