Divorce looming #13

[25yearsmlc]

well Kevin does not have that in his M at all and has not had it for the longest time. He's been here since February, but long before then they've had major respect issues, including some self inflicted ones. (Kevin you can speak for yourself or Ak can read the whole thread. )

But it's a bad sitch in which the real Kevin is only now starting to surface.
Good luck Kev,
j-

[K4D]

Well,

Here is what I did. W calls me at 6 and says she is bringing the kids home. I said ok. She asked if I wanted her to pick up some food for them. I said its up to her, but I have food here for them. So she brought them them here. She really thanked me for letting them stay longer. She was very nice. She offered to help me get my queen sized bed on my rails which I haven't done yet. I said no need, I will take care of it. She said the girls room needs to be cleaned. I said yes it does and I am already planning on the girls to clean it before they leave. She said make sure the clothes are washed and in the suitcase before they come home and make sure they have showers before they come home. I said I will. I asked her if I could keep them later tomorrow night to take them to an event that I had been wanting to take them to. Its a single parents event with kids they have made friends with. She said yes, that is fine. I was supposed to have them back to W's house between 6 and 7 tomorrow. The event starts at 7. I figured lets see how this works. It worked well. She is accomodating.

So I get to keep them later tomorrow night than I would have and get to do something fun with them out of the apartment. Cool.

Also, D11 told me that MIL said to tell me that even though she is still mad at me, she said to tell me thank you for letting the kids come over and stay awhile.

Hmm... maybe some kindness and flexibility can pay off. I would never have expected a thank you from MIL. Thats for sure. That is actually progress in my opinion from her. She is a bitter woman.

So here is my thoughts on things. If your S wants additional time, before you grant it, ask if the same will be returned to you. I will do this next time. Fortunately she is working with me on it.

Ready2change said that he had the same thing happen where he granted some flexibility and it paid off for him to.

I say give it a try the first time. If S does not return the favor after, then don't grant it in the future. Don't be run over. This will tell her that you were willing to be flexible and she was not if she does't return the favor. And I hate to use this phrase, but its kind of a punishment for her the next time she wants it if she hasn't returned the favor. This can actually be effective from one website I read and from what yall have told me.

So grant it once. If it is returned, work with it. If not, end it. However, this is complicated because you don't want to punish the kids who are innocent. So set ground rules for times and don't budge on them. Tell the kids this is when they will be there and when they will be picked up. The kids will accept this. Then stick by it.

Here is the other thing I am finding that yall said is true. You have to act as if S is dead. You have to. If you don't, you will not move on. I hate the words move on. But if you are me, there is more damage caused by not acting like she is dead. Now personally I don't want to be alone. So in knowing that and how I feel when I am alone, I am trying to meet other people. Maybe even a relationship will form. Maybe it won't. I don't know.

Tonite I was cheerful and confident in front of W. I asked for nothing other than more time tomorrow night with the kids for an event. She granted it willingly. She saw that I had the washer pulled out. She asked why. I explained how I hooked up the hoses to the wrong faucets. She said that sucks. I said yes it does but I will get it fixed.

I in no way at all showed any need from her. Granted my feelings are different. But I did not show them to her.

As far as she knows, I am coping with things and handling things. Now that may not change anything with her. But it doesn't push her away from me to see me handling things on my own without her help.

Of course there were times when I got frusturated and wanted her there to help me. But I did not contact her or tell her that. I have to be confident in front of her. But I also have to prove to myself that I can do things without her. If I can't prove it to myself, then it is nothing more than a mask to her that won't hold up. So I have to do it for me.

How do you deal with the loneliness? You have to get out and meet people. Stay involved. You have to force yourself to talk to people. Not everyone will be a buddy to you. You have to work your way through people and not put your problems on them.

I went to starbucks tonite and I started talking to a 21 year old worker there who was very friendly. We talked all about her and what she is doing in life. I ate a desert there while talking to her. I listened to everything she had to say and I asked further questions and just had a good time with her. At the end I told her it was nice meeting her and I will probably see her again since it is right next to where I live. She then asked me what is my name. I was stunned. I told her I am Kevin. She told me her name and that she lives close by to. She was really a great person. I loved her personality and she has many great traits about her. It was cool. I probably made a friend there. Thats nice.

Good friends will help you get through these things and help you figure out that there is more to life than one person in this world.

I have to admit that I was thrown by the fact that she actually wanted to know what my name was. All I did was just talk to her and be friendly and show interest in what is going on in her life. That is something Ready2Change does to.

I am starting to figure things out. I think a big thing for me was fathoming what I lost financially and wondering how will I ever get back there again. I hate to say that. But it really worried me to death. The other thing was can I ever attract anyone else so I am not alone for the rest of my life. I am a people person. I had a lot of fears running through me and not all of them were genuine with regard to a relationship. I let my fears control me. That was bad. I am still dealing with that. But I am starting to see that like 25 says, I have to get beyond that before I can really be a whole person. Its a work in progress. It doesn't change over night.

My life may never be again what it was turning out to be financially. It may never be again what it was sexually. It may never be alot of things it used to be. But I have to grow up and be thankful for the things I do have. I have my kids every other week. I have a job that pays the bills now. I won't be making this pay forever if I really apply myself and take some risks now and then. I will be more successul if I work hard.

People in general like me. Not everyone is into image. If my W never comes back, I will eventually find someone else that is better in that they will appreciate me for me and I will be a better person for learning from my mistakes of the past.

I have a lot to work through. There is no question about it. But I have the ability to do it. I just have to force myself to do it. And I am working on that. This separation is good for me. It sucks emotionally. But it is good in that I have to survive. I told my dad today that it is lonely. He said yes it is, but I have to do it. He said he feels the same things. My mother is dead now. He said he misses her. But he finds things to keep himself busy and finds ways to enjoy himself. He doesn't have the worry that consumes me. He has retirement for the rest of his life. So he is fine money wise. Its just trying to find a way to be happy alone. And he works on that himself.

But I am making this. This coming week will really be a big test for me with not having the kids and completely being alone. But I am joining groups to try and have plans each night so that I don't feel alone.

I get to have dinner with my kids Wednesday night. Me and W agreed a week is a long time to not see them. So when she has them, I will have dinner with them on Wednesday nights and when I have them, she will do the same. I'm betting she flakes on them though. I could be wrong.

I was looking at her tonite and she looks like she is starting to put weight back on again from drinking and dining out like she has been doing. I'm thinking that is great. Hopefully she will move out of this I'm so hot stage and come back to reality and maybe we can have a chance again. But I am not saying anything. I am just doing what you all have told me to do.

So anyways, D7 watched Rocky 5 this morning, Rocky 1 tonite and is watching Rocky 2 now. She wants to watch Rocky 6 next. I cannot believe how into this series she is. Its really funny. I'm truly stunned that a 7 year old girl is this into it.

D11 is playing on the other laptop. I explained to them what Rocky 1 was about since he lost that match. I explained that the point was could he go the distance against all odds and he did. It wasn't about winning or losing but could he stant up to the test against the world champion and he did. They understood what I was saying. There are so many lessons from this series in life.

Kevin

[aliveandkicking]

I love that you turned down the help she offered. Sounds like you did great.

"I was looking at her tonite and she looks like she is starting to put weight back on again from drinking and dining out like she has been doing. I'm thinking that is great. Hopefully she will move out of this I'm so hot stage and come back to reality and maybe we can have a chance again. But I am not saying anything. I am just doing what you all have told me to do."

I've had this feeling too but you know what in essence that says? That you want her to feel like cr*p about herself, realize that she can't really do any better or make it on her own and come back to you. And then what? Per 25's comment to me, you get the female "Willy Loman". No! You want YOU to be so awesome that a woman who is in a great place will fit with you. Get it? I'm working on it too, trust me.

[25yearsmlc]

Kevin, do you read your words before posting? Do you read our posts? Wait a second, I have definitely asked you those questions before....you usually don't answer them...

In additioin to echoing what AK said...I must point out the other obvious (obvious to US, not you) things from your post. Starts out great and slides down the drain from there....So you were wishing she'd look like crap (notice you were not worried about her health)...so. then you still missed the giant dinosaur in your face. After the discussion of her giving the kids back, why'd you talk about her at all? AGAIN? Oh, b/c she wasn't mean to you...wow Kevin, think she'll move in tomorrow? Could she possibly be thinking that a) she prefers a civil R with you AND b) she'll look better in court and c) custody is being debated so she CANNOT start a fight with you right now.

STOP TALKING/THINKING ABOUT HER OR YOU WILL NEVER EVER BE HAPPY. You wallowed AGAIN about what you cannot have. But Your own father is a widow of just one year! He cannot DO anything to help that sitch, but YOU CAN help YOURS AND WON'T!

You'd rather hope your w gets ugly and fat so THEN you'd "look better to her" (not that YOU'D CHANGE?? NO, NOT THAT!!) Better to sit around and keep on WAITING and wallowing and moping cuz that's worked SO well at getting her back and it's super attractive, and YOU"VE BEEN SO HAPPY DOING IT!!...OMG Kevin get your head out of your a--. Almost as weird as reading about how great the M was...like we have amnesia.

& Your poor dad, comforting YOU....Did you call your DAD the anniversary of your mom's death? I know You called the one person who did not need comforting from you, you called your stbxw with YOUR NEEDS...again... don't you see how you are missing the whole side of life called "GIVING"? That is not "LOVE," you have for your wife. It's NEED and WANT and it is NOT THE SAME as love...

I guess I'M the one in denial b/c I keep thinking there's more to you than neediness. That down deep there's a man with a lot to offer a woman, but what you just said AGAIN, after all this...and so many other BLIND comments you make, after so many wonderful people have written well articulated pieces to you...well it just tires me. Really I feel sad and get tired when I read your replies. Lots of them seem as if you ignore what we say if it's hard for you, and you're just jotting down ALL your unmet needs like you have a bucket of need but oops, there's a hole in the bucket AND YOU CANNOT FILL IT...b/c....you want someone else to fill it...and it has to be her... so it'll never be filled./ Are these words to say that you know sound healthy, but are not really felt by you?.

Kevin, you and I have been in communication since you began your thread here. And how many others are still here who were here from your beginning? I'm not positive. But am I the only one left? Is stuck8 still here? Amyc is not and is Breakaway?

Like YOU said, your wife is "dead" to you for all emotional and practical purposes. So what's with caring about her looks? Oh, that's right, she was polite to YOU, and NOW YOU ARE THINKING THAT'S PROGRESS TOWARD RECONCILIATION- INSTEAD OF THINKING IT'S PROGRESS TOWARD AN ADULT RELATIONSHIP which you said you wanted...but it's all still MAINLY tactics even now....don't force her to have to pull back from you yet again.

She was polite to you! Good. That's better than being rude. NOW, MAKE NOTHING ELSE OF IT EXCEPT THAT A MORSEL OF RESPECT WAS THROWN YOUR WAY....if you scarf that down like it's a bone thrown to a starving dog, that's how you'll be seen AND treated again. BACK OFF. Be civil. Be strong. (Be 34 y/o). You know, If there comes a time when she wants more, YOU WILL KNOW b/c SHE WILL TELL YOU OR SHOW YOU and I doubt it will be a vague comment or action at all. Don't know what it would exactly look like BUT I DO KNOW her basic courtesy while custody issues are being decided, is NOT the time to read into anything on her end...

Glad she was civil and the day went smoothly. Now let's see if the clock can start over again. The one where you don't talk about your wife. If you MUST refer to a kid's issue, okay. But your comment about her gaining weight gave yourself and your neediness away all over again. Those moments are when I wonder if you have made ANY progress that was not forced upon you. And "forced" progress isn't really progress is it? I mean, factually speaking, if she came back today, how long do you think it'd take for you to lose ALL self respect and be in the same boat again AND not have changed at all, Or at most, less than 10% of your behaviors would be different a year from now? I worry that within 3- 4 months, you'd be the same guy you were a year ago. B/C the "progress" was ALL forced on you, and the stuff you say you'll do for yourself...has not come to fruition.

Good night Kevin. Get a c. You cannot afford NOT to do so.
j-

[K4D]

Yes, I do read my posts and everyone elses posts before posting. I guess that was the wrong way to think. I need to be the one that changes.

Thanks for setting me straight again. Here goes 24 hours.

Kevin

[K4D]

I know I am going to get 2x4'd for this. But I am not looking forward to my kids leaving me tonite. I sure do love having them with me. We have had a lot of fun together this week.

D7 is sweet. She comes up to me and gives me hugs and kisses on my cheek. It warms my heart.

D11 is great to. She is kind of quiet these days though. I'm not sure what is on her mind. She doesn't always tell me when I talk to her.

I love my kids. They are wonderful.

Kevin

[volleydog]

Why would you get 2x4's for that, the worst days I have are the days right after I don't have mine...You love your kids, that's great.

What you'll get 2x4's for is next week, what are YOU going to do without your kids?

[goingtofixME]

Here is a 2x4. Brace yourself. Kevin, you do not need anyone else to make you happy. You are the key to your happiness. It isn't your wife. It isn't your children. You are now putting your daughters in the position of being the people who keep you afloat when you feel like you are drowning in despair. STOP IT! As others have said, you need therapy. You need it bad and you need it NOW! Stop looking for others to complete you and make you feel better about yourself. All of the outings, your daughters being over, and your wife tossing you a civil bone every now and again are not going to ever make you feel better about yourself. YOU and only YOU control your happiness. LEARN IT....LIVE IT!

[aliveandkicking]

Here is a 2x4. Brace yourself. Kevin, you do not need anyone else to make you happy. You are the key to your happiness. It isn't your wife. It isn't your children. You are now putting your daughters in the position of being the people who keep you afloat when you feel like you are drowning in despair. STOP IT! As others have said, you need therapy. You need it bad and you need it NOW! Stop looking for others to complete you and make you feel better about yourself. All of the outings, your daughters being over, and your wife tossing you a civil bone every now and again are not going to ever make you feel better about yourself. YOU and only YOU control your happiness. LEARN IT....LIVE IT!

goingtofixME-Nice of you to prepare him for your 2x4 but it has all been said repeatedly before.

Kevin, I think this actually IS sinking in and it will just take time for you to live it. You're lucky that so many are willing to keep reminding you. It is like a muscle you have to exercise and build. There is no post that will make it change over night.

We all have to make big changes in our sitch. I think one of my problems is that I think my pain and my struggle is so unique to me and I hold on to my despair as if that makes me a better person somehow. BUT, there is no judge that is going to hand you an award for having tormented yourself the longest. WE KNOW. I'm telling you dude. I wanted to die. You get that? I really wanted to die. And still, I have to find a way to live with joy NOW.

I believe you are slowly getting it, maybe it is too slow for comfort for most of us watching but please get it through your skull that we KNOW.

And, I do think you need therapy (me too)...as a woman, reading your posts, honestly I'd be terrified to hook up with someone like you. I'm not saying this to be cruel and I do think you have so many wonderful qualities but to connect with someone who is so incapable of managing on his own would feel like such a trap. I'm telling you this so you can see clearly.

There is a book called "Joy" by Osho. It talks about being "alone" vs. being lonely. Love your alone time. Cultivate a whole person. Discover yourself. This IS your time. If you believe at all in spirituality or a purpose to this life, everything is exactly as it should be and you NEED this time to become a full grown man.

Just my two cents. Kudos to you for having the courage to continue expressing yourself honestly here. Sometimes I just want to run away from this boards and devolve into my worst self because it would be easier. You deserve respect for wanting to change as I know you do.

[LR1]

Kevin,

I am coming to Dallas all next week. We should get together for lunch or dinner, maybe jaguilar too if he can come.

LonelyRzr