WAH #4

[kassie]

Recap - M 2 1/2 years - separated for past 9 months. H has 3 1/2 months sobriety. Hx of arguing a lot and H threatening to leave me.
His issue was wanting to drink, and my issue was to stop the drinking, stop the arguing, stop the quitting and to take some responsibility.

H wants to move back in since Mar, but all the other behaviors continued. I want some time with him without all these behaviors present before he moves back in - he says he is working on it and wants them changed just as much.

I am afraid.

[volleydog]

He called me after the meeting to apologize and explain further. He said that he gets all messed up when he gets his hopes up of being together and then it doesn't happen. He said he gets messed up and wants to protect himself so that he doesn't relapse.

That's sounds about right...He's still trying to figure out himself

He went on to explain how it hurts him that I don't want him back yet because it reminds him of all the damage he has caused and the hurt he has inflicted on me and others. He wanted me to know that his being distant and cold was just a protection and not evident of how he really feels about me.

This imo is sort of a cop out. I did the same thing he's just deflecting he knows what he needs to do but won't

Said he would like to spend more time together while he is working on his recovery.

Would you want to be included? If so go to a meeting with him, some are open some closed(only addicts allowed). How do you think he would react to this?

Then the really "low blow" was - after all none of my recovery would have happened if it weren't for you and the way you have stood by me or the way you have given me feedback about my behavior. (not sure if I should feel I am being manipulated or not)

I don't think he's be manipulative. My W basically forced me to go to rehab and I hated her for it at first but then realized if she hadn't I would have surly relapsed and I thanked her for it.

My response yesterday and today is to remain even keel and pay close attention to how I feel. It would actually be easier to say it is ok to move back in Aug - which I did say a few weeks ago - and then still go through the quitting stuff when he doesn't like what I say or do. Just look back at my posts recently and you can see that it just keeps going. Altho, he did say he is changing that behavior.

I would keep an open mind to Aug if he's doing great with recovery many things with him will change during that time.

I am really afraid of revisiting those memories all over again. I want to acknowledge his effort but I am terrified. That is why I wanted more than a few months.

This is the exact reason my W told me she doesn't want to work on our M, she doesn't want to revisit those feelings again and I don't blame her. I know it's got to be hard for you and I don't really have any good advice for you other than to wait as long as you can and see if you like the changes in your H...

Feedback?

[kassie]

Thanks V, I think I am willing to work on the M when I see changes sticking. I actually didn't say that I wouldn't consider Aug, the problem is that he has to give 90 day notice where he lives which means he has to make a decision in the next week.
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What I said to him was that I wasn't ready to make the decision for him to move in for Aug at this point. I didn't want the pressure of making the decision about the apt. I have been through this before with him in recovery and not keeping it up.

I will also admit that it is my nature to be trusting and forgiving. I feel that he has taken advantage of these traits in me - but what bothers me is that my friends all think I should D him. They can't understand why I would hang in there when he has hurt me so much and made my life miserable. I don't know how to answer for that.

Feeling unsure. But point well taken that if he is in recovery then I should seriously consider reconciliation sooner rather than later.

This is why I posted on your thread. I have been trying to tell fact from fiction. I also thought I am much more open than your W is and could explain her point of view.

[volleydog]

Thanks V, I think I am willing to work on the M when I see changes sticking. I actually didn't say that I wouldn't consider Aug, the problem is that he has to give 90 day notice where he lives which means he has to make a decision in the next week.

I think that is the perfect way to go...What would happen if he did have to commit to the place he lives and if you decide in Aug you can work on things because the changes are sticking?

[kassie]

What happens if he committs to another year is that we either remain separated that long, or we are stuck paying off the lease. I am not willing to pay off the lease because I have done this before with him, and prior to that, he lived with me but kept an apt of his own and therefore didn't help me out financially.

My thinking is that we can work on our M while living apart which gives us space to retreat and time to get things right.

I just can't tell him that I know things will be ok by Aug because we have been trying to see each other and get things back on track since the beg of April. He continued to walk out or away when things didn't go his way or he called it quits at least weekly and at least four times in the past two weeks.

He is obviously not as ready as he wants to be. He thinks since he isn't drinking everything else can be worked out - and normally one would agree. However, I am extremely anxious around him - fearful of him walking away or quitting still, arguing, disagreeing, cancelled plans, sabotaging behaviors, and how we are going to deal with our lack of compatability in so many other areas of living. I am reluctant to making any plans with him that he can back out of or overturn or disrupt my life and family. Financially, it is hard on us to live separately but we have lost so much because of his sabotaging behavior in the past. It has been insane living and I don't want to return to that circus. So far, I haven't seen proof that any of this will change and in fact it continues.

Today he spent about five minutes with me saying hi, and did I change my mind yet. I gave him my standard reply of 'I'm not talking about it at work" - his response - to say he can see I still don't want him and he left.

For two days, it has been saying hi and giving me a hug and kiss - today he runs. We took time off from work around this weekend, and he has changed his mind about spending time together. This is how it always goes. I go on and on but won't bore you anymore.

Tonight is my D's last school concert performance and then Friday night the formal - graduation in two weeks. Pretty full agenda for me.

Any ideas on how to understand H behavior or how to deal with it? The thing about being separated another year it will mean that we have lived apart more than together while M.
As I talk about these things it is hard not to be discouraged.

[volleydog]

My thinking is that we can work on our M while living apart which gives us space to retreat and time to get things right.

I just can't tell him that I know things will be ok by Aug because we have been trying to see each other and get things back on track since the beg of April. He continued to walk out or away when things didn't go his way or he called it quits at least weekly and at least four times in the past two weeks.

He is obviously not as ready as he wants to be. He thinks since he isn't drinking everything else can be worked out - and normally one would agree. However, I am extremely anxious around him - fearful of him walking away or quitting still, arguing, disagreeing, cancelled plans, sabotaging behaviors, and how we are going to deal with our lack of compatability in so many other areas of living. I am reluctant to making any plans with him that he can back out of or overturn or disrupt my life and family. Financially, it is hard on us to live separately but we have lost so much because of his sabotaging behavior in the past. It has been insane living and I don't want to return to that circus. So far, I haven't seen proof that any of this will change and in fact it continues.

You have your answer...YOU ARE NOT READY and HE IS NOT READY...What he wants and what he needs are two different things. You have to worry right now about what you NEED from him and you aren't getting it. Sure he could commit to a year lease and you both realize in Aug that you can live together, yes it would suck money wise but at least then you're sure.

Any ideas on how to understand H behavior or how to deal with it?

and

He thinks since he isn't drinking everything else can be worked out - and normally one would agree.

Stopping the drinking is GREAT but that's only a part of the recovery process. I was the same way "hey I quit what's the problem" but he has to find out and realize what caused him to abuse in the first place. Has he shared his first step with you? Writing out my first step really put things into perspective with me, I didn't want to share it with my W but I did. Just FYI nobody in NA or AA would agree that since he stopped drinking everything else can be worked out, at least nobody that's REALLY following the program.

You need to do what you feel comfortable with, period. He needs to prove to you that he is committed to a full recovery and until YOU feel comfortable, he shouldn't expect anything from you. If he is expecting things from you he isn't into a full recovery, yet.

Just FYI I hope I don't come across as "preachy" because I could be TOTALLY wrong wrt your H, but I want YOU to protect yourself. I know if my W would have taken me back too soon it wouldn't have worked and I would have hurt her even more.

[kassie]

Volleydog,

You are only telling me what I already think. H has been working hard, he wants to be back with me, these things I know for sure and give him full credit for.

He is planning to join a step group, but yes he has been sharing step one with me since he started his recovery showing me that he is increasing his understanding of the problem and accepting it in stages which I think is normal. This is the problem, I think it is too early for him to deal with us until he is clearer about how to deal with himself.

I have been trying to sort out what is supportive but truely he did a lot to me and our M and I know I need more time without the day to day with his stuff. He doesn't understand that I walk a fine line between trying to stick up for myself and support him.

He takes my stance as a rejection which I have a hard time hearing him think that way about himself.

[volleydog]

Could he do something like put in his 90 day notice knowing that moving back with you is not definite? If things aren't were you want them in Aug could he do like an extended stay motel or a shorter term lease somewhere?

[kassie]

He is proposing putting in his notice and thinks that he can cancel it and stay. What he can't do is sign his lease and then ask to leave. I also think he could risk it and then move somewhere else but he doesn't want to do that one. That is why i decided not to take this on and leave it to him to decide because it is up to him to know what he is willing to do, and what he won't do. I know that we don't function well when things are left undecided or decided at some future date. We both like to know what we are doing when. Oh, I guess we do have something in common.

Today he comes in my office to tell me he is getting the notice to make a decision - I reminded him that I won't talk about it at work but later. He responded defensively and suggested that we will live apart for another 16 months and probably will want a D then. He didn't have his ring on and gave me some BS about it - had it in his pocket and put it on. I reminded him that the future was mostly up to him - that he either figures out how to spend time with me or not. Can't advance a relationship by distancing a person.

Since we took a long weekend I wondered when or if any plans were still on? He got defensive again and suggested that he is willing to do anything I just have to call him.
At lunch I invite him to join me and he seemed surprised but distant, and stopped by later in the day briefly.

Still feels like the same stuff. I know he wants to be with me so why the distancing all the time?

[Startingover2]

My guess is he is now sober and that leaves him with alot of emotion, frustration, and decisions he could just drink away before. Now he has to deal with it and its probably not fun. The rest of us do it unassisted by a bottle but that has been his crutch for so long.

Continue letting your H figure out his own issues. You are stepping away from the codie behavior and its hard for you too. I know, once a codie its hard to fix that.