Oops!!.......I think I've dropped the rope!!

[glamgirl]

SC so sorry. How did you find out? I can't even imagine what you are feeling. Just let it go. You dan't stop what he does. Hang in there, your h is way lost right now and nothing you can say or do will bring him to understand.

Hugs!

[mishka422]

(((((SC))))))

I'm so sorry you are going through all of this. None of us ever wants to hear that one of our 'band of sisters' is facing what we have. You are so strong and you WILL make it to the other side of this.

Be strong and hang on to that GD!

[dl443322]

T, are you ok? Hang in there, alright? You can get through this, you know you can. One moment at a time, if you need to. Remember all that you have, your children, granddaughter, family, friends and a job.

You are going to be ok, my friend. No one knows what the future holds. Right now, take care of you. Keep the focus on you and your family. Let h blow in the wind.

We are here.

[Silent Chrleader]

Hey, [[[[[Friends]]]]]].

Again, thank you so much for your seeming limitless compassion and understanding and support. I am feeling a little stronger. I started to post last night but was so exhausted from lack of sleep the night before and I hadn't been able to eat and there was so much to say. I gave up.

So, I am just going to paste the communication between H and myself yesterday and see what you all think. I know I haven't done at all well "DB" wise, but I have finally stood up and dropped the rope.

You now have permission to move your accounts.

Thank you.

By the way, what ever happened to getting the roof on the house fixed? Please remember that is part of the list of your obligation to that house that you want to be "mine" while it is in such terrible shape because all funds over the last 5 years have gone into the "dream house", which (big surprise) you want to be "yours".......

I can't believe that once again, you have proved my mother spot on correct...........less than a year.......

And by the way, I took $ (the rest of "my" half of the tax return?) from the joint account. I will be using it to retain a lawyer. You will be notified of who that is.

"SC", I have stated on several occasions over the last year that I wanted a divorce. This is really not new to you. My intentions really have not changed.

If you wish to spend your $ on an attorney that is your business. Now that you have removed all the money you are entitled to please call the bank to relinquish your access to the account. I will continue to make the bill payments with this account. Let me know when this is complete. Please arrange to obtain your own cell phone account by 1 may. You have a 1500 text message limit on the 1468 line to carry you to the end of bill period. I have not started trash pickup please make sure this is in your name. Please change the utility accounts to your name as well. I will continue to provide financial help for the billing based on need. Let me know what that is.

I will stand by my intentions to complete this separation with civility, maturity and dignity, my hope is that you will choose the same approach. If you would like to resolve this amicably, and reasonably, let me know when we can sit down to discuss. On the phone is OK or in person is fine as well. If you retain a lawyer, then I too will have to get one. I have stated all along that I would not fight you on any issue you are entitled to. Do you wish to join me in the bankruptcy process? If you don’t, there will be another $1800 you might have to come up with.

You know the truth, H, and so do I, and so do our children. But, I will not argue the point with you on this ever again.

So, am I correct in understanding that you wish to file for divorce, not legal seperation, at this time?
T

Our children only know what you tell them. You should not be involving them either.

My wish as of yesterday was to sit down and talk about the future. I told you that several times. I also told you it was a future that was separate from yours. This has also been clear from the beginning. Beyond that you have consistently pushed and prodded everything in a scattering of directions.

I will restate my position.

I will stand by my intentions to complete this separation with civility, maturity and dignity, my hope is that you will choose the same approach. If you would like to resolve this amicably, and reasonably, let me know when we can sit down to discuss. On the phone is OK or in person is fine as well. If you retain a lawyer, then I too will have to get one. I have stated all along that I would not fight you on any issue you are entitled to. Do you wish to join me in the bankruptcy process? If you don’t, there will be another $1800 you might have to come up with.

Again, you know the truth. You have not been so very "clear" at all! Back in July of last year, you agreed that in January we would come back together to see if we could work things out, and befor that happened you said we would come together "with our list" ......neither of which has happened. You have refused from the beginning to even discuss our marriage either in counseling with me or between us (and from what I understand you did much the same in session alone with C).

Our children have tried to tell you of their pain, and while you have listened, you have given no understanding, comfort, nor accepted your responsibility in any of it. Now they are both "adults". I have not "involved" them in the way you seem to imply. I do not try in any way to enlist their support of me over you. In fact, when both of them voice much hostility and anger at you, I have ALWAYS been quick to defend and get them to try to understand you and your actions. You know this has been the case throughout our marriage. For this, I have actually earned their anger and disrespect for "not standing up to you". Furthermore to think that the trashing of our family will not affect them or to think that they don't see what goes on and have their opinions is to completely disregard their feelings as human beings and to be totally selfish.

And contrary to your allegation of me "pushing and prodding in a scattering of directions" is absolutely false. I have not changed my wishes from the beginning. I have simply asked for the dignity and respect of your honesty. That is, I have continually just asked you to be straight with me and you have refused to all along. You tap dance and sneak and hide and make promises and agreements that you have no intention of keeping. You absolutely know H that if anyone has been "clear" in their wishes and intentions over the past year it is definitely NOT YOU!! You have told everybody about the counseling "we" have been in, and yet you know that you have mislead them all into thinking that meant you had worked on our marriage in the past year!

H, I will never again defend myself to you. I made many mistakes in our marriage and I have told them to you and accepted my responsibility for that and I will forever be sorry for not having been the best I could be. But, I know now in my heart that I did my very best to save this marriage and our family and I believe that you can not say the same. You have treated me in what I feel is a degrading fashion all too often throughout this and I will not allow you the power of causing me this pain any more. (cases in point.....counting last night on the phone (until you were going to hang up on me)........telling me to leave a message and you would call back if you though it "worthy"......the list is endless).

The man you have become is a liar and adulterer and cheater with no honor or integrity. You have money and "status" and as I understand now will have a new wife and "kids" you can pretend to be the great man with, while the real family you helped make what it is today, you have kicked aside. And when you become a "step-grandpa" you can put on the show of what a devoted family man you are........but your real grand-daughter you don't even stop to coo at for a second when you are in the same room with her. This is the man you have chosen to be. And you wonder why your son refuses to do anything he doesn't want to, and twists everything around so the rules don't apply to him........

As for practical matters, I am the one looking at having to change doctors and how to pay for all the medications I take and everything, and I am supposed to trust you to make sure I get "what I am entitled to"? The issue is that what I feel I am entitled to and what you feel I am entitled to is two completely different things! And the truth is that I am not sure that I ever wish to even be in your presence or hear your voice ever again. I have to take a little time to think on how I want to proceed, but I will protect myself and my children! I believe that it seems better for both of us if we do the bankruptcy jointly before the divorce, because that gets the assets more defined and less complicated.

And I will tell you that if you want to have a hope of getting the "dream" house without a fight, you will agree to get the house on **** Lane completely up to snuff and in a comparable condition to the one in *****. Including floors (and trim), the deck, new roof, the gas stove downstairs, new paint inside and out, new doors (front & inside), fixing the hot tub.............like I said......comparable to the one in *****...........at your expense.......... which seems only fair because the actual money that went into "dream house" came from me and the **** Lane (aka "My") house has suffered from everything going to "dream".

You also promised to help move "the big stuff" from my apartment. I will be out tomorrow, so if you could just move the beds, my dresser, and the TV, that would be much appreciated. You are the only one who knows how to take apart and put back together the bed..........but, if this presents a problem for you, then that's fine. I'm sure I'll muddle through.........

If you want my help to move you need to be there helping as well. I don’t want to make several trips with the truck. Rent a u-haul for the day. It is $20 plus milage, (3 blocks) we can move it all at once. Who else will be there to help? I will not do this on my own. I will be available after I drop MIL off at airport 9 and return.

I guess never mind then. I think the u-haul is a very good idea, but step-bro has plans for tomorrow, and I have not talked to brother in several weeks and don't plan or care to right now........certainly I'm not asking step-dad. I only hoped you and S18 could at least do the big bed (because it's so complicated to take apart) and the TV (because it's fragile).......but if not, that's OK. I'll figure it out.

By the way, in the future, please e-mail me to arrange in advance (a week if possible) when you want to work on the house.

Thanks.

Does S18 have any other help? What about D24 fiance? The TV is too hard for 2 guys. Is the china hutch empty? Is the dresser empty? If you arrange for the u-haul, maybe your mother can watch GD, and we can get this done, with just S18 and me I don’t think I want to move the TV, but we can move all the rest. Maybe with S18 and fiance and I we can move the TV. Need the u-haul though.

D24 Fiance is off on Saturday so he was available. No the dresser isn't empty. Let me think about it......I hate to call my mom last minute.

I had dinner last night with my MIL. She said H seems to be happy and knows what he wants and I need to move on too. I told her I knew this was the case, but I also spent some time clarifying some issues with her especially regarding my kids and their feelings toward their father and the history that MIL is not really knowledgeable of. I told her that it was significant that both his kids want nothing to do with him and their feelings matter. MIL thinks it was wrong of my S18 to tell me of PA with secretary. We had to agree to disagree on that. I told her it was wrong for H to put his son in that position, and that was only one of many lies H told S18 about to the point that S18 now has no respect for or trust in his Dad.

When I got home after dinner, this e-mail was waiting for me....

What is your plan?

Will you be helping?

Who will be there to help?

Have you arranged for a u-haul? They are open on Sat at 9

Have you unpacked the china cabinet?

Have you released your interest in the Joint account? They are open on Sat.

I need to know before I leave to pick up my mother.

H,

There is no need to concern yourself any further on the move. I will take care of myself and my needs.

I have decided that I am willing to do the bankruptcy together as it behooves us both to do so. I have done some searching on what it's best to do first and the general concensus seems to be it's better to do the bankruptcy first.

I have decided to not contact a lawyer right now, but to see if in fact we can work together to split things in a fashion we can both agree is "fair and equitable". However, I will retain the $ I transferred today from my half of the tax return in my account as a back up should that turn out to not be the case. In that same vein I am not taking my name off the joint account so that we can still both maintain access and verifiability that agreements are followed. You know without doubt that I am absolutely an honest person and have never given you reason to think I will abuse the access. As I have always said, I do NOT look to "shaft" you at all. Never have. Never will. However, I will take the necessary steps to protect myself.

I do not believe that I am out of line at all in demanding that the *** Lane house be brought to a comparable condition with the "Dream" House. It is patently unfair that you should demand the "dream" house be yours because you can afford it, while allocating the ***** Lane house that is in shambles because everything went in to the "dream" property.

Also, attached is a budget for me. Please look at it and you will see that if I keep paying the car payment and my student loans (which can't by law be included in the bankruptcy), with the added utilities then I really can not make the house payment at all, thus you will keep having to pay it. Even with D24 and Fiance's rent, the funds are not there, although I may be underestimating the contribution they can make, and they are alread paying for TV, but that does not make much difference really. I also don't have insurance in there which I assume I will have to get in my name at some point........

Another concern is also my loss of benefits. With the new vendor my workplace has for medical/dental, they required that I have both (couldn't have just the dental) so I signed up for the medical, which the premium is a big deal but there are co-pays with the meds (which I don't have with the military), and I understand from a coworker who takes **** (a med similar to the one I take) and she has to pay $100 per Rx. for it. So, the cost can be significant, and as you know, these needs are important to me.

My employer in all possibility will not be giving bonuses for the next couple years at minimum, thus my expected income is only the $*** salary I make (a significant difference from your six figures).

Given these factors, I have been told that spousal support could very well be ordered by a judge at least for a few (2-3?) years (attached is also a short write up of the factors that are taken into account for this state when considering spousal support).
State Spousal Support/Maintenance/Alimony Factors

In State the support payments (if any) can certainly influence how the marital property distribution is awarded, which is why it can become a very intricate part of the final outcome of any divorce. Keeping this in mind, if you and your spouse are unable to reach and agreement on this issue, the Family Court will order support from one spouse to the other on a case-by-case basis as follows:

The court will consider all relevant factors, excluding marital misconduct, including but not limited to: (1) The financial resources and assets of the party seeking maintenance; (2) The time necessary to acquire sufficient education or training to enable the party seeking maintenance to find employment appropriate to his skill, interests, style of life, and other attendant circumstances; (3) The standard of living established while married; (4) The length of the marriage; (5) The age and health condition, and financial obligations of the spouse seeking maintenance; and (6) The ability of the spouse from whom maintenance is sought to meet his needs and financial obligations while meeting those of the spouse seeking maintenance. (Revised Code of State - Title 26 - Chapters: 26.09.050, 26.09.090, 26.09.120)


So, this is where I stand right now. I am more than willing to listen to your thoughts on these matters. However, I do not have any desire to be in your presence or have any direct contact with you for now. I ask that you please honor my request to give me notification if/when you plan to come to the house to do the work there. Tomorrow working on the floors should be fine.

If you have a need to communicate with me, please do so via e-mail.

Today, D24 called and asked if I had said something to her dad about not acknowledging GD. I said yes. And she said "I thought so!" She said that H has been happy to the point of downright "chipper" and that he even "was talking babytalk" at GD. So, maybe some of what I said he took to heart.

S18 refunsed H's demands that he go work on the house today. S says he will do the work when H isn't there. H didn't appreciate that. I had a talk with S18 that it's not OK to be using this issue to get out of work he just doesn't want to do. I told him he had better do the work during the week like he has said he will and not blow it off or I will not support his position to not be there to work when H is there anymore.

I know H will blame me for S18's stance. I told S18 that H was still his father and loves him and he may one day regret cutting off his dad. I told him it was his decision, but that I felt he should not go this far.

Today, I pretty much "vegged" all day. I didn't sleep well again last night in spite of my exhaustion (kept waking up every couple hours). But, I am feeling a little more rested now.

On another front, the guy that I have been in contact with from the dating site, wants to meet me. I have been honest with him about my sitch and that I do not want to hurt anybody or be hurt but getting involved in a "rebound" or "revenge" relationship. He has been understanding and supportive and he makes me laugh......a LOT!! Which is something I really appreciate right now!!

So, that's the update in all it's gorry detail. As I said, not good DB'ing I know (a lot of tit for tat shots), but I at least have stood up for myself now and am trying to REALLY drop the rope, and am not feeling downright suicidal anymore!

I am interested in your input......

[[[[[[[[[[hugs]]]]]]]]]]

[Silent Chrleader]

Well, H has apparently closed the Joint account, so I can't see how he is handling our "financial" affairs. I don't know if I should mention it to him or just ignore it.

I have a feeling this is now going to get ugly.

[Silent Chrleader]

Well, I sent an e-mail to him.

I see you have closed the joint account.........So much for being "amicable" and "clear".....?? D24 said you were downright "chipper" today so she figured you had something "sneaky" going on........See how well she knows you? I'm having a real feeling this is going to get ugly, H. Do you really want that? I don't. But I will stand up for myself and our kids.

I have been getting phone calls several times daily from *******. I would appreciate it if you would call them and tell them that you have taken over that account so they stop calling.

Have a feeling this is going to get very ugly. That is how H will "validatte" his position. I really don't want to do this!! I really don't!

[glamgirl]

Sorry SC that you are going through this. I know that what I post you probably won't want to hear, but based on your interactions via e-mail with your h, it seems you are angry and bitter.

I am sure your h feels like you backed him into a corner and now he needs to come out fighting, hence closing the joint account. In his mind you just reinforce why he wanted out of the M. It just seals the deal.

What would be best, is that you back off from the situation and let it go. Your h is with someone else right now (I think) and you are not going to be able to change that. In his mind the M is done and he sees NO reason why he shouldn't be with somebody.

You will probably feel much better if you distance yourself from your h and put this all on a shelf for now. It seems you push your h for answers and then you either don't like what you hear or your h comes off as if he doesn't care or isn't following his word. No suprise! You are expecting too much from him.

Step back, leave him be, and stop having contact with him. Did any of above really need to be resolved today. Don't count on him, as in the moving. SC your h is NOT there for you NOW!

I do understand where you are at and realize how difficult this is, but you DO have a choice to change you and your perspective.

HUGS!

[Silent Chrleader]

Hey, [[[Glam]]].

Yes, I know I have been letting my emotions dictate my actions and that is never a good thing. But, I think I am getting a better grip now. I sent H the following e-mail this morning.

OK, took a big breath and did some meditation and got some rest and hopefully have a better perspective.

I don't know if you closed the account or maybe you just changed the Password for the account. Either way, it's really no nevermind to me. If you are concerned about my access to your funds, the better way I suggest would be to change the direct deposits to your other account and still use the joint account to take care of all the joint bills and such. In fact, I would encourage you to do this so that makes transactions in there a bit clearer. But I do promise you, H, I will not take advantage of my access to the joint account (if it's still open) other than to simply keep an eye on what's done and cover our collective ass if you have overlooked something (as has happened a couple of times because you have a lot on your plate). I give my word I certainly will not withdraw or use funds in there without your prior notification and approval.

I really don't want our sitchuation to get ugly, H, and I know you don't either.

By the way, when D24 made the "sneaky" remark, I told her to cut it out and accept that perhaps you were simply trying to be pleasant. She then said that you did acknowledge GD and she was very appreciative of that. She is a beautiful baby, isn't she!! I swear when I sit and hold her while she sleeps in my arms, all the crap just falls away and everything is right with the world.

I also had a talk with S18. I told him that if he wants some space from you for a little while, that's one thing, but he better not be using our situation to manipulate things to get out of work he doesn't want to do! I told him that he has to show his sincerity, good faith and professed "maturity" by actually doing the work at other times when you aren't there, and to still communicate with you on the progress of the work and how things should be done, etc...... I also told him that you are his father and you love him and that he would regret it later if he were to continue to cut you off as he seems to be doing right now. I told him I really thought that would be a mistake.

On the plus side, I am in contact with S18's GF's mother and BF's mother (a little) and have some mutual support from them on things. And S18 seems to have really turned over a new leaf in some respect and seems to be working on at least notifying me of what's going on with him, and where/how he can be reached if needed, and not getting into the "substances" as far as I know. Steps in the right direction at least. However, he seems to be saying he wants to do his GED and get a job instead of doing the self study thing.........I'm not sure if he's just saying that because he knows money is tight or what......but I will talk with him more on it.

H, I know that you are just making decisions for your own happiness and I do still want you to be happy. Really.

Take care.

OK, time to move forward..........keep breathing!!

[glamgirl]

Yes SC, much better. Now just back off and let him be. No more about the kids or GD. Let your h ask. Do you really need to be speaking to him or is this your way of keeping in touch?

I know how it is. I would find any and all excuse known to man to contact my h and then as usual would be left disappointed and discouraged. Hence, why you just back off.

You are doing good. Now breath and take some time for SC.

Enjoy the day!

[Silent Chrleader]

Thanks, [[Glam]].

My reason for the e-mail was to at least take a step in a positive direction for both of us, to perhaps reduce any snowballing effects there might be from the negative vibe in my last e-mails.

Now I am going to settle in, go completely dark, and NC, except for answers when he contacts me (except for the bankruptcy papers which I will e-mail to him when I complete).

Keep breathing......