The adventure continues--part 5

[BobbiJo]

Take it from someone who has allowed her H to cake-eat for 16 months and deeply regrets it now...

For her to say, "I don't want to come home now but I still want you in my life and for you to talk to me every day"....that is cake eating. She will get just enough of a "AFWAW" fix to keep her happy, while still having her freedom/independence...

I have been reading you since the beginning but not posting. I just couldn't pass this up. Some friends and I used to refer to ourselves as 'yo-yos' on this board. We were up when our spouses were wanting us, down when they didn't...we let them call the shots b/c we were afraid of losing them for good...don't let that be you.

[dburt]

every time you have her right where you want her, you allow her to get back in control. She is still with the other man, she is hedging her bets, if she was not getting it with OM, she would be home getting it from you. (it being everything she needs). I do not think I would do the date thing anymore, you are wayyyy too busy. It is amazing how close you get to totally blowing her mind, and then a couple of words by her and she grabs your balls back.

Do you not see this?

Burt

[AJM]

I read that the same way. I think that if you let her decide to come back, you will be in the same boat before you know it. If you know what you want, you now have to figure out how to get it. Right now you're trying to start the breathing. Almost there, cause you are talking. Then you need to stop the bleeding before you treat the wound and treat for shock, right?

Letting her be in control is not going to do it. Letting her manipulate you is going to cause her to lose respect for you. You'll lose respect for you. She telling you that she'll let you know when she wants to come back, is not a good thing. That's her fishing. Her trying to telling you to come back.

From my perspective you're better off telling her when the time is right, the two of you will discuss it. That you are interested in fixing your marriage, but that you want to do it right and not rush it. That you want a new relationship with a mature, responsible woman who is strong enough to meet your needs as well as strong enough to have her needs met by you.

My $0.04 worth.

AJ

[hooper1668]

AFWAW,
Puppy is correct...IMHO the affair is still ongoing. You need to try to confirm any and if possible all four of the OM. You need to present this to your 1St Sgt and CC. If you ask you will find out that no UCMJ action will happen but...the fear of loss of stripes ( or commission) will stop them. At you and your Ws rank you are talking major loss of benefits for life. mindblank is dead on target...your time for Mr Nice Guy is coming to an end. It is so important for you to get proof...ask friends, hire a PI, see if your Shirt will help investigate (unofficially) gather evidence. I know you are scared and hurt right now...soon you will go to angry and I don't give a crap.

That is normal...you need to prepare for the divorce without her knowing anything if that makes you feel better but you must prepare. With the Bronze Star if yuo do not make E-8 this year you will probably make it next year...you are talking about $12K per year now and $6K per year retirement pay for the rest of your life. It is estimated that a E-7 retirement pay is worth about $600K and a E-8 pay is worth about $1.2M...it is possible this "affair" may cost you personally about $300K before it is over.

You need proof of the affair to protect your retirement...I am sorry to make this so clinical when I know (personally, I am mil/mil) that you are hurting as I was in the same situation as you. I am not saying she is sleeping with one of the four but you can bet big money something is going on adn I doubt it is watching movies. A mother doesn't leave her daughter like this with no plan...her only plan can be another man. Unless she is an addict (drugs, alcohol, etc) a mother will not normally leave her kids with no plan. What will happen if you get a short notice assignment with your promotion? If she has filed first your daughter will stay with her in Fl and you will PCS. You will have trouble with custody and the court will feel that it is best for your daughter to stay as is ( with your W). Then you will find that your pay is garnished and you will feel like a dead beat dad for not paying...you wife will have her shirt call your shirt/commander and get you in trouble with a markdown on your EPR resulting in no chance for CMSgt.

I know you are hurting...accept it as this is how life is right now but it will get better. I pray you make SMSgt...that is a big change in everything...think of yourself as a JR CEO. It is an incredible accomplishment as is E7. I some times think two SNCOs living together is an explosion waiting to happen...with you is seems to have expolded...for me we had to totally split our personal and professional life as we kept butting heads (lucky for me I out rank her!)

For now accept that it is over...fix yourself legally, ( I know you think you have but just because she said she will pay something doesn't mean she will nor will she have to legally. I have 10 yrs+ in Fl but cannot remember but I think any debt may have to be split...that is why I worry about the apartment and other bills she is creating that you do not know about...I had one guy that worked for me that had his wife buy a motorcycle as a gift for her OM the day before he came back. She emptied all accounts, moved out of the house with everything (except his clothes) got a restraining order and a divorce. Told him the day he returned...long story short is he lost everything, filed bankruptcy, sees his daughter for the summer ( he is now in England and she is in Canada, she was AD but got out to follow her "dream"...)

I am going to back off for now as I find myself getting emotional...only you know what you want. I am praying you get SMSgt but want you to think about next year also...the Bronze Star will really help you (unless you are EOD - all of them have one and rightfully so) with next years board and for Chief later. I do not think that your marriage is over and nothing you have posted is that unusual even if you think that it is.

You should (must) decide what you want out of your life...if it is to get out and get a GS-7-9 job and stay where you are now that is ok. I can tell you those jobs have been here since 1947 and will be after you retire with E8/E9 pay. Nothing is more important than your daughter...sounds like you put your foot down which is good. Do not let her get in the middle of this and confront your wife (be kind) if she involves her. Talk to Mental Health for advice. Get your evidence gathered, try to get ahead on all bills (I guarantee you that being broke will destroy your life, your wife, and you daughter)...do what it takes but 3-6 months ahead with enough savings to survive 3-6 months will give you time to work your issues. Do not get mad and retire. Do not give up your ability to support yourself and your daughter. Do not slide into the "drunk" mode. Try to make yourself go to church (maybe not on base, too much expectation of professional behaviour and all that, church should be fun for you and your family to include your wife, I strongly encourage you go this Sunday if for no other reason to make your wife think of her actions, and she will, and you do not need to say anything to her, only your daughter...encourage her but do not make her, if possible let her pick a church) anyways...you are doing great...time to back off a little with your wife...tell her your dream would be to have a happy marriage, dream retirement, house, grandkids, vacations, and rocking on the porch and the constant yo-you is destroying you and for the well-being of your daughter you just want to focus on your parent skills for now. Sorry if I in anyway offended you...not my intent. Thanks for your service...Aim High and all that! *chuckle, chuckle!

[hooper1668]

AFWAW,
I started typing my reply before reading the others...please listen to BobbiJo, dburt, AJM, and PDT. If you cannot do it for yourself do it for your daughter...I know it hurts you so bad right now but one day (soon) the pain will lessen ( I do not think it will ever go away, so sad) but you will deal with it. Do not get the mindset that your life is over...it is not and because I think you think your wife is who you want to grow old with I want you to have what you want...you will find someone incredible for you...do not sell yourself short, YOU WILL HAVE A GREAT LIFE with or without her.

Take care,
V/r,

[hooper1668]

For what it's worth and it’s not much...she had the decency to move out and confess before you became aware of the affair...that makes me think she knows she is wrong and is feeling guilty and the potential for you to be together is there otherwise I would recommend you burn her in the divorce…she is too close to retirement to throw it away.

[AFWAW]

Thanks everyone for your responses. I understand and hear what you are saying. I know I'm letting myself get caught back up in the drama. All these emotions are playing havoc w/ my mental well being. And yes, I feel like a yoyo. I honestly don't know what to do anymore. I tried the being positive bit, keeping it light, etc and she percieved that as I'm not interested anymore. I've told her how I feel and she makes more excuses about not coming home. I do understand that she may still be involved w/ OM. Her attitude has changed though over the past 2 weeks--why, I don't know. It could be because OM is not in the pic, once again I don't know. Don't think for a sec that I don't think it's a possibility. I'm sure most of you can tell that I'm very frustrated at this point in time and am unsure how to proceed. I honestly don't know what I want. Part of me wants my wife back. I want a life with her. I enjoy her company. I'm holding back the other part of me--the scary part, the oh so scary part. I don't want to be cruel to my wife ever but I fear that if I get a divorce all this pent up frustration and anger over what has happened will come unleashed and I won't ever want to see her or hear from her again. I am scared of what the future holds. I know I don't have to make a decision today or tomorrow but one day I'll have to make a decision. I just wish things wouldn't have turned out this way. I honestly would have gone nuts now if it wasn't for this board. Thanks again for all your responses, I just don't know what to do at this point as nothing seems to be working.

[Puppy Dog Tails]

Thanks again for all your responses, I just don't know what to do at this point as nothing seems to be working.

I disagree -- what you WERE doing was working. Clearly. Can you not see that? Go back and read your own thread.

Then, you blinked.

I tried the being positive bit, keeping it light, etc and she percieved that as I'm not interested anymore.

And that's exactly what you WANT her to perceive!!! That's what Gucci is trying to teach you. It is only when a WAS perceives that you MAY not be so interested anymore that they will make the move back towards you.

John, I speak frequently about this forum about "The Script." Usually, it's regarding the wayward spouse. Well, there's a "script" for the betrayed spouse, too, and it often includes someone getting very close to paydirt, and then they go all Melty Man. It happens all the time.

I've also never, EVER seen it work. Including in my sitch.

Puppy

[gucci loafer]

I tried the being positive bit, keeping it light, etc and she percieved that as I'm not interested anymore.

That is what you WANT her to think. She tested you (I told you she would and you HAD to PASS the test) You WANT her to think those things because you SHOULD be giving her some signals that you don't want her back. It is called.. I HAVE A BACKBONE and you have been having an affair. It is a strong, male, confident,approach. (which ATTRACTS women)

Of course she is going to test your resolve. Until you can pass these tests like successful men do, then I can't help you.

When she told you that you didn't seem like you wanted her back you NEEDED to say to her....." You may be right. I have been doing some thinking and I guess I am not sure anymore."

How well has telling her you still wanted her back been working for you?

How well has her been telling you that she isn't sure been working for her?...

AFWAW.. When a woman backs off, the smartest thing a man can do is to back off an equal distance. ("I feel the same way type of attitude") This then HELPS the woman to move PAST those feelings because it causes her thought process to change. (feelings FOLLOW THOUGHTS, so.. for feelings to change.. we need her thoughts to change) This is why you WANT her to wonder if you don't want her back. It changes her thought process. You HAVE to follow this through. HOLD THE LINE. (I have told you to hold the line and you need to grasp what that means) We are using the word WONDER here. You don't tell her that you don't want her back. You tell her that you are not SURE if you do and you are not SURE what you want. This is what will cause her to wonder. The fact is you are not telling her much of anything. You WANT her to fill in the blanks.. (have I gone too far, has he found someone else, what if it is too late) This is why you can NOT reassure her when she uses her tactics on you that have been so successful for her.

You need to be using the same stategy she is. (her strategy is the one that IS working) SHE is saying the things I keep recommending to you. It seems to be working fabulous for her doesn't it? Haven't you noticed that when she backs off that you NATURALLY WANT to move toward her?

What you were doing over the weekend WAS working. You blew it and drove yourself back to square one. You should never have told her that you were "just giving" her space. You had the perfect opportunity at lunch to move this in YOUR direction. (which should be to tell her..."hmmmmm maybe you ARE right, maybe I don't know what I want either. I have decided that I am not sure I want to be with someone that can't make up their mind and is in love with someone else. I guess I haven't been thinking clearly. I guess I know how YOU feel now huh?"

Then SHUT UP....


Her mentioning this to you SHOWED that it was working.
She outplayed you again because you really don't trust the game plan because of lack of confidence and resolve and because you are following your "feelings."



Your whole attitude and demeanor should be that YES you are giving up. YES you are not sure you want her back. I told you not to be mean or punitive. (YOU WEREN'T, but you let her set the reality because of your fear) When she told you that she was reaching out to you and you cut her short, all you needed to say was... "Oh, I'm sorry, I guess I didn't realize that I cut you short. I was pretty busy and had my mind on some other things."

She may then say at a later time... "Do you still love me?"...
You: "I will always love you, but I'm not sure if I am "in" love with you. I am not sure what I feel right now."

Please notice the use of the words "maybe you are right" and "I am not sure." These are the phrases YOU need to be using.


Then SHUT UP... not mean. not punitive...


You are now back to square one. You are now feeling like...(you know what again)

[AFWAW]

And that's exactly what you WANT her to perceive!!! That's what Gucci is trying to teach you. It is only when a WAS perceives that you MAY not be so interested anymore that they will make the move back towards you.

Ok, I saw this and it did not seem she was moving back towards me, it seemed like she was resolved to moving on without me. Am I reading this incorrectly?