she's been pretty clear that she's scared. and she wants to know how you feel. so I think you sit down and have that conversation. you understand she's scared. so are you (I think that's there anyway) because you recognize that she's beginning to pull away from you and from the marriage/intimacy. and that that's the usual first step in the spiral that becomes IT. and that makes you feel....(fill in the blank). it's what she asked for--sharing your feelings--plus it also calls her on her stuff.
M60 H52 D20 M14 yrs OW-old gf from 1986 bomb-5/18/08 H filed for D-9/10/08 D final 4/24/09 xH remarried (not OW) 2012
she's been pretty clear that she's scared. and she wants to know how you feel. so I think you sit down and have that conversation. you understand she's scared. so are you (I think that's there anyway) because you recognize that she's beginning to pull away from you and from the marriage/intimacy. and that that's the usual first step in the spiral that becomes IT. and that makes you feel....(fill in the blank). it's what she asked for--sharing your feelings--plus it also calls her on her stuff.
sorry, i dont mean to sound or be cruel. I am not anti-marriage nor anti-reconcilation. just trying to gain some insight from yall. i've been living a similar situation 20 yrs of a sex starved relationship, every so many years she pulls away, cheated, i get a divorce lawyer, we try to work on the marriage, good for a while, same crap a couple years later, decide i cant take it anymore, she gets scared we try to work it out. things go down hill again. repeat cycle.
so i quess i am trying to find some insight into my own sitch. I am willing to try again this time. she seems sincere. but i know there is a history of this not lasting. I am not going to walk around on eggshells anymore, do they need to be kept on their toes? probably made less sense this time. Steve
She told you she was scared and you lectured her. Hmmmmm...
She asked you to share your FEELINGS and you didn't....
She is being thoughtful and careful and you threw blame at her....
How about: "Sorry, I really was exhausted last night. I think it does make sense to be simple and direct with the boys. The message you suggested makes sense: "We've been having problems and are trying to work through them. We love you and we are here for you, we are trying to do a better job of being here for each other."
How do I feel? I am terrified too. I panicked last night when I saw your email and became scared that you were giving up and distancing already. I am scared of the whole cycle repeating. I too long for this time to be different. I am scared of going through the pain of emotional separation again. I am scared to trust, to love, to be vulnerable, to let you see *me*. I am more scared of not trying with you. I am leery of you talking to client, paranoid that something or someone will pull you away. I am happy though, that you are reaching out for support. I am excited about what IC and MC can offer us. And, I am more hopeful than I have ever been. I am joyful about the changes I see in you -- your introspection, your willingness to change, your insistence on finding a good life for you. I too feel that this time that I am less defensive and more willing/able to change. I am hopeful that together we can find an M that offers a good life for both of us as a couple and as individuals.
So, to sum up: The idea of doing real work on our M is terrifying and exhilarating. (And, I have some great ideas on stress relieving practices that I will demonstrate on you and in you tonight.)"
Oh, Puppy. I sooo know how your wife is feeling. Her letter to you was very well stated. She is looking to you to be a team in fighting for your marriage. She is sharing her fears and feelings of apprehension with you. This is not the time to call bullchit. She is reaching out to you to understand her and listen to her and share your feelings. Validate her feelings. There are no wrong feelings, but make sure to reassure her of your love and commitment and hope. Tell her how THIS time will be different and specifically tell her why and how. You may need to really think about what you are going to follow through with this time (mainly counseling, consistent relationship talks, dialoguing if need be, etc.)
My suggestion: (I'll write a sample letter. It's easier for me that way)
Wife,
First of all I want to tell you that I love you and always will. (Insert your feelings about your wife and how that will never change).
I believe that I have found out what love and commitment truly mean. There is no relationship that will never come upon "hard times". Relationships that last are the ones that have couples that work at it all the time. That don't give up. If we wanted to be with someone that met our every need every second without much effort, we would be changing partners weekly. We change as human beings as we get older, but unless we want to change partners every year, we need to work with each other to grow together. Sometimes this will mean that we will disagree about things and have to talk it through. Sometimes this may mean that we have to see a counselor because the issue is too big for us to handle. Sometimes this may mean that we won't have that new relationship feeling you can get at the beginning. I believe long lasting love is better than new, temporary love. The "It" that keeps happening may just be what happens when you are in a long relationship. We just need to find what we can do to change the dynamic or at least understand it. We need to put forth the EFFORT always and forever. This won't be an easy thing and it won't be something we do and then it is done. I believe marriage is something that you need to constantly work at.
I see what your counselor was saying. I'm sure he/she has dealt with many couples that try to bury all of their problems under some romantic distraction. I do think we are different. Telling our boys that we have problems and that we are going to work them out is a good way to put it. It's a good thing to teach them that marriages take effort to succeed. The renewing of our vows may mean something different to the counselor if she/he is not a religious person. Our vows state specific things that we believe: I promise to be true to you in good times and in bad....love you and honor you all the days of my life.... To me, that's not a romantic/wishy washy emotional thing per se, but a commitment of my love to you period.
I know what you mean about feeling relief and also about feeling fear. Yes, we have been through this "trying" before, and ended up where we were both unhappy. I believe this time is different. I won't stop loving you. I won't ever want to leave you. I want to be with you for the rest of my life. I won't give up on you, and knowing you won't give up on me, takes us to a new level. We haven't ever gone to a counselor before to work on specific issues. This will help us. It won't be easy, but I know that we will get through this. Actually, I look at other couples that have never gone through really difficult times, and I honestly feel a little sorry for them. It isn't until you can get through the hardest of times with your spouse, that you can truly look at them with unconditional, not taken for granted, pure love. I feel like we will move to a level that not all couples ever get to.
All I know is that I love you. With that love, and with God, EVERYTHING is possible.
P.S. I wouldn't "sit her down" to try to set her straight. She is using email for a reason. It is probably hard for her to talk about herself and her feelings in this way. Email may be a way for her to open up. Why not respect her choice on how to communicate here? It allows you both to be thoughtful and careful. It even gives you a huge opportunity to avoid falling into the old automatic patterns that will likely emerge if you go into face-to-face corrective hubby mode.
So, stick with email on this and see how it works. Think of it as journaling to each other.
And, this is important, stop right now thinking of her as the adversary who has to be turned around. She wrote to you as your partner in a tough and scary project that matters deeply to both of you. Treat her like your partner on this -- you both want to succeed. Let her be on your side. Give her that chance by not getting on the offense as a defense.
My first question would be, why do you have strong feelings? To me seems like a simple email from her expressing some of her worries to you. Do you call her on her 'bullchit' usually?
What bs are you seeing in this email?
Her emailing and not just talking is quite poignant to me and suggests that calling her on 'bs' is the wrong lane to go down if you want the conversation to work. She has obviously been doing a lot of thinking about your relationship and where things are at the moment and as a woman feels the need to verbalise and express herself to get clarity on her thoughts. Think of it as 'work in progress' not BS.
Look at the clues in the email as to where she is at.
- she see's several options as resolutions of the problem but is not sure what is best so wants to explore them with you. But if you look at them they are not solutions or resolutions they are feelings, she is exploring her feelings and anxieties.
Here are some of her dilemmas I have picked out.
"The one thing she said was to be very careful to not give false hope to them... We should not tell them that everything is going to work out since we don't really know that... I also told her that down the road we mentioned renewing our vows..."
The worry about giving them false hope seems to be the main one and her worry about an uncertain future - whether your r can work or not.
You came back with trying to fix the problem instead of showing understanding, which belittled her worries somewhat imo.
Re-read your response to her.
You are best friends... if this was a different topic of conversation and you had a conversation that 'worked'. How would you play it?
