Newly separated...spouse left, 4th thread

[LG nm12]

AK makes an excellent point about not pushing your D in this vacation.

[Coach]

Antlers, Yes, showing compassion menas you are leading, doesn't mean be a doormat or pursue.

You think that since she still has seething anger directed at me...that she still cares some for me?

Yes, anger means she is still attached to you and the family. She is conflicted about what she is doing, still hurting and waching you. The expression around here is she is going to spew all over you. So you my friend need to get a spew raincoat so it just rolls off you. So the next time she gets angry remember that it is good, hold your ground don't react emotionally, validate her feelings but dispute any mind reading (you think.....) When you don't react the way she expects you are showing compassion by just listening.
Your e-mail exchange is getting to her, it's not normal Antlers behavior. How do you feel about what you are doing?
Cheers

[MrBond]

Hi Coach,

sorry for the hijack, but if you could take a look at my sitch again and offer any suggestions on what I should do, I'd appreciate it.

stuck

[antlers]

Just to clarify... I'm not guaranteeing or even guessing that you will win your marriage back.

Your kids, though. They are yours forever and they will always look to you for approval and guidance. If you carry yourself with dignity, treat them with genuine kindness and love... really listen to them and help them through life's difficulties... How can they NOT love their father? Eventually, your W's anger will likely cool off when she realizes that it is for her own good. And then perhaps she will be able to see you through kinder, more open eyes.

You can't be desperate or impatient. This isn't going to be quick.

I have a couple of GFs, sisters, whose parents split up when they were just entering high school. They HATED their father for leaving. Today, they are in their late 30s. They now hang on his every word and yearn for time with him.

Your kids will come around. Just wait out those nasty early/mid teens! And stay the course with your personal development, for yourself first, and then for them.

Hang in there.

Lucky

I realize that LuckyGirl. No guarantees, but I myself still have hope. I'm leaving her alone. No communication at all, except regarding the kids. And even then, it's short and to the point.

I hope my kids will always look to me for approval and guidance. My youngest daughter doesn't though...since the separation. I will be carry myself with dignity, that has taken some work through all of this. I will treat them with genuine kindness and love like I have been. I will listen to them, even daughters disrespect and hatefulness. I want to help them through this (wife thinks it's no problem at all for them) and all of life's difficulties that I can. I don't know how they can NOT love their father...my son and oldest daughter do...but I don't feel it at all from our youngest daughter. I hope my wife's anger cools off, and I hope she heals. I have so much remorse for my past anger and resentment that it's been debilitating at times. I would truly love for her to be able to see me through kinder, more open eyes. I'm about a zillion miles away from being the way that I used to be.

I know. When she first said that she was leaving, I did all of the wrong things. I was truly devastated. But I've improved a lot as far as desparation goes. And I've improved a lot as far as patience goes too! She's valuable enough to me that I'm willing and committed to do the work, and give her space and time. I know it won't be quick. What's a year or more when you're talking about the next 30 or more years? She has told me though, in a painful phone conversation last April 30th that "I'm not gonna just keep hanging on to this!" It hurt bad!

I love my kids. And I'm sorry for the way our lives have been in the past because of my anger and resentment. I've done everything I can to make amends. She (wife) still hates me, and my youngest daughter couldn't care less! Sure don't want to have to wait till my daughter is in her 30's though, before she loves me again. My son likes being with me.

I hope she will come around...this hurts pretty bad, on top of the other stuff! 'Patience...learn it, live it'...huh? I will stay the course with my personal development. I'll do it because it needs to be done...period. I will benefit from it, my kids will benefit from it, and hopefully my wife will benefit from it.

Thank you LuckyGirl, for working with, and helping me. i know it takes time and effort, and I am so appreciative.

[antlers]

Antlers- The 12 days without either of you is obviously too long and extreme under the circumstances. This is not what you "used to do." This is with one parent or the other. So, yes, you would do best to compromise. I think you get that.

Your daughter. You will eventually have a healthy R with her if you are consistent, reliable, demand respect (gently and lovingly) and give her time, love her, validate her feelings. EVERY daughter wants her father's love. She is, at her age, naturally going to relate to her mom. But, she is watching you. Looking to see if men are strong enough and loving enough to hold steady and strong. She will test you and manipulate you in subtle or overt ways (if you really loved me you'd let me x or y)...there have got to be some good books out there for fathers parenting daughters. Trust me though, mother/daughter relationships are hairy beasts and your wife will have to work this out with D someday. You be you, reliable, stable, loving, compassionate, flexible but firm when you need to be. Parenting is hard enough, this makes it harder but you can do it. Having a dad that cares as much as you do makes ALL the difference in the world. Just let her know you are there and then be there when she is ready...give her time.

Also, now is not the time IMO, to prove to D that you know better than her what she will or wont enjoy (bringing her on a trip she would say she wouldn't like but you know she will)...I think you should try to let her participate in making plans...again, just my opinion and you do need to lead. Sometimes it is worth it to push but I'm not sure that time is now.

Hi aliveandkicking.

This has been a 'mutha'. OK, I see it from your perspective that 12 days is too long and extreme under the circumstances since it's gonna be with just one parent! OK, I see it from your perspective that I would do best to compromise. I get it.

I hope to God that I'll eventually have a healthy relationship with my youngest daughter. I intend to remain consistent and reliable, to lovingly and gently demand respect and give her time, and to love her and validate her feelings. It seems like every daughter wants her fathers love...except mine! She is tight with her mom...is it because of her age? I hope she's watching me, because I am a much better man than I've ever been. Will she see that I'm strong enough and loving enough to hold steady and strong? She does test and manipulate me...all the time! More often in overt ways as opposed to subtle ways. I'm taking a course right now by Stosny called 'Compassionate Parenting'. My wife isn't interested in helping me out with our daughter...she used to be, prior to separation, but not anymore. I believe that mother/daughter relationships are hairy beasts. I will be compassionate regardless. I will also be stable and reliable, and flexible but firm when I need to be. It's a hard row to hoe, especially under these circumstances. I believe that I can do it. I hope that having a dad that cares as much as I do makes a difference! I do let her know that I'm there and will continue to be...and I'll give her time. I hope she will get ready!

OK, they come back over tonight. I'll talk to them about what they would like to do. I'll still lead. I do not want to push.


I appreciate the time and effort that you are taking with me aliveandkicking. Thank you.

[aliveandkicking]

How old is youngest?

[antlers]

AK makes an excellent point about not pushing your D in this vacation.

I agree. She wanted to take a long trip earlier when she told me she wanted to go to California, but she has since been influenced.

[antlers]

How old is youngest?

My son is 11, youngest daughter is 12, and oldest daughter is 20.

[aliveandkicking]

Hmmm...give her time. Terribly difficult age. Boys, hormones, insecurities. She's got to team up with mom to protect her own femininity and sense of self, IMO.

I really think that when things settle down, you two will bond. For now, you can focus on you being the kind of man you would want your daughters to spend their time with.

[antlers]

Antlers, Yes, showing compassion menas you are leading, doesn't mean be a doormat or pursue.

You think that since she still has seething anger directed at me...that she still cares some for me?

Yes, anger means she is still attached to you and the family. She is conflicted about what she is doing, still hurting and waching you. The expression around here is she is going to spew all over you. So you my friend need to get a spew raincoat so it just rolls off you. So the next time she gets angry remember that it is good, hold your ground don't react emotionally, validate her feelings but dispute any mind reading (you think.....) When you don't react the way she expects you are showing compassion by just listening.
Your e-mail exchange is getting to her, it's not normal Antlers behavior. How do you feel about what you are doing?
Cheers

Showing compassion means that I'm leading, even though she treats me like crap, and it makes me feel like a doormat? I haven't pursued in a good long time! I know that compassion should be exhibited, even when you are mistreated in return. It'd just be nice for her to know that I'm compassionate...since our marriage lacked compassion on my part in the past.

Hard to imagine that she is still attached to anything that has to do with me! She even stated last night that 'we are not a family anymore'! Does that sound like she's attached to the family? I hope she is conflicted about what she is doing! I want her to heal from her hurts. I hope she is watching me! She does spew all over me, man! I've been trying to shed it like water off a duck's back! I'll try to remember that the next time she gets angry...that it's good!?!? I'll remain steady and not react emotionally. I'll continue to validate her feelings. I can't read minds...what do you mean by "dispute" it? I haven't reacted the bad way that I used to in quite a while! I'm showing her compassion by not doing that...and by listening? I hope the E-mail exchanges are getting to her...in a good way for me! You're right...it's not normal antlers behavior. I feel pretty good about what I've been doing! I feel crappy and hurt that things are the way they are though!


ps - Coach, you are considered a sage here on this board...and I appreciate it anytime you post to me and help me out. Thank you!