Ummmmm.... OK. These masks or persona. I'm just thinking aloud here...
We go through life having to adjust what we reveal in certain places for survival and/or success. When I initially met my H, I was able to breathe a sigh of relief because I felt that I could truly be myself with him. We had enough similarities in our backgrounds and families that we were comfortable with each other. When work was a beast, or when friends were being jerks, or when crazy mixed-up things happened like 9-11, we were there for each other because we saw eye-to-eye (for the most part.)
SP and Thinker and anyone else: Are you saying that back in the beginning of your R's you worked to put on some sort of persona other than your authentic, comfortable selves to win your spouses' affections? Was it not similar to what I describe of my M above?
My Father once said, "If you pretend to be someone you aren't for too long, you will go mad. There is no place for pretending in a marriage."
I'm thinking that working to adjust your persona to navigate certain situations and relationships that are outside your inner circle (your inner circle being your family and closest friends, let's say) is understandable, but only outside your home (that is, your sanctuary and your one place that should be of undeniable peace and rest... the one place you can just breathe and be the authentic YOU.)
My H has seen me adjust my persona on business calls or in social situations at which we are meeting all new people. He and I both have the persona-adjusting skills. But, he knows ME, inside and out, and I don't feel the need to adjust who I am in front of him in any kind of inauthentic way.
Is this persona manipulation really what it's all about?
My favorite scene in Good Will Hunting:
Will: Yeah. Don't worry about me. I know what I'm doin'. Yeah, but this girl is like, you know, beautiful. She's smart. She's funny. She's different from most of the other girls I've been with. Sean: So, call her up, Romeo. Will: Why? So I can realize she's not that smart, that she's f*ckin' boring? Y'know--I mean...this girl is like f*ckin' perfect right now, I don't wanna ruin that. Sean: Maybe you're perfect right now. Maybe you don't want to ruin that. I think that's a super philosophy, Will. That way you can go through your entire life without ever having to really know anybody. My wife used to fart when she was nervous. She had all sorts of wonderful idiosyncrasies. You know what? She used to fart in her sleep. Sorry I shared that with you. One night it was so loud it woke the dog up. She woke up and gone like "oh was that you?" I'd say yeah...I didn't have the heart to tell her...Oh God...[laughing] Will: She woke herself up? Sean: Yesssss. Oh Christ....aahhh, but, Will, she's been dead two years and that's the [censored] I remember. Wonderful stuff, you know, little things like that. Ah, but, those are the things I miss the most. The little idiosyncrasies that only I knew about. That's what made her my wife. Oh, and she had the goods on me, too, she knew all my little peccadillos. People call these things imperfections, but they're not, aw, that's the good stuff. And then we get to choose who we let in to our weird little worlds. You're not perfect, sport. And let me save you the suspense. This girl you met, she isn't perfect either. But the question is: whether or not you're perfect for each other. That's the whole deal. That's what intimacy is all about. Now you can know everything in the world, sport, but the only way you're findin' out that one is by givin' it a shot. You certainly won't learn from an old f*cker like me. Even if I did know, I wouldn't tell a piss ant like you.
All of this masterminding that we do... Is it really IT?
You know, I was thinking about that... What part each of you are in (limbo, mid D, post D.) And then I thought... I don't care. I want to be loved and accepted for my authentic self, and I want to love in the most giving and true way there is, and I want it to be simple and pure--just because we love each other, and I think that's where I'd simply stand firm.
It's not that simple, I know. I'm feeling idealistic today.
We go through life having to adjust what we reveal in certain places for survival and/or success. When I initially met my H, I was able to breathe a sigh of relief because I felt that I could truly be myself with him.
Damn straight! This is how I met W. I quit trying to "meet people" and just had fun going places and doing things. And what do you know the most natural woman I knew was right there.
Here's the exception: In our current state of marriage problems or divorce there is a "fake it till you make it" need. We're being called on to show strength, integrity, and faith, we may currently not have to endure a situation we've never faced before. We're not doing this to "win the girl back", we're doing it to win ourselves back. I don't look at it as being fake but building qualities in myself. It's only fake until it becomes us.
"My actions are my only true belongings. I cannot escape the consequences of my actions. My actions are the ground upon which I stand." Thich Nhat Hanh
he knows ME, inside and out, and I don't feel the need to adjust who I am in front of him in any kind of inauthentic way.
And of course this implies that one doesn't change over time, that the You of 2009 is the You of 1989 or 99.
But isn't it the very essence of marriage that one of the challenges that so often leads to divorce is the fact that one spouse grows in one direction while the other grows in a different one -- or, indeed, doesn't grow at all -- over the course of the life?
Electric word, life; it means "forever," and that's a mighty long time.
Which means, among other things, that one is constantly "meeting" one's spouse over-and-over again, learning to adjust, accommodate and renegotiate the social rules of the marriage and, therefore, that H/W can't, by definition, know you inside and out, because inside and out you change. Nearly every damn day.
I don't think that the masks are fake. They are a real part of you that you have built onto your core personality. They can't be completely ingenuous, or they won't fit, but you can in effect have lots of sides to you. You also choose to show different sides to different people. A better word than faces may be sides or facets.
Over the years, my W saw, grew to dislike, and rejected the serious, driven, dismissive and opinionated side of me that I too often showed to her. That's who she walked away from. She now keeps me emotionally at arms-length.
She has also seen, and has no respect for, the socially uncomfortable side of me.
I have never shown her the scared, introspective side that writes here. I am only recently admitting to myself that this side exists. I have tried once or twice in the past few months to show my W, but she is not ready to listen.
For my own growth and happiness, I have been rediscovering and rebuilding the silly, fun, social, live-for-the-day side of me. My W runs from this face, because it seems fake to her.
I certainly don't want to show her the crushed, needy, begging post-bomb side that I now try to keep locked in a closet.
So that is where Smileysperson was going. What side(s) of ourselves do we reveal to our WAS's? How do we show those sides when they are still under (re)construction - ie fake it til you make it.
Especially when your intimate partner is no longer intimate, so you can't show them your core, or your more intimate sides.
And especially when, no matter which side you show to them, it seems to provoke a negative reaction.
So you have to piece together a side of you which makes you the happiest under the present circumstances (interacting with your Spouse in a stressed R)
Last edited by Thinker; 06/03/0908:18 PM.
Me 42, W 39, S8, S6, S2 M 11y, A & ILYBNILWY 11/08 Walking away from a bad situation.
Hmmm... If you're in tune with each other, day in and day out of the marriage, aren't you changing together and learning each other's insides and outsides along the way?
By adjusting a persona, I don't mean holding back a fart or putting forth some sort of decorum as you get to know each other. I'm talking about engaging in activities that may not be authentic to your own interests or beliefs... I'm talking about pretending to be someone who really isn't YOU in order to lure them back.
If another person inspires you to try something new or revive an old hobby, it isn't at all bad. If you are overthinking your demeanor and each and every "how do you do" with your spouse... How is that authentic, loving, or even fun?
There are grey areas between 1) DBing, 2) just being yourself and representing your authentic feelings, and 3) masterminding, possibly manipulating in order to lure...
So, you are examining the sides of you that your W reacts negatively toward, and deciding whether these are unhealthy things that you need to work on versus an authentic part of YOU that you may or may not be able to alter. Yes?
Lucky- there is also identifying the changes we want to make for ourselves which often or sometimes coincide with the areas we were deficient in R. So, in order to build the muscles to really be the new and improved AK, I have to fake it a little. I have to work it in order for it to become natural. In my case, for example, not being so reactive and defensive. Finding a way to be outspoken not alienating etc. I guess these are behaviors rather than my core but changing these behaviors will soften my core and change me.
But, I think it is the fear and the attention being put on the S that actually diverts us from being able to authentically make those changes. I mean they know we are x, how are we going to pull off y? Maybe that is part of why the WAS walks away too. They want to change, cultivate, perhaps reinvent themselves. How can they do that in our presence when we "know" who they really are? So, this space that has been put between us can serve to make room for us to grow as we want to for ourselves and then perhaps rediscover each other in the future (or as we go along in the process of separating, divorcing or reconciling).
