WAW1 - Anticipation

[markhaving probs]

Thanks PM,

I think to 'man up' is now the area where I need work on. I would like to think the other areas we have discussed regarding the children and anticipation etc are reasonally covered.

I find non-interaction easier obviously bedcause I can control situations. As soon as I come in contact with W the situation evolves into conversations I have trouble controlling.

[markhaving probs]

My wife just rang to ask the children how their day went. While she was talking to the children I thought about broaching the subject of why she makes herself uncontactable when she is out. I think we all know why but it annoys me that if I needed to contact her on an emergency we can't. If I asked her it would appear to be pursuing so I didn't mention it when she asked to speak to me.

She said we must invest in two more car seats which I agreed, she then said she was seeing the lawyer on Wednesday to get the Deed of Settlement drawn up. All this hurts but I sounded sort of matter of fact rather than friendly, and then she wanted to confirm I was not going to change my mind on the figures, I said no...short and to the point. I then said "ok then, I will see you tomorrow at about 5.15pm", with which she responded by saying "you always want to get off the phone" in a terse sort of way. I just said "well ok if there isn't anything else I will see you tomorrow then".

I said goodbye and ended the call. She will probably think I was rude, but I felt slightly agitated and dealt with the call the way I did. Maybe I should have sounded more upbeat, but I listened to her, I confirmed questions and ended the call.

I hope I did it right.

[markhaving probs]

My wife has just picked the children up. I was wondering whether she was going to mention the fact I cut her short during our telephone conversation yesterday but she didn't. I always feel nervous now when I see her, it feels like a first date nervousness (I so wish it was a first date situation).

I was breezy and upbeat, tried to be confident, we had a conversation about the film she has just been to see, I looked her right in the eyes during the time she was speaking. I also wrote on a piece of paper a telephone number I had made up in different handwriting to mine and left it on the coffee table by the door but half hidden. It might sound pathetic but I thought it was something I would do, trouble it I am not so sure she saw it but I did put the childrens bags around the coffee table so she may have done.

To mix it up a bit I decided to tell her I could not have the children over night next Wednesday as I had a 'do' to go to. I want to watch the Champions League final at the pub with some mates. She came out with the same script about me saying I want to see the children as often as I can and then making arrangements to go out. I told her I never arranged the event as she wanted to know what I was doing, I did not offer any information (mystery). She then went on to say "well you can have them on another night, how about one of your circuits nights".

She was trying to get me going with that comment but I ignored it and said I would see what I can do as it is half term week. I will offer another night, and it will be on a circuits night, but I do not want it to look like I am doing this because she suggested it. If I do another night do I look as though I have 'given in', it could be looked at as a 180 for cancelling circuits, or do I front her up and say no I cannot do any night next week. I have created this sitch by not suggesting another night to start with puttnig me in control.

While I am writing this though, I should have suggested Tuesday night which is one of my gym nights before she mentioned it. Why, why, is it so easy to think what I should have said after the event has happened. I must write things down before I come out with a statement like that. I will text her tomorrow and tell her I have juggled things around to be able to have them on another night, this way I am controlling the situation I should not have put myself in. I am learning....slowly!

She also mentioned (again) about seeing the lawyer on Wedneesday about final settlement. I don't know why she keeps mentioning it other than to try and see if I say something or look dis-heartened, I didn't on either count.

[markhaving probs]

Update:
As soon as my wife left I deliberately switched my cell phone off. The landline phone rang which I ignored, which after ringing '1471' here in the UK you can find out who rang your number. It turned out to be my wife who rang, as soon as I switched my cell phone back on I had two texts and a voicemail (I then switched it off again). She started off with "you obviously couldn't wait to get out of the door"... the voicemail was about having the children over half term which I said I would discuss with her over the next day or so when she came to pick the children up, so I don't know why she rang now. She has made anassumption on where I am going on Wednesday which is so far off base it is ridiculous - she thinks I am going to my mothers for a birthday bash which she is not even having. She said I don't care just don't lie to me. Considering I did not tell her where I was going is obviously bothering her.

I also forgot to give her some money was the other reason she texted. I will not contact her until tomorrow.

Those 10 words though "You obviously couldn't wait to get out of the door" has given me a small victory in a current sea of failure (apart from the children). It means nothing in the big picture but it has given me a little lift which I so need at the moment. She does not know where I am now and what my movements are for the next couple of weeks and that has 'bothered' her.

[markhaving probs]

My wife called this morning, her tone was raised, agitated and stressed.

Because I turned my phone off yesterday when she left with the children, she believes I am seeing somebody else as actually stated by her this morning. I was dumbfounded that she actually made a statement like that as I have not given her any reason to assume I was seeing somebody which is so far from the truth. I did not confirm or deny her statement, but I said that is not fair as my daughter has tried to contact her when she has been on one of her Saturday night's out and her phone was off.

My wife has an answer for everything, she said the things my daugher is asking could be sorted by me (another attack on me). She went on about me not taking them to enough places, I could have them over night more often as I am not working etc etc. She went into another rant basically, I asked her to calm down and we can try and sort things in a controlled manner. This is within earshot of the children which, again is unnessary as she ring me after she has taken them to school. I said I would let her know later what my plans were and I would let her know as she said she needs to sort her diary out.

She said she does not care what I do or who I see, she rants at me, tells me I am still the same BLAH, BLAH, BLAH. I am trying so hard and yet she feels as though nothing has changed which is difficult to stomach as I am really enjoying my time with the children.

Why she is still like this and the attacks are just unfair and unjustified. Because of her assumption about me seeing somebody will probably give her carte blanche to do what see wants without any guilt.

[Puppy Dog Tails]

Mark,

For a cheating spouse to accuse a betrayed spouse of cheating is purely SCRIPT. It happens, I'd estimate, 50-60% of the time. Don't dignify it with a response, other than to say ONCE "I take my marriage vows seriously, and I would never do that. Now please don't bring it up again."

In fact, I think the place where you're largely getting "stuck" here is that you do indulge her far too much on her "rants." Most of the conversations and interactions you describe with your wife go on FAR too long, in my opinion. A simple "I'm sorry you feel that way, I need to go thus-and-such (GAL activity)" and be DONE with it would be a far better approach.

Having marital arguments in front of the kids, particularly, is a problem. When she starts this, you need to cut her off with a polite -- but firm -- "This is not appropriate to discuss this in front of the children. Let's talk about this later" and STICK to it.

I think you're looking for some deep philosophical insight from the rest of us as to what's going on with these interactions (ex.: "Why does she care if I'm seeing anyone, when she's done this to me?"; "why is she like this?"), when in reality all you have is simple BUTTON-PUSHING with the former, and "why she is like this" on the latter is, "she's in walkaway mode, and this is what walkaways do."

You're still WAY too reactive. Your immediate goal should be practice not being REACTIVE. Picture her down in a pit, full of all kinds of beasty nasties, and tell yourself "Mark, don't jump into her pit with her. It's a cheeseless tunnel -- DON'T ENGAGE."

OK, so I just mixed my "pits" and "tunnels" analogies, but you get the point. Do you think you could try this this week?

Puppy

[markhaving probs]

Puppy,

Thanks for responding. I will try real hard not to be reactive, she definately does it when the children are around which I think is unforgiveable.

To 'try something different' in regard to our R I implemented gucciloafers make her jealous strategy, which has definately sparked a reaction. If I was to tell her about my marriage vows (which I do take seriously) would this not defeat the object of gucci's advice?

[Puppy Dog Tails]

Probably. You could just say "Look, I've already responded to all of that, so please stop asking me. It's so 'high-school'."

[PositivelyMommy]

Mark, Puppy is right.

You and W have been in a pattern for YEARS. She complains, you get sucked into an argument. You raise to the challenge and all he*l breaks loose.

What you have done now is to change the pattern.

SHE DOES NOT LIKE IT ONE BIT. Why? It's different, not the same pattern. People like to stick to routines even if the routines are unhealthy (think fast food).

So now you have grown, you see the argument coming. You refuse to engage. Great!

Now, follow Puppy's advice, not only do you not engage in the argument but try to nip it in the bud because it's not doing you any good. Look, she MIGHT be jealous and she probably does care who you go out with. But you know what, that doesn't guarantee she will come back. Soemtimes people just don't want other people to have what they don't want themselves. It's stupid I know.


You wanted to make her jealous. Now she is suspicious and jealous. OK. Now what? Now she is angry at you for moving on with your 'new life'. You can hope that she is looking at you differently and I hope for your sake she does reconsider. But if it doesn't work, you will need to be mentally prepared as well.

So refuse to be yelled at. Just excuse yourself and say something like, I will be happy to talk with you and listen to your point of view when you have calmed down. Or I need to calm down, we can talk when you stop screaming at me. That is taking power back from her. That is standing up for yourself without fighting her.

Remember, her actions show that she is a unhappy woman. That is a GOOD thing. If she realizes that she is unhappy then maybe she will realize that she doesn't have ALL the answers.

Keep your cool.

[markhaving probs]

Thanks PM,

You're right about the pattern, to be honest I never noticed it. I would capitulate during a row because of the children being present and the fact she would just go on and on and on, and this has been the case for a few years..

I do need to be mentally prepared as my mind wanders to where we have reconcilled and this is a very dangerous place for me to be in. This divorce will go ahead, I have no doubts about that at all, it is whether in time we rebuild our relationship over a period of time. She told me this morning she thinks I am doing enough for the children which really hurts, I don't know whether she means it but my children seem very content to be with me. I am anticipating their needs as best I can and they don't say they are missing anything. I took them swimming at the weekend, trampolining, and to the school fair on Sunday. I make meals for them from recipes which I have not done before, I give them a cooked breakfast, treats they want and generally we have a nice time. I even have one of my daughters friends to stay so I am catering for three children. What more can I do to make my children happy?

PM, you are right about her actions as one minute she appears ok and then the next she is angry. I have just realised as I am writing this - The pattern here is when she requires time for herself she will raise the issue when the children are present, which to me is outrageous. She has identified our S7 has become very clingy and will not leave either of us when we leave the room. Why she would continue to try and manipulate me knowing how he is feeling is disgusting, therefore I will 'nip this in the bud' and will only discuss these issues when the children are not present.