WAW - Very confused and devestated - pt 4

[JDOllie]

I can't help her do either of that. Now what?

Bam, you nailed. Now, go back to "whatever".

It isn't more complicated than that. You can't help her, you know it, not STOP!

Work on YOU! You don't need to tell her you're working on you, just DO IT.

Slap!

[spellfire]

Gotta be honest, it is starting to feel like "you can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink".

If she wants to walk away, let her figure it out.

If you don't react to her hurtful comments, you wont get drawn into R talks, then she wont go back down "I can't get past the hurt" lane.

[confusedinpa]

Thanks for the quick reply

I see the "surprise/deceit" I felt when I went upstairs to find that she moved into the spare bedroom really shook me up

I see the compassionate thing would have been to say "I see you are really hurting/struggling and need some space" and then just give it to her

Now the big question I have is do I appologize to her in the morning and say that to her in the morning?

Thanks for the 2x4's and for not giving up on me

[spellfire]

No don't apologize, you really did nothing wrong. Just show her you can let it go fast, bounce back, don't hold onto it. If she brings it up, listen and validate as you have been doing.

She read DR huh? Probably not for the best at this stage, but maybe some of it will sink in. Imperative she doesn't snoop and find your threads here. Never leave it up, and clear your browser cache each session!

[confusedinpa]

Work on YOU! You don't need to tell her you're working on you, just DO IT.

Slap!

Thanks for the "wake up" slap

I know I need to keep focusing on me, but it seems tough when I see her getting more disconnected

My DB coach said that action leads to emotion. I don't see how moving to the spare bedroom will lead to any positive emotion.

I'm not letting it get me down, it's just confusing me as to what's the right play. Right now I'm continuing with my 180 and showing her the husband/marriage that she could have, not what she had in the past.

I'm still working on me - I have a therapist appointment today, I packed my gym bag and reconnected with a couple of more friends via facebook. I also contacted one of my local "safe" friends to plan some time to chat.

I'm home this morning with my youngest as he is sick. My wife is suppose to be back at 11 so I can go to work.

Oddly, she seemed like she has been every other day - the move really hasn't changed her attitude. Perhaps it's a good thing that she moved to the spare bedroom.

We did talk this morning. I did wind up appologizing for not recognizing that she just needed space and I should have just gave it to her. I didn't appologize for anything that I said though. We did wind up hugging and she asked me to crack her back.

She also mentioned that she did ask her mom to find out what weekend that the kids could stay over her house so we could go out.

I must take this for its facevalue - she needed space, she's told me that before as she said that since my awakening she feels she hasn't gotten any time alone to think. Before when I used to go to bed 2-3 hours after she did, she would use that as alone/think time. Now that we are going to bed together, she doesn't feel like she has that.

Hopefully by having some space and time to think, she will be able to work through some of her issues. I know there's is nothing that I can do to help.

I will continue to work on me and create a "safe enviornment" for her (i.e. stray cat theory).

[confusedinpa]

She read DR huh? Probably not for the best at this stage, but maybe some of it will sink in. Imperative she doesn't snoop and find your threads here. Never leave it up, and clear your browser cache each session!

She had started to read DR - she got to about page 50. We talked about it a little this morning. She said she did read a couple of pages last nite but got too tired. She also said that she didn't say anything to me about sleeping in the spare bedroom as she was tired and didn't want to get into a big discussion about it. Not sure what she was thinking would happen when I got to bed. Clearly she wasn't thinking straight.

I suggested having her read the 5 Languages of Love book as I said she may think it's more interesting. I had told her when I read it that there were a number of stories there that reminded me of conversations that we had. I did that just to get her off my "playbook". I told her it was an easier read since she really hadn't been able to find much time to read.

Last nite, she said that alcohol gave her courage to try Thursday nite, but that Fri morning she still felt empty inside (I assume her heart). She feels we don't have any emotional connection and can't find a way to have a relationship with me because of the past/negative emotions. She also said that she doesn't think she could ever trust anybody again with her heart. Especially me since I broke/hurt it so badly.

I'm not angry with her respect to what's happening, I am sad. I'm sad that she's still hurting and angry about feeling unloved. I'm sad the woman I love says that she feels empty inside. I guess this is how compassion is suppose to feel. I just don't know what to do or how to handle it.

Right now I'm planning on sticking with my 180 that I've been on the last several weeks with the exception of:

1 - No physical/sexual touches unless she initiates

2 - No temperature taking

3 - Improving my ability to be compassionate as clearly she is hurting and feeling badly. This will be tough for me as I've really not done that in my life. Anothernightmare had give me a few good pointers but I am going to need a lot of help with this one.

My basic 180 will still be to maintain a postive, upbeat attitude that is now living to enjoy life, not just to get through it like I had in the past. I will be working on me. I will continue with her primary love languages (Quality Time and Verbal) and limit the touches to more casual, non-sexual touches.

I will not help her in the separation but will not stop her either. She is still under the illusion that we will remain friends after the divorce. I need to find a way to dispell that myth.

Anyone have any recomendations on books or things relative to compassion?

[AnotherNightmare]

1 - No physical/sexual touches unless she initiates

2 - No temperature taking

3 - Improving my ability to be compassionate as clearly she is hurting and feeling badly.

These are good, but superficial. You need to make yourself want to do this, which requires a change of attitude, a change of the way you feel, a change of your unconscious behavior.
As far as the last one is concerned, I would split that:

3a. Improving my ability to be compassionate towards her
3b. Improving my ability to be compassionate towards myself

3b is clearly even more important. Figure out how you feel first. Figure out your hurt first. And figure out how you can heal first. See my recommendation below.

Anyone have any recomendations on books or things relative to compassion?

Read "Love without hurt". It contains practical exercises how to change your unconscious behavior, how to make yourself feel better and become more compassionate. You can read more about it on the website: Compassion Power.

[confusedinpa]

She got home a little earlier than planned so I can get to work. I could see she was still hurting/troubled, but she was also on her cell phone on a conference call.

She muted it and I gave her a quick low down on how the morning went with our youngest. It was pretty much a business as usual type of conversation. I did give her a light kiss on the check, no hug but a light non sexual touch on her upper back, and wished her a good rest of the day.

We had been trading text messages all morning, she started by complaining about how long her trip to work took. Usuually she complains about her boss/work. I've wait about 10-30 minutes or so before I respond, but I have been trying to respond with light humorous responses.

For example, in her latest text after I got to work, she said:

"Ahhhh conclusions that this group comes to changes every meeting...so every two weeks...grrr"

I responded wtih:

"We could trade - you could attend XXX's meeting every week and I'll call into your confernce call : )"

XXX is someone I work with that she had met and we joke about how much of a typical engineer he is - like one of the guys out of the Big Bang sitcom - so you can imagine how much fun a 3 hour meeting can be .

My normal mode of operation is to try and cheer her up when she is venting, I guess a 180 for me would have been more compassionate or empathetic. Any thoughts on what would have been compassionate or empathetic?

I guess the other question that's on my mind, with her "moving" to the spare bedroom, is this a normal backslide in the divorce remedy process? I'm not keying my mood on it, but trying to gauge if I need to make a radical change in what I'm doing (i.e. go dark, last resort, etc..)

[JDOllie]

I would just keep up the whatever - it is impossible to try and discern the changes.

The saying goes: "Don't try to rationalize the irrational."

She could be moving out because she is opening up emotionally, and is scared - and a separate bed is just a way of limiting the influx of emotions.

Or she could be playing you - and cake-eating.

Back to the point you made to yourself - you can't help her, so help YOU. Continue to GAL, 180, DB, etc - stop looking for every tiny adjustment.

[MrBond]

"I could see she was still hurting/troubled, but she was also on her cell phone on a conference call."

You're still temperature taking. If she looked troubled it could have been about her job and not your sitch. Just stay away from that.

Who initiated the talk this morning about the DR book? If you did, then you need to stop. If she brings up a point or a question, then lightly engage and then back off. She's told you time and time again that she needs space and to figure things out on her own. You can LIGHTLY guide her, but that's it. SHOW her the positives and not keep bringing up that you're doing them. It gets easier over time. Trust me.

I wouldn't have even brought up the Love Languages book. Maybe just suggest that it was an interesting read and then that's it.

Right now she moved out of the room. That's what I had suggested to you earlier because it really screamed to me that she wanted her space. Right now you've given her all the power in the relationship and you're reacting to it all. Take that control back and just do your own thing.

Right now I definitely don't think she's "cake eating" because she's been very honest and upfront with you about everything and she hasn't been a B about it. Look at the other's who are posting, they'd kill to have their W just look their way much less open up the way your W has.

In terms of the compassion issue. To show compassion is to care and "understand" through their eyes. Right now in all your postings, you mention how you can't see this or how she can't see that. Stop for a moment and put yourself in her shoes. Then when she interacts with you, see things how she does. Right now your idea of validation is more like patronizing. True validation is really understanding what she is going through and responding accordingly. This means letting her express herself without judgement. Then if she asks for your opinion, don't say "you should" say things like, "well I would". This shows that you aren't trying to "fix" her, but just what you would do. It would be up to her if she does it or not. During the conversation, repeat what she says and maybe ask a short question or two about it not her. That way she sees that you are really listening to her.

It's going to be tough at first, but keep at it. It gets easier the more you do it. This establishes trust with her which seems to be a big hurdle right now.