I've been lurking here for a couple of weeks and have gotten lots of great ideas and encouragement from your stories. I'm now ready to share mine and ask for help and guidance from this group of experts.
Married 8.5 years, my second and her 3rd. The usual story, passionate first few years, comfortable acceptance and then the "minor" issues start to be problems. Neither party dealt with them effectively and we slowly started circling the drain (not that I realized it; typical man). About 4 years ago I (can now see) that I started to get depressed about the quality and quantity of our sex life, the fact that I wasn't feeling supported or getting the verbal affirmations I (now know I) need. I started to get dark, sarcastic, generally moody and resentful. This, of course, didn't help and we slowly moved apart emotionally. My wife expressed concerns about my mood several times but I just saw her as complaining and was mad that she didn't get that more intimacy, more support always brightened my mood but it never lasted. Set heat on Med-Low, let simmer for a couple of years.
I spent the first few months of this year wondering if I should initiate a D but eventually came to accept that I still really loved my wife, that she's a terrific woman and partner and I'm lucky to have found her. We just need to work on our issues and I started saying as much, without much interest on her part. I just assumed one day we'd both be ready to see a counselor and was OK with that; I didn't want to push her into it. Tick, tick, tick.....
My world imploded on the night of May 6th when we sat down to discuss how we wanted to handle our annual bonus monies. We had an amicable discussion about financial plans and then I asked if she wanted to hear about a trip I had been planning and wanted to do in 2010. I'm a long time motorcyclist and had been planning a trip from Prudhoe bay to Tierra Del Feugo and my wife had always been very supportive of my trips and hobby. I shared the how's, when's and why's of the trip, including how it would be paid for without impacting her life at all - I had it all covered and paid for. Instead of her usual support she was indifferent about my plans. When I asked why she said she wanted some time to think about it. When I pressed she said that she wasn't sure that she wanted to be around for that but gave no details. Some silence while I thought about what that meant, and I thought about the question that had been nagging me for a few months now. I said that, while I know we have some problems, I believe they're fixable but the one thing I couldn't accept was her cheating. Very long pause and she said that she had been flirting with a guy from work, had created an EA with him and that his interest (including his repeated offers to "comfort") had got her thinking that it was time for her to move on. She had been emotionally disconnecting from me for months and was waiting to have this conversation "knowing" that my reaction would be "get out" and she was getting her ducks in a row to move out that day; she didn't expect it to be today. I got the now infamous ILYBINILWY and my heart became a black hole of pain. Lots of crying, anger, sadness on both parts and we slept apart. I had to know about how far it had gotten and asked detailed questions. She assured me that nothing physical had happened, no kissing, just some sex talk and flirting that she found liberating. It ate at me all night and shock slowly turned to anger at her betrayal over the next 24 hours. By the time I got home the next night I was good and mad and we had a heated discussion, I said insulting things and when she wasn't remorseful I said "I can't every trust you again so let me be the bad guy - we're done!". She calmly accepted that and said she needed to go see her mother for awhile and left.
Alone, in the house, I came apart in a way I didn't know was possible. I eventually talked with my Dad for support and closed my facebook account with a "Goodbye friends" message that caught my BIL and his wife's attention and they called right away. Hearing their voice I came unglued and said we're over, it's over and cried like a child. They could not be talked out of coming over immediately and did so. They helped me get through the night and also see how my behavior had helped get us to where we were now. They had been going through similar challenges for a few months and had some good advice about next steps. By the end of the night I was committed to try and save my marriage and when my W came home I calmly said that I regretted my earlier comment, that I wanted to work on our issue and that I would appreciate it if she would give me a second chance. I followed that up with the usual persuing, begging, pressure (etc) that only pushed her away more. I needed help and turned to the web and found this site. The next day I had a copy of DR and was reading it like my life depended upon it. I immediately started the work, identifying what behaviors I had that caused issues and started 180'ing, I created my "act as if" list and started living them. I stopped doing more of the same and tried to give her more space (that's been so hard!). I had been reading The How of Happiness and also began practicing the 4 Happiness building acts that worked for me every day. I made an appt with my doc and got diagnosed for depression and started on AD's and some Lorazapam for the crushing anxiety - both have been a God send.
So, today starts week 4 and I've made great progress for me (AD's, medical checkup, addressed a cosmetic issue my wife said bothered her, daily prayer and affirmations, Happiness Acts, 180, act as if, etc). We started with a MC and have our 4th session this Thursday. Through those sessions my wife had identified a co-dependant issue she has and is reading books on addressing it, she's seeing a GYN today about her check up and about hormone therapy options for her libido. We're friends living in the same house and are getting along well but there's no love, no affection - just friends. While I understand that, because she had already left the R emotionally, it's going to take her awhile to open up and trust me again, if she ever can. What complicates this is that 2 days after "the bomb" she lost her job and the irony is that she lost it because the EA with the OP was discovered and because of his relationship with the company it was considered fraternization, so she was let go immediately.
My concerns me is that, while I am happy that we are going to MC and she is truly interested in working on her issues, she hasn't moved closer to me at all and I'm concerned that she's just dead set against reconciliation and the work is only about her issues. She might be cake eating until she gets the next job and I'm hoping against all hope only to be crushed in a month or five. I'm hopeful this is not the case but none of my short term goals are coming true.
Questions: 1. I don't initiate I Love You unless she says it first but I want to; should I? 2. Should I try to touch her in a non-sexual way (hand holding, backrub, hand on small of back, etc) or is that pressing? 3. We spend most evenings together; should I separate more and spend more time away from the house to give her more space? 4. We only seem to do the counseling exercises if I suggest them; she never does - why? 5. Is it too early to ask for some things I'd like to move forward (a little verbal encouragement, a call during the day to just talk)?
Any help is appreciated - I see how bad things had gotten and I'm committed to resolve these issues and I accept a lot of responsibility for getting us here. I'm trying to make it right and and working hard every single day on my mind, body and spirit to get right and be the husband she has deserved (and I once was). I feel like we've stepped back from the edge but I'm having a hard time navigating a place with no rules or signposts. What I will say is that this has been a sort of re-birth for me and I'm more excited about my life, my work and my family and friends than I have ever been. My heart is so wide open it's scary and I so want to love again and hope my wife can feel the same way about me. Regardless, I only want her to be happy in the end; I just hope it can be with me.
Please share your wisdom and guidance and thank you in advance!!!
You sound like you're doing all the right things. Unfortunately, she's unlikely to respond to you as long as she's still in contact with this other guy. Is she, and is she willing to go "no contact" and truly work on the marriage with you?
Thanks for the response; she has cut off all communication with the OP. She has clarified that, while she was tempted, it never became physical and she has no real interest in the OP (he's married (badly), a borderline alcoholic and a known womanizer). His interest was the catalyst for her to move away from me but not necessarily towards him. My wife has always been a very moral person and I believe her on this issue.
1- It is particularly important that she was let go because of EA. This paints it in a much different light for her than if it remained secret and she was caught up in all of the endorphines involved.
2- She agree to go to MC.
Butterfly wings refers to the mention that the flap of butterfly wings on one side of the world can result in a hurricane on the other side of the world.
As to your questions: 1. You can say I love you - only after a good interaction and not after a bad one. This associates the ILY with the positive instead of the bad. Use this sparingly.
2. Touch is touchy. You can graze her hand or arm when you pass her something. Gage how she reacts before you do any other touching. Don't go overboard and use sparingly.
3. Maybe. Is she comfortable with you there? Of course, if you have plans that would be GAL, which is VERY good for your own growth.
4. She is hesitant to do them because she doesn't yet believe they are going to make a difference. Suggest them unless she resists. If she will do them at your suggestion, be happy with that, but don't over-react.
5. Why do you have to ask for these things? Action, not words, are a better idea. Read the 5 love languages. What is her love language? Figure this out and do what she needs.
I recommend Marriage Fitness by Mort Fertel.
Be very gentle in what you suggest. Don't push. If she resists back off. If she agrees don't act like and excited puppy.
Read DR several times, you will see new information every time you do.
Strap in, this is a wild ride.
Me 45, H 46, S 23, M 26, Together 30, Bomb 6-2-08, S 6-19-08; H left 12-29-08. H home 12-09, Still MLC in 2012! Me- I have my big girl panties on. Bring it.
Glad you found this site and DR as quick as you did. This is a great support site.
1) Show her you LOVE HER by your actions, not words. Love = Patience and kindness. Do not go overboard.
2) Test the waters. Keep doing what works. Stop doing what does not work.
3) If she asks for space, give her all the space and more space she needs. Do you want her to miss you while you are away, or resent you for not listening to her wishes. Again, do what works. You want her to stop moving away and be drawn to you. You are starting a whole new relationship with her.
4) Not sure. Keep going to C. IC is also good.
5) I start most of my phone calls with "How are you" and then just listen, validate, understand......
Take this opportunity to work on you. Check out the books I have listed on the first post of my thread.
Thank you for your insights. I have read the 5 Languages and I'm doing the things that she needs (service, gifts, affirmations) although I can only go so far on the affirmations. I'm doing a lot of esteem building with her now because of the job loss and that's clearly helping her. She's also very appreciative of the fact that I was totally supportive about her change in financial fortunes and that I insisted she stay at the house and that we could live off of my income as long we had to, regardless of what our marital outcome will be (I don't want to see her suffer).
The asking was for me; I'm not getting any support or encouragement and these 2 small things would help me feel like we're connecting again. Thoughts?
It will take time for her to reconnect. Time and consistency.
Me 45, H 46, S 23, M 26, Together 30, Bomb 6-2-08, S 6-19-08; H left 12-29-08. H home 12-09, Still MLC in 2012! Me- I have my big girl panties on. Bring it.
Thanks for the response; she has cut off all communication with the OP. She has clarified that, while she was tempted, it never became physical and she has no real interest in the OP (he's married (badly), a borderline alcoholic and a known womanizer). His interest was the catalyst for her to move away from me but not necessarily towards him. My wife has always been a very moral person and I believe her on this issue.
The problem is, if she really did cut it off, she will tell you she cut it off.
And if she didn't, she will still tell you she cut it off. People who are cheating LIE -- period.
You're getting great advice here, so I have nothing to add, other than to please be careful and CONFIRM (independently) that there's no contact going on. Because none of the above is going to work if she's emotionally shut off to you, and she WILL be emotionally shut off if she's still in contact.
If nothing else, try the above for a period of time (4-8 weeks?) and if you don't see any movement, I would strongly suspect further contact at that point.
Good comments, and I am doign a lot of reading (and it's helping). Point taken on putting my needs on hold; I'll just sit on my hands for awhile longer.
...You're getting great advice here, so I have nothing to add, other than to please be careful and CONFIRM (independently) that there's no contact going on. Because none of the above is going to work if she's emotionally shut off to you, and she WILL be emotionally shut off if she's still in contact...Peace,
Puppy
Great advice, but how can i confirm independently. I don't know her email password and her Blackberry is always locked (as is mine). Plus, I don't want to snoop - how can I confirm without violating her privacy? Any suggestions appreciated......Mike
