WAW - Very confused and devastated - pt 6

[confusedinpa]

I don't think it would hurt for her to think that what she is doing could result in her losing you, especially if it is true.

Spellfire,

Thanks for checking in on me - it has been a very tough going of late. Hope your situation is progressing better than mine. I checked in our thread a few times, but I didn't post since, as you can read, I don't have anything good to offer with advice.

Anyway, I had thought about bringing this one up, but wasn't sure how to do it without making it sound like a threat.

One of my consistent messages, to the point she raised it as something I repeated very often, was that I believe in the marriage and believe that it can work.

How about something like this:

Right now, I see how we are both hurting. The hurt that we feel when being rejected by the one that we love builds resentment over time. I know that a loving marriage relationship needs to have both people free from resentment and hurt. While I may not agree with the separation, I do understand her need to have the space and freedom to work out issues.

Too subtle? Any thoughts?

[MrBond]

"Should I bring this up in our counseling session tonite - how I'm feeling conflicted about her now?"

No I definitely wouldn't. Let me put it to you this way...she's already in doubt about if she wants the relationship. Do you really want her to know that now YOU are in doubt? She's going to think that since you're "moving on" she can to.

Again, do you want to save your M? If you still do, then stay the rock. She is the one who is waffling back and forth, that's why you have to be the point of stability. Remember the rule of DBing is to stay consistent.

I told you that this is going to be a rough rollercoaster ride, and these back and forth feelings are all part of it. That's why it's important to have ONE goal in mind and stick with it no matter how hard.

"One of my consistent messages, to the point she raised it as something I repeated very often, was that I believe in the marriage and believe that it can work."

Then stop saying it. She's already told you she's tired of hearing it. She knows how you feel already.

"Right now, I see how we are both hurting. The hurt that we feel when being rejected by the one that we love builds resentment over time. I know that a loving marriage relationship needs to have both people free from resentment and hurt. While I may not agree with the separation, I do understand her need to have the space and freedom to work out issues. "

This is the same discussion you two have been having ever since you started counseling. Let her concentrate on her first, then your R. If she can't heal herself then you both can't move on. Make the counseling session about her and not all on the R or you. She is the key.

If you can't keep your own feelings out of this for a little while, you are going to be doomed to fail. You're still not detaching or showing her compassion. You do it by concentrating on her needs. Everything else will follow if you give her a safe haven to retreat back to. But if you keep bringing this stuff up about M, she's going to be concentrating on that and how ashamed, embarrassed she feels. I wouldn't want to go back to someone who keeps making me feel guilty. That's exactly what you're doing by constantly saying that YOU believe in M, etc. She hears it as SHE doesn't believe in M. I think she does, but is in a state of confusion right now. So you are indirectly accusing her without realizing it.

Let her process.

[confusedinpa]

This is the same discussion you two have been having ever since you started counseling. Let her concentrate on her first, then your R. If she can't heal herself then you both can't move on. Make the counseling session about her and not all on the R or you. She is the key.

What are your suggestions to handle it then when our counselor asks how things are going? My wife (except for last week), differs to me to answer.

I've been struggling with this one every week.

[PMA_Baby!]

My advice is to talk about the present. What u r feeling now about everything. Let the past stay in the past. The present is her moving out. You both having time and space to work on the hurt and continue to working on your friendship. Talk about how important it is to respect eachothers boundaries. If you both haven't defined them then that is the first step.

Good Luck, B

[MrBond]

Again, let her be the one to start the conversation. Divert it to her first. After all, she's the one who has been going through the most in terms of the move.

Or you can say, well W has started to move out of the home and... and you can trail off and look at her to show that she needs to continue.

While she's talking take very careful mental notes. See where she mentions you. Do not interrupt her, but after she's done, if there is anything that you disagree with, mention it then but only after she has finished. While she's talking, watch her body language, does she seem relaxed? Or is she crossing her arms across her chest and seems tense? You can also look at her legs. If she's crossing them at the ankles, then she's feeling defensive.

Make a note of which parts she feels relaxed about talking about. Same goes for when you are talking during the session. While you're talking, see how she's reacting. Especially when you mention her. You'll be able to gage what she agrees and disagrees with.

What you want to do is calibrate her feelings and her beliefs so you know what positives to emphasize when you're around her.

[antlers]

If you can't keep your own feelings out of this for a little while, you are going to be doomed to fail. You're still not detaching or showing her compassion. You do it by concentrating on her needs. Everything else will follow if you give her a safe haven to retreat back to.

Let her process.

This is good advice for ALL of us in this situation.

[confusedinpa]

Again, let her be the one to start the conversation. Divert it to her first. After all, she's the one who has been going through the most in terms of the move.

Or you can say, well W has started to move out of the home and... and you can trail off and look at her to show that she needs to continue.

Its tough for me to watch her as we sit next to each other on a love seat during the session. I had noticed in the beginning she would lean away from me. Now she seems to sit a little more upright. I typically lean a little away from her so I don't make her feel crowded.

I had tried differing to her first, but then she just glances it back at me.

How about this:

It was a very tough week as she started moving things out of our home.

And just leave it at that.

I'm worried about it as it may put her on the defensive.

Another thought is:

We have really messed things up (her quote from Friday nite) that has brought us to this point. She has said that she feels that she needs the time and space to heal before it's too late (again her quote from Friday nite). It is hard for me to see the woman I love in so much hurt.

Thoughts?

[antlers]

"We all make mistakes in marriage and God knows I sure did. I would do things differently if I could do them over. I would want us to try to build better communication skills, understand each other better, and learn how to resolve conflict in a better way."

[MrBond]

Yeah let it all go.

You are asking the same questions and both of you are reacting the same way. What you want to do is be the first one to break the cycle. You've started doing it with the changes, but now you're back to letting her emotions run how you feel.

"It is hard for me to see the woman I love in so much hurt."

True, but you can't do anything about it. Let me say it again. YOU can't do anything about it. SHE has to. It's all in her head and she knows it. She has told you she wanted space to sort things out but because of your concern for her, you can't let her go. So she feels trapped.

Again, she's the animal with a leg chain on. And the more she tries to break free, you make the chain stronger. Let her heal herself like she's asked you. Do something different.

When she sits upright that means she's paying attention. Don't move away from her while she's talking, rather turn your body towards her. This shows that you are receptive to what you're saying. You don't have to sit very close to her, just turn your body a little to "accept" what she's saying.

"I'm worried about it as it may put her on the defensive."

So what? She told you she wanted to go. You have to let the fear go. I think that's the biggest obstacle you have right now. What's coming out in your actions is fear. You are afraid to let her go. It's natural. Detachment will help you with this.

I think it's important in your C session to continue with this person for consistency and let it be about her. Let it be about her. Let it be about her. Got it?

[confusedinpa]

You are asking the same questions and both of you are reacting the same way. What you want to do is be the first one to break the cycle. You've started doing it with the changes, but now you're back to letting her emotions run how you feel.

Stuck808

Not quite sure what you mean here. What cycle? Somehow I see a 2x4 coming...

I think it's important in your C session to continue with this person for consistency and let it be about her. Let it be about her. Let it be about her. Got it?

I do want it to be about her. Last week she finally started first but went into victim mode gripping about my aunt's telling her that she was making a mistake

All the other times, she only talks when the counselor asks a specific question. Problem is I feel like I answer how I think things are going and then she responds with a very short answer.

Maybe I'll start with your suggestion: She started moving out this past week and leave it at that