Stress, WAW and life in general II

[Greek]

Update:


Ok. It was hard to not defend. Even now I'm struggling with it.

When we got home, W wanted to discuss R with me. <sigh> She was telling me that some days she wants to run over and put her arms around me while at other times she wants to leave the house and relationship. She made it a point to tell me that "if we're still together in the summer..." and stuff like that. I reminded her that I am madly in love with her and have been since the day we met. She told me that sometimes she isn't sure how to come back. I asked if I could help with that. She said no.

I sensed that she wants to come back, but isn't quite sure of that or if I want her to come back. Or if I do want her to come back, will things go back to the way they were. I can say an emphatic no to that last

Not defending = good. I'm sure that made a big impression on her. Good job.

And it is hard to 'come back' after stepping away in any capacity. I moved out and it was not the move back in that was difficult but the gamble ~~~ can we do things better this time? Will we do things better this time? And what will it take? Big decision. Tougher still b/c at this point in the R, she knows more about you (and you her) than on your wedding day. Much more to weigh before jumping all in...again. Be patient with each other.


You surely have come a long way, AJ.
Cheers ~

[AJM]

Thank you Greek. I appreciate those words of encouragement to stay the course.

It can be tough sometimes, but I'm finding that I really do like me. I am rediscovering me and her, and I like us both.

I do think that what you describe is really the largest part of what's going on right now. - In her mind, she's asking "Should I gamble and come back? Will he listen? Will it be different? If so, how much do I have to put into this? Do I have the ability to work on this? Can I be happy with him (again)? Have I hurt him too much? Has he hurt me too much? Have I changed too much? (she brings up the bit about she's changed a lot; she has but as I mentioned to her, she did change. She had to. But the wife I knew is still in there too.)"

I'm trying really hard to figure out how to build trust. It's harder than I thought it would be especially since she reduces our conversation time but mostly because I think I got my confidence shattered. I'm learning to regain that confidence and look beyond my own immediate needs to see what I can do for her. What is it she needs? I ask myself, "What is it that I'm doing to support her and be her friend and trusted ally? What am I doing to look beyond what I want and include what she wants and needs."

I don't know that I've really done that prior to now. I did some but not to my best ability; certainly not successfully. I did when I realized she was starting to heal from the crisis. But only for a little while and not consistently. I'm seeing that now. I'm seeing that I was wrapped into what I needed too much to see that she really is trying very hard but it comes across to me as weak and ineffectual when I want for me. Must be frustrating to her - It is to me

It's hard to fathom that I'm not as important as what she's doing. It's hard to fathom that she believed I had walked away. But it's how she feels and its necessary to regain that trust (let's face it, we need to regain trust every day, but this is a bit more pronounced.)

I don't yet know what she needs in our relationship and I think that's because she doesn't either. But I do know she needs to trust me if we're going to have a chance. I firmly believe she wants us to have a chance. That requires that I not be timid or reactionary to her mood swings. She told me about her mood swings - "I want to run up and grab you one minute and ten minutes later, I want to leave the house and the marriage" Almost like she can't help herself when she says those things. Like the fear is so deep that she has to say that to be pre-emptive in keeping her from being hurt by me or herself.

It saddens me to see her like this. I realize the crisis interrupted our natural rhythm of our marriage (we started to address the distance last summer - not enough soon enough). I do. I realize that her schedule makes it even harder to do ANYTHING let alone work on a relationship with her spouse or her family. I realize that. I also realize that I am the one that needs to put the effort into figuring out how we can trust each other again and that I am the one that has to lead from behind.

Not sure if she'll come back to the relationship, but I am sure that if I don't gain her trust again, we won't have a chance.

Suggestions are appreciated.

For now, I'm thinking that being consistent (check), kind (check), available (check), communicative (hold), and confident (hold) are the things to work on.

Communicative - I haven't been very becuase I've been holding my feelings back so they won't get trampled and because I've been too scared (?) to show her my feelings. I think it's time I become more communicative and damn the torpedos.

Confident - my confidence has been shot. Working on me has helped to rebuild but the more I see, the more I realize I need my confidence back more than ever. Survival of our marriage depends on it.

Patient - yes. Very much so. Getting better with each day.

Jealous of her time? I am, but much less than I had been. Scared of what that will do to us? Less and less as each day goes by.

And so I remain humbly yours,

AJ

[kassie]

In some ways I am hearing the same thing from my H - one day he wants to reconcile and the next day he is asking for a D. I think it is hard to consider what it would be like to reunite when you know everything you know now. Good to concretize what is different or will be different.

Keeping quiet and listening is excellent on your part as hard as it is. Communication - I am not the best on advice here - I think you need to take it slow in expressing feelings - I think I read that in the book - it tends to put pressure on the WAS.

Sorry the monster continues. Have you tried visualizing a good night's sleep and yoga is very helpful if you havent' tried it. The point is that you do your best with the contortions - it doesn't have to be perfect or even close.

Patient thoughts be with you. I'll try to follow but my posting may be limited - things are not going well for me.

[DrHemlock]

What was that book about people "going away" on 'vacations' in long term relationships?

[stillloveshim]

I always wonder what it is you do for a living. I'm not sure why, but you in particular, I wonder.

Obviously, I have no words of wisdom for you, I'm a freaking mess and it doesn't look bath time for me any time soon.

More and more lately I wonder what I'm fighting for and then I see him and I melt.

So what are you doing to be her friend and most trusted ally? I think I need to do the same thing.

I'm glad you are still fighting. If you give up, I'm not sure what I would do.
So, you can't give up AJ, that's what I'm saying.

[AJM]

DH - I'll get that title and post later. It's at the house.

My day job? I work in the computer industry as a systems engineer for a mortgage insurance company. I basically work with internal groups to help them solve business challenges with IT infrastructure - I don't write code as a general rule, but anything else is fair game.

Being a mess is part of this, isn't it? I hate it, but then again, what doesn't kill us makes us stronger I think.

My thought process lately has been around what I can do to build trust. See my previous post to see what my thoughts are around that.

Thanks for the encouragement. Even if you're a mess, I do appreciate you reaching out to encourage. I'd like to do the same for you - gain some perspective and don't lose sight of what you want in your life. Work on you. I'm going to do same on this end. We'll do it together.

AJ

[AJM]

Kassie, one of the things that I try to keep in mind is that back and forth is much better than just going away or apathy.

While painful and confusing, it is part of the journey I think. And it is what the WAS can do. If they could do more, they would I think. Either direction that is.

I think you're seeing their wrestling with themselves. You can't change that. You can't shorten that, but you can make it take longer I think.

I think that's part of what Greek was saying.

I plan to take this time to work on me. To also see what I can do to rebuild trust because I think she's worth it. I think our marriage is worth it. I want to make new memories with her. It's why I'm here trying to figure things out about me and about our relationship.

AJ

[Coach]

I plan to take this time to work on me.

That should be all of our goals all the time.

To also see what I can do to rebuild trust because I think she's worth it.

Great. Also do it because you are worth it.

From where I am sitting you look like you have grown. Not a easy task. Strength and Honor.
Cheers
Coach

[AJM]

Thanks Coach. I am worth it. My familie's worth it.

It's tough, but so's life.
I greatly appreciate the feedback, the pointers, and the encouragement. The encouragement to change is so hard to come by.

UPDATE:
This week's interesting. She's been like a caged animal. I think the fact that she hates the way she's acting is not helping her one bit. I've been giving her a wide berth and not letting her pick a fight. To her credit she's trying to reach out. She's trying to keep quiet, but I can see the stress and pressure.

I asked her the other night if she had a cup. She freaked out and sarcastically repeated "do I have a cup..." of what?!? Mean and lashing out. I smiled and said do you have a cup already for something to drink? Friendly. Not sarcastic. She mumbled something about how she'll take care of it.

Last night I asked one question. Same kind of response. This after she was fidgety all over the place. Jumped on the kids the last few nights. I told my daughter to just give her time.

She's under a lot of pressure. We handle pressure differently I guess but we're not that different.

I'm not offended at her actions any more. I'm not hurt by them any longer. I feel sorry for her when I look at her. I saw her this morning at 430 (darn dog) and wished her luck for the day. That was the extent of the conversation but you could see in her eyes I wasn't welcome in the space she was in. I'm not offended by that or hurt. I'm not even worried about my feelings which is new for me. I just noticed and kept on moving.

I still think about her often. Not as often, but a lot. Last night I was up late thinking about us. Didn't wake up in a panic though. If not for the dog, I would have slept to the alarm I think.

I feel sorry for her. I do. I don't cringe as much when she talks about how she might want to leave or "..if we go on separate vacations". That stung, but not for long. I think I've come to expect it or at least not be surprised by it.

Last night my daughter and I were in her confirmation class. We had a guest come by that got us to do chants and play drums and stuff. Very relaxing way to do things. Very spiritual. I really enjoyed that.

I guess I'm moving to a point where I'm concerned, but distant. Not sure yet if I'm doing that to protect me, but I don't think that's it. I am distant because I feel like she needs me to be distant. She needs the kids to be distant as well. They don't like that, but they bounce back fast I've noticed. And they have me for which I'm grateful.

I'm toying with thanking W for taking the stand of getting me to change my relationship with the kids. I'm not sure yet what message that would send. I am grateful though for the eye-opener.

Still looking for ways to build that trust. Still working on doing the little things. I peeled an orange for her last night. That's about it for now. Don't want to interfere or be blamed for her performance right now. That would be a bad idea on my part and I think that's what she's been asking for (she mentioned in MC that she only ever wanted to feel like I was taking care of the kids while she was at school. Self-centered, but honest - which I appreciate much more now that she's said it.)

<shrug> I'm close with the kids. I was always taking care of them. She may not have liked how, but I always was. Before I would think that's her mommy-guilt if she said I didn't do it how she would and therefore I'm wrong. I think differently now. I think she was communicating something she needed in a bad way. I'm not a puppet, so I didn't jump and she took that to mean I didn't care.

We both have things to work on. I like me and I'm tired of being depressed and having a lack of confidence.

Catch you later.

AJ

[Coach]

We both have things to work on. I like me and I'm tired of being depressed and having a lack of confidence.

Have you read "Learned Optimism" by Martin Seligman?