Hi Puppy, I agree with you in so many ways - I also think not all advice applies to both sexes - I might be disagreed with thats absolutely fine, but its silly to suggest men and women have the same psychology, because they dont. For a start, we KNOW for a fact that men and women think and feel VERY differently from each other in depression. Men on the whole are a lot more "self destructive" than women - thats why more men suicide than women and thats why men will suicide in brutal ways hanging, shooting) but women generally gentler ways (OD) its the differences of the sexes.

I do believe in the hard line but I also beleive the hard line is HARD TO DO, and if you DO do it then you HAVE to be prepared to live with the consequences of a few things: ONE: they might not come back and TWO: if they do, they're not back by choice but by force - and THATS what some people hate and THAT is why they disagree with you.

What they're saying is, "I want him/her to come back, not be forced back". it can act like a catalyst and it can be effective BUT ONLY in making them return - NOT IN MAKING THEM OVER THE OP. see? and therein lies a big problem, bc OFTEN, the EMOTIONAL affair continues, or after a while, it "restarts" - so you are really risking causing yourself more pain. ie when your w isnt so afraid anymore shemight just meet up with him secretly again. Just to say gbye for example, or sorry, or have a sob. BAM we're back to the clandestine affair... so your opening yourself up to that, by taking the hard line.

INTELLECTUALLY, I can understand very much why tons of men and women would prefer to do the DB'ing and hard work hoping to have their partner return on their own and wanting them back. EMOTIONALLY, I think giving the hard "ultimatum" might be a choice a person needs to face, eventually; you can only DB for so long bf your being a patsy and not taking care of you. I think letting it go on for more than 6 months (if he/she hasnt yet left you) is really, really stupid. they're truly walking over you. BUT I WOULD SAY, if they have LEFT the house, go back to the DB if you want success - they've already exited. No ultimatum is gonna work NOW.

however having said allll of this every person is a precious unique gift from god and none of us can be read etc, there are sitches that need special treatment and special consideration, there are also gentle souls who just cant stand the idea of conflict or risk bc they love their partner no matter what, personalities and belief systems all apply theres no right or wrong.

The only guarantee I can TRULY GIVE YOU IS THIS: if you FAIL in the end, you will always secretly wonder if it had been any different should you have chosen the OTHER way! thats life. I hardlined my H, it failed, of course NOW I wish I'd DB'D him! so wahtever choice you do or COME to you have to decide "I refuse to look back at this and regret it I did the best I could at the time". and forgive your 'failure'.

everyone regrets an affair - EVERYONE - and this is true even for those rare ones who stay together - they always end up "lying" by omission on how they met.. what does that tell you. SHAME.

When you're down to nothing, God is up to something.