True Love or True Fog? Changing Forums

[Silver Fox]

Thanks TH and Jack,

I'll respond to your posts later tonight. For now, I just got home from work and there's a sad, sad sounding message on my answering machine from H - "I'm wondering if I can come over tonight, I need to get the tax forms. I tried to call you on your cell, guess you've had the number changed - I'll email you". The call was at 7:15 this morning - he knows or used to know that I leave the house by 7. There's no email either.

And no, I haven't changed my cell#, he just hasn't used it in so long he's forgotten it. And, the grass is knee high, trees and limbs are still down from the storm 2 months ago, the house is STILL falling in but he has to have the tax forms? For what? He doesn't bother to say but he was supposed to meet with a bankruptcy L this week.

So I'm sitting here trying to decide what to do. I'm tempted to just email and say the tax forms are on the table, I've got plans for tonight. But I don't really and I don't want to just drive around avoiding him.

Any advice?

[Jack_Three_Beans]

Do what you can do successfully with him.

IF you can be in the same house and not get: angry, mopey, needy, weepy...pick a crappy description. Then be there.

IF you cannot? Go for a ride and leave the forms on the table.

Seeing him just to see him, hoping that somehow, this time it will be different, he'll look up and see me and realize what he is losing...well that works in movies...crappy ones at that.

Advice: Have no expectations.

[Flicka]

Sit on the porch with a shotgun.

[Silver Fox]

Ha Ha Ha Ha Ha!! I love you Flicka. Can you move here for awhile and be me?

Well, I called my "on call" girlfriend and we went out for dinner. Just got back - no other phone calls from H, no email, and it doesn't look like he was here either. I guess he changed his mind since that early morning call? What ever.

Thank you Jack for this:

Do what you can do successfully with him.

IF you can be in the same house and not get: angry, mopey, needy, weepy...pick a crappy description. Then be there.

IF you cannot? Go for a ride and leave the forms on the table.

Seeing him just to see him, hoping that somehow, this time it will be different, he'll look up and see me and realize what he is losing...well that works in movies...crappy ones at that.

Advice: Have no expectations.

I'm pretty sure now since his visit 2 weeks ago that I can control my emotions and I'm way past the seeing him just to see him - did that all last year. Tonight I just wanted to do the "I'm unavailable" method and I really didn't want to be bothered with it all - does that mean I've detached? Plus, they are my taxes too, I have a right to know what he wants them for don't I before I hand them over?

[pearlharbr]

Hey Silver, glad you went out to dinner with a gf. Sounds suspiciously like my xBF with wanting to see the cats. Hmm...

Yes, you do have a right to know what's going on with the taxes and his bankruptcy filing if it's going to affect you. But that doesn't mean you have to do it in person if you don't want to.

Seems like the folks over here in MLC are taking good care of you!

[AliSuddenly]

Wow Silver... everytime this man tries to approach you, EVERY time, you shut him down. Can you see that? I've said this to you before... I am not sure this is good DBing.. like the time at Christmas he wanted to have a drink with you.

Lets look at it from HIS perspective (I know, he's a selfish MLCer *rse, but hey...)... he calls you to let you know he'd like to come over (which is hard for these guys to swallow their pride and do that).. and says I dont have your cell number.. and.. what do you do? Not return his call, not text/email him to say, sure that would be fine, but what time? NO.. you ignore it and go out. Everytime he asks to see you, or speak, you stonewall him.. if I were him, I'd feel you were VERY angry at me and the path home to you was just too damn difficult, too many of your walls to climb and I just couldnt see how it were possoble.. and as I have had a crisis and scr*wed my life up already, I dont think I can face putting in the hard work to fix this, seeing as yuo dont even want to see me to hand over a tax form....

capiche!?

I was going to ask you what happened about hte discussion we were having on your last thread about stepping away from the safety and security of the LRT and being VERY dark on him.. Jody had said people cling to that technique as its a safety net and comforting. But.. at some point, you do have to try something different and your H keeps trying to engage with you (ok, in his lame, cloaked MLC way) but.. others here have to be the bigger person and be blase and run with any little crumb offered, as a good opportunity to DB (me included) even though ow is STILL in the picture. I am curious why you keep refusing to deal with him.. are you trying to win him back or punish him !!???

So.. you came here to be challenged... thers some food for thought !

Al xxx

[Silver Fox]

Thank you Ali,

I do appreciate your perspective and the challenge is duly noted! And guess what, he was just over here for nearly 3 hours. There was an email from him this morning asking the same thing as the call yesterday - need to get tax forms today. Before I could answer it he sent another one saying he would also like to come over to cut the grass while I was at work. I gave in on this one - glad that the offer came from him, rather than me saying you need to cut the damn grass!

So, after I arrived and he finished with the yard he began where he left off 2 weeks ago:

- "we need to decide what to do with the house"
- "what if I take the house and all the debt and then declare bankruptcy"
- "what if I work on the house and you stay here another year then sell it"
- "renting or you getting a roommate is probably not a good idea" (you think?)
- "I think it's better if we get D first and then bankruptcy"

He had nothing in writing which is what he said he would do 2 weeks ago. But he also said I was right about his L, he's young and hasn't handled many D cases (yeah, I'm right about something!) and maybe we should just meet with my L together.

He cried several times and talked about how he's messed everything up - "I can't even get a D right".

I stayed calm - I think I've finally reached it - I tried to validate - no, H you're not a failure, you can pull yourself out of this, you're capable of making the right choices. I did not talk about the OW AT ALL.

But I did say I was sorry he's in so much pain and that he's beginning to face the consequences of his choices now. I reminded him that he said he was unhappy 2 years ago when he left - are you happy now? (yes, probably a slip up but he didn't answer me anyway). And I said that there is another option. He knew what I meant - this is the closest we got to R talk. His standard reply - "I can't change my feelings" - yuk.

But Ali, he is completely convinced that a D has to happen. Winning him back? - I don't know at this point. Do I win him back by giving him the one thing he wants?

[JayMan]

Silver,
It boils down to an easy simple point.

I said a few weeks ago it was about sympathy, and it still is. If there was any regret in him, he'd be BEGGING for a chance to make things right. He knows how you feel.

He had nothing in writing which is what he said he would do 2 weeks ago.

There you go. My W kept saying she was "working" on dissolution papers. I waited three months as she piddled with an affair, then said, "Screw this." I went and got my OWN dissolution papers in less than 2 weeks.

If he refuses the one option that just might allow him to be a man, regain some semblance of dignity, and begin to right the wrongs in his life, then let him.

I know it's easy for me to say, not having your feelings and emotions, but seriously...

I understand Ali's perspective, but I'm sorry - you don't need to go out of your way for anything. You are not pushing him away, the man is having an affair! He has run bankrupt, left you destitute, screwed up his life, and so on.

I'd consider suggesting you change how you react to him if he showed any contrition or attempted to right any wrongs, but he can't even make an attempt?

"I can't change my feelings" - what a line of bullcrap. Suck it up, get your friggin' life together, and be a man!

(Sorry to dump on your significant other, but the whiners REALLY get my dander up)

My W borrowed $500 for me, then when it was time to pay it back, she didn't have the money, but buys pizza for OM and his kids, drives to his home that's 1.5 hours away (in a gas-guzzler) and so on - well, I'm sorry if you have to suck it up and eat macaroni-and-cheese for a couple of weeks, welcome to real life, honey!

Now, I'm being a bit vitriolic, and I understand that this is not the way to approach the conversation.

I think you handled it perfectly. You were appropriately supportive, you didn't take the "oh-poor-me" bait, and you didn't degenerate into R talk. I think you couldn't have done anything better.

[pearlharbr]

^ Amen!

I think you did a great job too Silver. You were calm, pleasant and validated.

Jon is right, he wants you to be a guest at his pity party. You can, and did, politely decline.

It's all about actions or lack thereof.

I refused to see xBF until he told me he was done with OW. And that turned out to be not true so I refused to see him again until he quit his bowling team. Actions.

[Jack_Three_Beans]

WTF is up with the new people in MLC giving out crappy advice?