PM Thread #6 - New Life for Number1 - Me

[karen43]

I am so making the right decision to leave. They need more positive male role models.

I often think that most of us here, maybe all of us, would be better off if we don't become a success at DB. I mean, at least if our WAS stay in the fogged-out self-centered states they mostly seem to be in. Many don't seem to be ready to win any parenting awards. Our WAS should probably be begging us to stay with them if they had any common sense (which they don't seem to). I often think that too, that my next R is going to be with a healthier, more positive role model for the kids. Karen

[lola485]

Hey PM...any interest in going to the Peabody's roof top party Friday night? Would love to meet you...bring some friends if you want. My h's band is playing, so kind of a big night for me...have struggled with if I should go or not, he moved out today. But he really wants me there, and I'm thinking I would like to go and be looking really good, LOL!

[PositivelyMommy]

Hey Lola,

Good luck with your h's band's gig. I am with you in spirit!

Thx Karen.

I have been working so hard to stay calm but these talks are getting to me as I do not like confrontations myself but have to stand up for myself now.

So H dropped off our tax papers and wanted me to sign something. I told him I will after I read them. Well, I read them and had some questions to ask him as I was not family with some of the income sources. I was annoyed but I was careful to choose words that were not accusatory but more like, 'May I have all the papers, please?' and 'I don't have all the information and I think I need to understand this more. ' But his replies were on the attack, 'Your tone sounds very accusatory.' 'I am not trying to hide anything here.'

So I was using 'I' statements and he was totally using 'you' statments. I tried to keep calm and avoided the verbal traps he wanted to engage me in. In the past I would have just stepped into those traps and tried to defend myself of what he is accusing me. But this time I stayed on track and demanded that he explain some of the things in the tax forms.

I know that I have matured and learned a lot more about myself. I also learned how our dynamic was basically me not seeing the traps he set for me. I don't know WHY he thought I would just sign papers without asking questions. I said, 'You said I could ask questions and I am asking them now. I want to understand these forms and I don't have all the information. I would appreciate it if you can give me a complete list of what I need to know. Not just assets but also life insurance policies and such just in case anything happened to either you or me. I need to know these things.'

He finally relented and said that we can sit down and go through them. Good. But it's been a few hours and I still am mad at him. I am mad that he is making the assumption that I would completely trust him unconditionally. And that if I don't, then there is something wrong with me because he has been on the up and up.

You all know how ridiculous this attitude is. But I did not engage in this argument as I thought he is so out of touch that it was useless. I am thinking, 'Why would he think that he was trustworthy? He's the one who has been lying and cheating and doing god knows what. I also just found out he lied to the kids saying that he is working this Sunday when he definitely IS NOT.

He also told the kids that he didn't have a phone line in his place yet. But then he calls me from his home phone to talk abt the taxes. He admits he did wrong for not telling them right away.

Also, I asked him several times to give me the biopage of his passport but he did not after several times. I don't know if this is MLC or not, I am just sick of dealing with this loser and can't wait to get his toxicity out of my life.

I can't wait to move home. I SO made the right decision!

[FightingFit]

thank you 25yrsMLC...

I know of course in theory you are exactly right, and it does hurt me bc I DO want to be 'the better person' and I DO want to be the forgiving one etc. Who doesnt? of course I want all that, and I want it to be so.

but I am human and yes still deeply in anger at my H's family as sorry, but I cant forgive or condone an entire FAMILY pretending incest didnt happen in their midst - it was COMPLETELY wrong and she was 17 years OLD he was 40 with three kids!

I am still getting OVER the shock - but not of H! im OVER that beleive me. Im still getting OVER the shock of an ENTIRE FAMILY being that screwed UP.

i cannot allow my children to ever have a thing to do with them - they are all toxic and weird and wrong and I will NEVER utter a word positive to my kids about them, and yea I freely admit, I would go OFF if I found out my kids had a thing to do with any of them. ANY. They are WRONG. They are ILLEGAL. they are IMMORAL.

to make my story EVEN WORSE, this neice he had it off with was also raped at 11 years old and had a child at 15.

forgiveness is not in my reportoire here.

ALL I can hope to do is try to realise im never going to understand it. bc I wasted two years of my life nearly going CRAZY trying to understand it, and trying to understand how his family could condone his actions. My sich really IS abusive. her parents ALLOWED this and ENCOURAGED this in their own home under their roof.

and yes I know mental help would have helped. When one cannot afford mental help one gets it the best they can. but its INTRINSIC to me that I instil in my children this is not a normal family and that their father did NOT make a "normal" mistake. LOOK: I tried to overlook the first episode? thinking he'd gone nuts? but he went back and hes still back. NOW its no longer a mistake - its now a LIFESTYLE CHOICE. I wont let my kids ever think that choice is forgivable - it isnt.

this is simething little talked about and hard to help. forgiveness is awesome but we ALL have to have a line of moral and legal decency - and I have drawn mine. my MIL will never over my dead body get her lying little ways and voice into my kids heads. this is NOT an ok situation nor one to say 'he made a mistake'. nope, he made a CHOICE. she lives in denial over that choice... tough.

thats why i suffer so much terror thinking of them and so much horror he'll ever come back - on one hand i am very catholic and want to forgive but on the other hand im not going to condone a middle aged man having it off with his brothers school kid daughter under his very roof and being OK with that.

NOT ok.

[FightingFit]

whoa. sounded crazed there

sorry! and this is why I am trying to overcome my 'red buttons'... so far as i can see my own situation is beyond any real advice or help. ive tried for it and not gotten anything but basically being told, 'thats harsh' and that i have PTSD. neither of wich actually helps, but praying, and possibly helping others if i can even in a tiny little way, i think thats the only thing i have... and it IS helping me. im not a helpless victim, but neither will i let my ex H convey HIMSELF as a victim - which he tries very hard to do, to take the focus off the fact hes a big fat nasty lying predator.

but yea its ok, i know theres no real healing for me excep time in my case, time preferably completely and utterly free from ex and 'the flying monkeys' (his family). my fear is the only thing stopping that happening nothign else, the 'stuff' has already be done to me, the 'suffering' is over, iknow that, its just the FEAR.

and i do fear. certainly that he'll try to get to my daughter - he wouldnt bother with his sons, but his daughter o yes. the other day even she told me someone called 'lost' from london tried to add her as a 'friend'. she didnt add them. its only on HER he'll try to do his good works. on the boys, he knows it wont ever work. my life is pretty much this: me fighting hard and working and fighting hard an reminding my kids of whats right and wrong - and being determined that HE doesnt try to roll the dice HIS way. theres no room in my mind, for HIS way. but ultimately i think, they arent stupid. i think they will see thru any pathetic excuses. i do trust them. i just wish the day never had to happen, at all. but life being life, im sure its going to !

[karen43]

I am thinking, 'Why would he think that he was trustworthy? He's the one who has been lying and cheating and doing god knows what. I also just found out he lied to the kids saying that he is working this Sunday when he definitely IS NOT.

OMG! That is so funny! My H did that too at one point. He was literally shocked I didn't trust him-and I thought the same thing, he's been lying and cheating nonstop, but still expected that I should trust him. I don't think they've learned that trust has to be earned!!!

I'm so sorry. He sounds like a typical WAS with maybe some MLC thrown in. I do think they're kind of toxic. I don't think you should feel guilty about moving at all. You are doing what's right for you and your kids and your H will have to face some consequences for his actions. I think that's a good thing.

Congrats to you on handling the tax sitch with your H. It's so hard to avoid falling into, it is like traps or something sometimes. My H always likes to put in a dig about how far out I am b/c I stayed in our town (he moved 2 towns away). I've finally learned to stop reacting to that. It took me a while!

I think you prob. will be a lot happier when you move. It might be the shock your H needs to realize what he's doing and how he's messing up. If not, you'll be better off away from his toxic lying & cheating I think. Karen

[PositivelyMommy]

I get an e-mail from H. He says he like to work together on the finances and want the talks to be peaceful (in response to my e-mail to him about where I am coming from). So that's good. I want to be on the same page.

I did respond to him that he should lie to the kids about his whereabouts. Abt not telling them he is at work when he isn't. We will see what he says. I know he will get defensive as he does with almost everything I say nowadays. He sees everything as a reprimand. Whereas I tried to state that it puts me in a difficult position if he is not honest with them. I told him I told the kids where I was on Saturday and they didn't have a problem with it. That it was Ok with them. No need to tell them fibs because it breeds mistrust and confusion on their part.

He probably won't take it well. Oh well, I am detaching so much nowadays that I don't care very much what he thinks of me. I just need to stand up for myself and tell him not to lie to the kids. I can't control his behavior but I said my POV.

[Can it work]

Hi PM,

I hope you're doing ok? It pains me to see someone so strong get som many emotional attacks thrust in their path. You seem to be coping in exactly the right way though. Not getting too confrontational and managing to stay calm throughout. Not only do you have the moral high-ground here, you also have the upper hand in any decisions pertaining to you and the kids. I'm not for a moment suggesting you use that advantage as a tool but I don't think your H has much of a leg to stand on here.

Anyway, he won't be around tomorrow because he had them for 24hrs. I am thinking, what about the fact that I have them all week? This dad is so fogged out. He really is a workaholic and really putting kids on back burner. I look at Can It Work and just think Weeman is SOOO lucky.

In response to this comment, I in turn think you are lucky to be the one able to make decisions for your kids. It's incredibly frustrating for me not to get to spend more time with Wee Man when I miss him so much. It seems that in any society the woman has the advantage when it comes to children. I do thank you for your praise though and I can't understand any father who doesn't want to spend every waking minute with his kids. Even now when I've found myself contemplating the possibility of finding myself finding someone else, I know that unless this person was 100% in love with Wee Man aswell, it would never work out in a million years. At the end of the day though, I know the perfect person for that job is my W. That's probably the main reason I want to work on my M now. I just can't see how anyone else can come close to sharing in the joy that is Wee Man other than my W.

He probably won't take it well. Oh well, I am detaching so much nowadays that I don't care very much what he thinks of me. I just need to stand up for myself and tell him not to lie to the kids. I can't control his behavior but I said my POV.

You were completely right to take this view. There's no excuse for him to lie to his kids. He needs to be told it whether he likes to hear it or not. Even if he thinks you are just being harsh with him, it will still make him stop and think about it for a moment. The only problem I can see is that he'll not want to change because of something you said in case he looks weak. It's maybe something you need to get him to accept on his own. The move back to your family will definitely help with that.

On a lighter note, how's the book coming on? I've not been at my writing for too long now. The weather's just been so great I've been outside gardening/cycling/running if I'm not working or looking after Wee Man. I'll get back to it soon though. I have a couple of assignments I need to submit for my course which I need to get finalised before sending. I'm not happy with one piece though and need to work on it a bit more. Never seems to be enough hours in the day though. Sleep is such an inconvenience! I could do so much in the time I spend in bed. Must say though, I do enjoy my sleep. What kind of guy would I be if I didn't?!?

Take care PM.

Kev X

[PositivelyMommy]

Ditto on the sleep part. I love my sleep too! After the two bombs, I had really hard time sleeping and staying asleep. I would wake up with a start in the middle of the night. And then I remember, yes, he left me, and he is with someone else. Lots of heartache and then trouble falling asleep again.

I look back and see how far my psychological wellbeing has improved. I still wake up super early but my sleep is deep so I feel refreshed. Exercising during the day helps tremedously and it's been my lifesaver.

Thanks Kev for comments and for being you. Because of you, I have not lost faith in manhood. Because of you, I do not generalize men and see them all as selfish beings who don't care about their children. Thank you for being here for me, I am so glad I know you.

As for my H. Well, long story and very telling. I am asking him to fill in some papers for my move.

Me: Can you please fill it in tomorrow?
H: What is this about?
M: I need these papers to filled out so I can prepare for our move.
H: How will this affect everything? I am just not sure about all of this.
M: What are your concerns?
H: I just don't want to rush into things. I need time to think about it.
M: OK. What time should I drop the papers tomorrow?
H: 11 o'clock.
M: Oh by the way, I am taking the kids to see my family again.
H: You are leaving next week?
M: Yes.
H: When are you coming back?
M: In one month.
H: One month???? So long.
M: I had always planned to go away for a month. ( Except it was to visit your mother, not my mother. Now plans have changed) You said that you had a lot of travelling to do so you were not able to take them to see your mother until August. (I was implying H is going to be busy anyway so what's the big deal.)
H: Oh. I need to think about it.

So I then talked with my brother and he said H's fantasy world is gradually imploding because I am withdrawing my support and compliance. I think that finally his decisions are taking concrete changes and he is not at all comfortable with the changes and the fact that he has no control of the outcome, eventhough I told him of my plans if he decides not to work on the M.

My prediction is one of three things:
1) He will play hardball and make our financial situation very tough to leave but he will dangle money to keep us here as an incentive. I will still go because I know what makes me happy and it ain't this fogged out H.

2) He either takes a few months to accept the fact that we are moving and he is going to have to su*k it up. He won't like it but that's just the way it's going to be. He will be in pain after we leave and then his fog will finally lift. But by then it will be too late.

3) He lets us go, we leave. He feels bad for six months and then realizes that he really wasn't cut out to be a dad and he really likes his single (no responsibilty, little expectations) life and then hardly sees the kids at all.

Either way, we will be leaving. Either way, he is not going to change his mind about coming back or working on M. I have seen no sign AT ALL that he is thinking of reconciliation. The only signs are at discomfort that he is losing control of this sitch and that he won't be seeing the kids as often.

Which is bogus anyway because he STILL does not call the kids during the week. Now his visits are once a week, for 24 hrs. That's it. The kids might be on his mind but he is not offering any emotional or physical support to them outside of the scheduled 'parenting' time. He really is an expert at compartmentalizing.

Geez, the longer I stay here, the more I dislike him. This needs to stop. I need to get the toxicity out of my system. It's not healthy for me.

[karen43]

As usual, you handle it all so well. Your poor H sounds very foggy right now. I know what you mean, I worry that I will start hating H too, and I pray to be loving and forgiving. It also helps me that I really believe H is hurting himself more than any of us (although yeah he is hurting us too). Your H seems to be doing the same. The kids and I have gotten stronger and closer through this, though. Karen