In Utter Agony...Long 1st Post

[eternaloptimist]

Eternal: Whoa there! You kind of sound like I do sometimes, when I'm checking in with my therapist, kind of unplugging and unloading all the drama that's been happening to you...

Hi, IWSOM! You are so sweet to reach out to me. THANK YOU!! If I could hug you, I would. Virtual hug!

We do have a lot in common with our sitches and responses. Any chance you are a Libra? I'm a Libra with a rising sign Libra too. I need balance big time and this has thrown off my balance in a major way. I do practice a guided meditation every day called yoga nidra, but even that has not been helping enough. I truly appreciate all of your kinds words, support and advice. It has been a bright spot in my day, so thank you!

Wish I could table the "Wednesday" talk. I totally hear you on that front. But it cannot be delayed because of some contractual obligations we have for our son's private school education this fall. If H decides that he doesn't want to work on the marriage anymore, I can't live in the same house with him. I know right now that I cannot endure a non-divorce living arrangement. It would be extremely damaging to me and to our son. H refuses to move out and find an apartment right now b/c we already know our finances won't allow that. Plus, he has a pitt bull. Good luck finding an apt. that will take a pitt bull these days. So, I will have to move out and will not be able to afford son's private school tuition or much else for that matter. If we don't make a decision by July 1st, we'll owe the school $9,000! Ouch! It sucks to be put in this psychological and financial vise with the crank turned tightly!

We are primarily going to talk about the financial implications of a divorce so that we have all of the facts so to speak from a fiscal perspective. It will be very pragmatic and rational, not emotional. We'll save that kind of discussion for MC. This is what H wants to "see the facts." I already know that the financial impact of divorce will ruin us in the short and long term. We can't sell our house and not go bankrupt right now. We paid top dollar for our house and lost $40,000 on it overnight b/c of the market. We owe more than it's worth. Even with a short sale and realtor fees, we'd be in the hole over $22,000. And H thinks we can get a no-fault divorce for only $800? This is what an attorney told him. I find that hard to believe given that our home is worth over $300K and custody paperwork would make filing more complicated. I guess H needs to see it in black and white and perhaps that will sway him to work on the marriage. He wants to "weigh" the effort that will be required by either alternative. I can appreciate this approach b/c it takes the emotion out of it somewhat.

Tonight on the phone, he told me that he wants what is best for our son. He keeps emailing me, checking on me to see how I'm doing, and telling me that no matter what happens between us, he does love me. You are right that it is something to hold on to and to see it as a gift. But, I don't want him to be guilted into staying married to me b/c of money. That would likely just lead to more resentment, you know?

I just have to keep DBing, focus on myself as much as I can, bury myself in my work, keep reminding myself that I have a lot going for me with or without him, right? Very easy to say, hard to do.

I hope you have a nice night! Thanks again!

[IWillSaveOurMarr]

Eternal:

Nope, I am an Aries, and while I don't know much about astrology, I do know that this is a fire sign, and I'm defnately fiery and passionate! My H is born Jan 5, I don't remember offhand what he is, but I know that it is much cooler and pragmatic, which is why he can "detach" seemingly much easier than I can.

That sucks about the schooling/money issue. And you are damn right that ANY divorce will most likely cost you 3x $800, because your situation is NOT easy because you have a house and a child. We are in the same sitch as far as it'd be ridiculous to try to sell the house because we already lost so much selling my place (and it took forever), but now I have no where to live other than my parents, and that's not happening.

I've been researching about divorce and it depends how much both of you can agree on as far as how much it costs and how long it takes. Me and my H are in 2 opposing camps on this, and in a community property state as well as a No Fault state, but like most men I've heard about, he's in MAJOR denial that both our incomes are both ours divided by 2, and that this house is 1/2 mine since we merged seperate properties (owned pre marriage) into joint properties (by me moving in here and having him sign all my sale paperwork for my place).

But back to the point, you are totally right, divorce is really super expensive, and that's in good times, now, with the sitch you describe, so many people are staying together/ together longer because they can't afford to move out or pay for a long divorce. Court divorces can easily be 30k APIECE, so the great Divorce 3 pack of books I got from Nolo.com says...and their advice in 2 of the 3 books that I've read thus far is to avoid court at all costs.

I know you said that you don't want to have to stay together just because of the finances right now, but since he says he stil loves you, really I don't think this is a bad thing at all. It just gives both of you a more breathing room and valuable time before you make a major life decision. Like for me, the fact that my H and I disagree (mostly due to his denial of the idea of "Community Property") about how to settle things could be a HUGE issue to me were I to think of it that way, instead I'm seeing this as an opportunity for us to reunite because it will take a lot longer to settle everything.

My friends ex husband was in denial in this state, and all told, from filing to final divorce, it took 16 months, but she got everything she wanted and then some. He just refused to give her what she deserved (And accd to the laws of this state!). I had another friend with a "simple" divorce, no kids, no property, and that took 1 year and cost them each $10,000 each because again, the guy was in denial about what he actually owed her according to the law.

I've already said to my H that I'd rather him, me, or both of us have that $ instead of the attorneys, and he agrees with this. However, like the stupid spouses mentioned above, he still doesn't quite get it yet as far as the fact that the incomes and the assets are split yet, but I hope he does before we waste tens of thousands of dollars on legal fees. I don't have this money myself, so I will have to borrow it from my parents, something I'm not looking forward to doing but have no choice due to the fact I'm not working my regular job for the next month (long story).

Another good sign is that he seems like he is putting your son and his well being first, which is hopeful as far as negotiations go.

It sounds like you are bringing reasonable expectations into this discussion, and trust me, this divorce stuff will give you plenty of material to offer as reasons to hold off on it for now, especially given the ugly alternatives you mention. Try to think of it as a time out for your marriage, and think about the effect in 5 years....because if you get a divorce while still in love and wreck your financial sitch to do so, don't you think one or both of you will have regrets by then? If you do divorce, but have given it more time by staying together, the sitch economonically will be better and you will get more for the house, and both of you will KNOW that this is for the best.

It's a win- win, as I see it, kind of like how the DR has us acting even though we feel like sleeping all day and crying, we are "putting our face on", working or trying to get a PT job (my case), and working out, while smiling and looking cheerful.

Glad I brought a bit of hope into your situation and appreciate the insight into myself and my situation seeing yours offered. I hope your conversation goes well tomorrow. You will be in my thoughts.

Take care.

[eternaloptimist]

Hi, IWSOM! Thanks for all of your feedback esp. regarding divorce details. I'm sorry about your H and situation. This all just sucks, doesn't it? I haven't been doing any research into divorce b/c I just didn't want my mind to even go there---trying to stay solution-focused more than anything. And I don't see divorce as a solution to all of H's unhappiness or our problems.

Thanks for your support about our talk tonight. I'm getting anxious about it. I see my C tomorrow thankfully. I think I'll work out beforehand so that I have some endorphins pumping in my body. I'll be happy if we can agree to work on the marriage for at least a year, so our son can go back to his private school. A lot can happen in a year. Yesterday and last night, he seemed so concerned about me. He must have called me 6 times. He was reading all of these heartfelt emails that I sent him over the past several months, and I know he has kept all of them. Good signs? Maybe. He even asked me to sleep with him (no sex) in the guest bedroom. That was unexpected. He says that he likes sleeping alone b/c he has a sleep disorder and wakes up all the time. [I think he has depression.]

Trying hard to detach today and my heart is so heavy... Today I put on a sexy work outfit, perfume, just had my hair done with highlights and wore some killer dressy shoes. I've lost 25 lbs. since the bomb and today noticed that I lost 2 more lbs. Surely he's noticed. It has really boosted my self-esteem. H came to my office to see me b/c he was nearby for his work anyway, so I made sure that I looked my best. I think he noticed. Maybe the affair fogs are lifting? He said that he's emotionally exhausted. I just listened to him talk mostly. He made sports plans out-of-town for the Sunday of my 40th birthday weekend this fall, so that kind of stung a bit. He said that he didn't realize it was the same weekend, so maybe that is salvageable.

Hope you have a nice day!

[Puppy Dog Tails]

Today I put on a sexy work outfit, perfume, just had my hair done with highlights and wore some killer dressy shoes. I've lost 25 lbs. since the bomb and today noticed that I lost 2 more lbs. Surely he's noticed. It has really boosted my self-esteem. H came to my office to see me b/c he was nearby for his work anyway, so I made sure that I looked my best. I think he noticed. Maybe the affair fogs are lifting?

Oh trust me, he's noticed. I'm a guy -- I know.

The problem is, as long as OW and he are in contact, he will continue to waffle back and forth, and he will be much more (entirely?) shut off to you emotionally. That's why 100% no-contact, backed by full and voluntary transparency, is so important.

Puppy

[Puppy Dog Tails]

Just a thought, but how about if -- for your 40th weekend -- YOU made plans, for a "girls' cruise" or even just a "girls night out" with your female friends? Then, when it comes up again in context (and don't mention it until it does, or it will look "forced"), say "Oh, that. Well, when you told me about your plans, I made plans of my own, and me and (GF names) are going to Atlantic City (or whatever) for a girls weekend!"

[StrgMarvelousWmn]

Today I put on a sexy work outfit, perfume, just had my hair done with highlights and wore some killer dressy shoes. I've lost 25 lbs. since the bomb and today noticed that I lost 2 more lbs. Surely he's noticed. It has really boosted my self-esteem. H came to my office to see me b/c he was nearby for his work anyway, so I made sure that I looked my best. I think he noticed. Maybe the affair fogs are lifting?

Oh trust me, he's noticed. I'm a guy -- I know.

The problem is, as long as OW and he are in contact, he will continue to waffle back and forth, and he will be much more (entirely?) shut off to you emotionally. That's why 100% no-contact, backed by full and voluntary transparency, is so important.

Puppy

Puppy--

Do they really notice? Heck-I have lost the equivalent of our 9 y/o, I went from dark auburn to a strawberry blonde with blonde highlights, and wear my contacts all the time now. My clothes fit great, I look great. As a matter of fact, my attitude conveys it. I was going out last night while he was here and I got in the car thinking--"you foolish foolish man, you have no idea what you are letting go of!" It would be nice to know he DOES notice it once and a while. I know everyone else around me does.

Living God's blessings with grace and dignity~
SMW

[Puppy Dog Tails]

Trust me, SMW, we do. We are physiologically hard-wired to notice it.

And not just the LOOKS, either. The new confidence that accompanies those that successfully detach and GAL is damned attractive, too!

Puppy

[dburt]

Keep that attitude Eternal, with that and your new hot look, he is going over that in his mind believe me. I do not know you and have never seen you, and I am thinking about it right now, it is just how we are, fortunately or unfortunately.

Burt

[eternaloptimist]

Oh trust me, he's noticed. I'm a guy -- I know. The problem is, as long as OW and he are in contact, he will continue to waffle back and forth, and he will be much more (entirely?) shut off to you emotionally. That's why 100% no-contact, backed by full and voluntary transparency, is so important. Puppy

Thanks for this, Puppy! I do feel more confident, even if he hasn't noticed enough to compliment me or to initiate any intimacy. Initiating sex was a 180 for me that I tried already; he rejected me. But that's ok...going slow, right? My ego can take it b/c tons of men and ladies I work with have complimented me on my "makeover." I have done 180s with all aspects of my appearance. A few weeks ago, I ditched wearing any grandma-like undergarments KWIM? I started wearing tasteful (nothing too revealing) lingerie w/matching thongs (big 180!) around the house, push-up bras, etc. I make sure to change when he is nearby so that he can see the new toned and fit me. It has done wonders for my ego!

Last night we had our financial talk... I'll post that in the infidelity section. He came clean on everything w/his therapist...as transparent as a sauteed onion now and no contact!

[eternaloptimist]

Just a thought, but how about if -- for your 40th weekend -- YOU made plans, for a "girls' cruise" or even just a "girls night out" with your female friends? Then, when it comes up again in context (and don't mention it until it does, or it will look "forced"), say "Oh, that. Well, when you told me about your plans, I made plans of my own, and me and (GF names) are going to Atlantic City (or whatever) for a girls weekend!"

Great ideas! We talked about this and he said he was sorry that he'd made those plans w/out talking to me first. He wants to do something on the Saturday beforehand. Sigh...