Thanks for the inspiring words antlers. I appreciate them immensely. I'm trying so hard. I'm still new at all of this and am still finding it extremely confusing. I've read the book and to be honest I really feel as if I need someone to walk me through this. I want to change me. I want to a better me. I am just finding it difficult to figure out what I need to do. I am not getting the whole 180 thing. I don't know for sure what acting as if is. Am I supposed to just leave him be and not talk to him period? Please help me.
People here can walk you through this. If he wants no communication, then give him no communication. He's "in the fog". He doesn't know what he wants right now...except that, right now, he doesn't want to be involved in this relationship. You can't believe anything they say when they are at this stage. Go to work on yourself...like people talk about here. Don't bother trying to change his mind. He'll have to change it himself. Become the best 'you' that you can. This is hard stuff...just know that many of us here understand what you are feeling and going through.
"Always go straight forward, and if you meet the devil, cut him in two and go between the pieces." - William Sturgis, clipper ship captain, 1830's.
I do have a question. My H said that he feels like I will always be superior to him. That I will always have more education (currently working on my BSN and he just got his HS diploma and GED because he never made an effort to take care of it in the past but it's necessary to getting a job here in the US), be a better parent, will make more money, be more loving, and more caring. He says he wants someone who looks up to him with stars in their eyes saying, "Oh, you are so smart!". He says he wants to be with someone who looks up to him and because we are both very smart he feels that I don't need him. He says he has felt like I am not interested in him for a very long time. How does backing away and giving him space factor into this? It doesn't feel productive. HELP!?!
"It is excruciating pain. It is the pain of separation, the pain of loss, the pain of dreams and expectations unrealized. It is the loss and death of a mirage."
We all know that "it doesn't feel productive"! It's counter-intuitive to what your heart is telling you. You can't change his mind with your words. Period. Get support here. These people know what they're talking about. Don't trust your emotions right now...you know what kind of emotional state you're in right now...right? We all can relate to it. Stay here, and learn and get support, and talk to others.
"Always go straight forward, and if you meet the devil, cut him in two and go between the pieces." - William Sturgis, clipper ship captain, 1830's.
I want to ask something. What does it mean when you ask a spouse to take away your hope and tell you that they want a divorce and they won't do it?
You are not going to like this answer, but what it means is YOU ARE NOT DBing, you are absolutely doing the wrong thing. STOP pushing him - you are just appearing controlling, and he has told you that he isnt ready to do that, so take it as it is, accept that you slipped and luckily he gave you some insight - he isnt sure, so you have the opportunity to improve things.
There is a time for many situations where you need to say "its over" - read here about LRT (Last Resort Technique) and very much about "dropping the rope". LRT is called that for exactly that reason, it is a last resort, and can very well end up in ending the relationship. LRT is basically deciding you are ready to move on or move forward, but either way you lay down the law, and you state it is over and file. In some cases this reverses the situation and wakes up the WAS.. but it is not something to count on, you must be absolutely ready at that point to accept and FOLLOW THROUGH on ending things. You are not here yet!
Dropping the rope on the other hand is a little less heavy handed - it is the theory that all relationships are like a rope, with each spouse holding one end, pulling each other together.. sometimes both are holding close to the middle of the rope, sometimes one or both are further towards the end. Dropping the rope means not pulling on your end at all, in fact letting it go completely and taking care of yourself. You need to do this.
Originally Posted By: goingtofixME
He says he knows that he doesn't want to be with me right now, but that he can't say he wants a divorce and never wants to be with me. He says he doesn't feel right asking me to wait for him for however long it takes him to decide. He then goes on to list could be a year, two years, or five years as he doesn't really know. He is enjoying doing things for himself and not being responsible.
Just accept these statements, put them on a back shelf, and STOP ASKING. Learn how to not talk about the M at all, this is an absolute must!
Originally Posted By: goingtofixME
I begged him and cried and pleaded with him to tell me that he doesn't ever want me back and he can't do that. Can only say he doesn't want me right now. HELP!!!!! I got my book today and will be reading it as I can. I offered to let him read it in a hysterical kind of way and had to apologize. I just want him to know where I am coming from. Anywho, got to get back to work. I'll post to more threads on Wednesday when I am not working. Oh forgot to mention, I do have my appointment to get my hair done on Wednesday.
Stop begging for anything, stop pleading - WAS see this as very negative - why would anyone want to be with someone who is begging, crying, pleading. Be strong and just stop this! And once you have stopped - you will still slip, trust me, I have been there many times, including the beginning of my current situation, but it is very damaging. Every time you slip to begging, you fall back a few steps.. hard won steps! Please take heart in the fact that he cant say he wants to permanently end it, that is a good sign. Not to get your hopes up too far, you still have a very long way to go, and it may be a very long time.
READ THE BOOK, read the forums, learn what dosnt work and dont do it. When you do slip and do a dont, brush yourself off and forgive yourself and start over.
Lastly, on the hair and changes - make sure you are doing this for you. anything you do to intentionally please your WAS will just push him away..
X Love, confidence, trust, and patience. Most Recent Thread
It's one thing one minute and something else entirely. I just know that I can't keep trying to figure out what it is I did wrong to fix it because I can't fix the past. I can only use the things that he has said and the things I have been able to figure out about myself to become the best possible me I can be. I'm sick and tired of second guessing and defending myself. I can no longer do this.
WAS often waiver back and forth - they are like a pendulum. And what is worse as they find themselves drawn to you, they are at the same time repulsed because they had made the decision to walk, so being drawn to you is admitting they are wrong. You just have to hope that over time the pendulum swing gets less violent and settles (it will) and it may settle with your M restored.
Originally Posted By: goingtofixME
I wanted to get some validation from my H.
Please, for your own sake, stop this. I know (really know) this is hard - you want your H to see your changes, you want to grab him and say "look, I am changing for you, cant you see this!" - unfortunately this only makes the changes harder to accept, as they assume you will slip back away as soon as they stop fighting
X Love, confidence, trust, and patience. Most Recent Thread
I do have a question. My H said that he feels like I will always be superior to him. That I will always have more education (currently working on my BSN and he just got his HS diploma and GED because he never made an effort to take care of it in the past but it's necessary to getting a job here in the US), be a better parent, will make more money, be more loving, and more caring. He says he wants someone who looks up to him with stars in their eyes saying, "Oh, you are so smart!". He says he wants to be with someone who looks up to him and because we are both very smart he feels that I don't need him. He says he has felt like I am not interested in him for a very long time. How does backing away and giving him space factor into this? It doesn't feel productive. HELP!?!
Please read in DB and here about Validating. Learn to listen, really listen, and don't try to fix things - let him know you are listening, that you understand his position, and leave it at that. Where you have opportunity, you can complement him on what you think are his strengths - but don't overdo it, right now it should be about 10 sentences from him for about 1 word from you.
Please try to read the books, and understand what improving for ourselves first means. Understand that you cannot "fix" him, only yourself. Hopefully he will see this and come to believe it and maby even want to improve himself.
One last piece of advice: remember this is a marathon, not a sprint. You cannot fix what has occurred between you overnight. You must be dedicated to the long haul of taking care of yourself, improving yourself, and moving towards a better future - and that future is not tomorrow.
X Love, confidence, trust, and patience. Most Recent Thread
I want to thank you so much for taking the time and effort to calm me down and educate me on what I am doing wrong. I can't thank you enough for pointing things out that I need to do better. I am working on GAL. I did get my hair done partially for me. I went and joined a gym with the kids. It was partially for me and partially for them. I honestly don't know of anything that I want to do that will make me happy. I've been so sad for so long feeling as if I don't fit into the world due to my size. I have felt like I embarrassed my family by being so big and hid myself from the world. I have Cushing's Disease and it took me a long time to get a diagnosis and treatment and the recovery is actually worse than the disease at times. I believed when I had my brain surgery last year in April that I would get better and be able to lose weight and be the energetic person I am in my mind. I am doing more and pushing myself to get out more. It's a difficult process, but I will beat this. I will become a better me regardless of whether it brings him back to me. I'm tired of being tired.
Thank you again!
"It is excruciating pain. It is the pain of separation, the pain of loss, the pain of dreams and expectations unrealized. It is the loss and death of a mirage."
Good for you for working on GAL and joining the gym. This is something I did that I found really useful. I agree about validating what your H is saying to you and work on really listening. I am working on these same things at the moment and am finding it harder than I thought it would be. Reading the books I find helps me calm down and think about what I am doing when I get worked up over things. Hang in there and keep reading the boards you will find some good support and advice here.
Me-27 H-28 M-2.5 yrs T-8.5 yrs No kids B 1/09 S 2/09
Reading books is having the opposite effect on me. It doesn't calm me down. I end up thoroughly upset at the fact that I have been doing things so wrong as has he. I just got through reading Men are from Mars, Women are from Venus. This is a book that he downloaded at the very beginning of our relationship and he read it and I sort of read it. We sort of glossed over it and were looking for a quick fix. We joked about his need to go into his cave, but I never got to the part about a woman and her well. This book is our relationship in a nutshell. If we would have took the time to do our parts as shown in the book, would we be where we are today? If we would have understood our differences and appreciated each other for what we bring into our relationship would we be separated and he telling me he no longer loves me and only sees me as a mother? I can what if this to death and it's what I do. I get so frustrated. I want to go to him and point all of this out as proof that I see where we went wrong and I see what it is we need to do fix our situation. Which is me once again trying to fix things and control the situation. This is day two of no contact and I am having such a difficult time doing this. I'm scared that me leaving him alone, even though it is what he has said he wants, will push him farther away because he also has said that he has felt like I wasn't interested in him.
Another thing that I have pondered is his breaking down the day he left about his relationship with his father and how he did not want to be like his dad with my children. Part of his fear of being a bad father and of him rationalizing it's better that he leave because he doesn't want to be a dad. I believe he means he doesn't want to be a bad dad. Or am I wrong? Should I take him at his word? Even though everyone says you shouldn't believe what a WAS says.
He wants to be a hero. He has pointed out to me that in our relationship he has always tried to get people's attention because he didn't get it at home. He desires a woman who has starts in her eyes. I have gone looking back through our past conversations and the stars used to be in my eyes. Where did they go and why am I having such a hard time putting them back there? Do I see this as a weakness? *sigh*
I want to wake up from this nightmare. I want a better relationship with my husband. I don't want us living in two separate places away from each other and not loving each other. My love grows daily for him as I look back at what he put up with and now understand my role in the demise of our relationship. I can only hope that when I do fix me he will see my changes and realize how hard I am fighting to keep us together.
"It is excruciating pain. It is the pain of separation, the pain of loss, the pain of dreams and expectations unrealized. It is the loss and death of a mirage."
I also have begun to wonder if there isn't an OW. Someone who made him feel special and gave him the "star eyes" he needed to be able to break away from me. He bought a prepaid cellphone prior to him leaving. I am unsure when that happened. I don't think it was a PA as he didn't do the typical showering all the time, doing his hair, and other MLC type stuff. I just think it gave him the emotional boost he needed to justify his leaving. She made him feel smart and like he was interesting. Things I haven't done in a very long time and I only have myself to blame.
"It is excruciating pain. It is the pain of separation, the pain of loss, the pain of dreams and expectations unrealized. It is the loss and death of a mirage."
