Maybe I should be in piecing part 6?

[Hope4us]

More to your comments Mel.

I understand completely what you're saying. Same for my W.

1) I would assume same for her. She hasn't come right out and told me what those needs that weren't being met were, but in off hand comments, she has. I've been meeting those all I can.

2) I think you and my W are a lot alike.

3) Again, you hit my W right on the head here. We both work for the same company which led us to the same social circles. I've been climbing the corporate ladder, so when we'd be socializing, even with HER friends from work, the conversations always got around to me and MY career. I know that feel like her opinions didn't matter. She feels like her wants never were taken into consideration, mainly when it comes to money. When we first married, I asked her if she wanted to take care of the money and she said no, I should do it because she didn't want to deal with it. So I've spent our marriage juggling bills, taking us on nice vacations, putting our first son through college etc which required some sacrafices on some things she wanted (big house, new cars, etc). I tried to explain to her that we could have those things, but it would require changes in our lifestyle, and she always agreed, but I think she resented it. She grew up with a step dad that made A LOT OF MONEY, so she never had to worry about where the money was coming from for stuff. I think she resented the fact that she worked and felt like she didn't have what she perceived as any say in the money.

I think OM in our case was so attractive to her because he was pretty much single with no responsibility (he was/is married, but his wife and kids live 1000 miles away). And they didn't have to deal with kids, money, a dirty house, etc. And because he's the serial cheater he is, I'm sure he knew exactly how to listen and talk to W to get in her pants. And she fell for it.

Now we're left picking up the pieces.

Any way. Back to my sitch. I sent W an email this morning. I didn't get it approved here first But here's what it said

"I just wanted to explain some things so hopefully you can see where I'm coming from.

That "trigger" last night is nothing new for me. They happen. I can't predict when they will happen and I can't predict what will "trigger" them in me. Sometimes it's the most stupid things. Sometimes it's more obvious things. In the beginning they were almost constant. Now, not so much. Some are worse than others. Most times now they are short lived. Doesn't mean I don't care for you. Doesn't mean I'm trying to purposely hurt you. Far from it. It's just one of the things I have to deal with. I knew I'd have to deal with them very early on. And I made a choice to stay and deal with them and fight for our marriage.

Maybe you don't feel like this, but I feel like we've been making progress. And dealing with these types of things is just another step in the healing process. I knew it would be the toughest thing I've ever done. But I'm willing to go through it because I know we're worth it.

Talk to you soon.

me


Go a head and 2x4 me. But I felt like I had to say those things. If I didn't say those things, I'd probably explode, and that's not good.

I just IM'd her to see if she was ok with leaving a few minutes early for the wedding out of town tonight so we can take a little longer route and avoid the snow up around the lake. I got a "fine with me". I asked her how her day was going and got a "fine".

So I guess I won't be continuing THAT conversation.

Talk to ya soon.

[whatdidido]

No 2x4 from me. I think your email was good. You express yourself perfectly when you write to your W.

Remember what I said before about emailing ALL of your thoughts, though. It's one sided and you will always feel that way. She doesn't respond to your emails, she just hears them. It's a wall of hers. If she responds, she has to tell you her feelings. Opening up to you may be scary. She may say things that you may not like to hear, and you may then say you don't want to be with her anymore. She may say things you WANT to hear, but that causes her to be vunerable. Your wife does not like being vunerable. Walls.

[Hope4us]

Thanks WDID. I appreciate it. I always knew it would be hard to get her to open up to me after this. She's always struggled with being open with her feelings with me, even when she liked me

This calling her on her chit is kind of cool. We both took the afternoon off as we have to leave for the out of town wedding in about a half hour. I was home before her and when she came in the house shortly after me, I was surprised because she'd said she was going to run out and get a new pair of shoes after work. I asked her about shopping and she made some snide comment. I asked her about work and got another "fine" (and we all know what that means, right?).

So I called her on it. I asked "Is something bothering you?" She said no. I said, "have I done something to make you mad?" And she replied "no, why?" I said, "you've just been being really short with me today and I just wanted to know if you were ok or not". She said "I'm fine".

So shortly after, I went upstairs to shower. When I came downstairs she was taking a nap but when she woke up, she was totally different. Talking to me in a nice way. Asking me questions, etc.

I ran to get a wedding card and stopped to pick up a latte for us on the way back. I took it up to the bathroom and she said in the sweetest voice, "thank you".

So, I think I learned a valuable lesson. 1) Call her on it when she's treating me like chit. 2) She's really struggling, dealing with all this and this is her gig to deal with, not mine. I'm here to help her through it any way I can, but she's going to have to figure this out on her own.

We're off to the wedding in a few. I'll check in later tomorrow.

[whatdidido]

YOU GOT IT!!!!!! Have a great weekend, hope.

[Puppy Dog Tails]

That's HUGE, dude.

[Mellenmack]

I just wanted to put this last .02 cents in. I know you won't get it til tomorrow and that's fine.

It's not about the money. It's not about the new car. It was never about the vacations or the college education.

It was about me having a say in what town we lived in and where we pcs'ed (moved) to.
It was about me having a say about whether or not we lived on base.
It was about me having a say or a voice in drinking problem that was spiraling out of control.
It was about me feeling like I mattered.
It was never about material things. I could really give a cr@p less. Those were his wants - the material stuff.

I just wanted to be loved, to be come home to, to be wanted to have children with. He didn't want to be married. He wanted to stay single and never have to worry about a single person other than himself. He wasn't mean about it, he was just indifferent. And THAT is what killed me inside. OM wanted a life with me. He'd have figured out a way to have more kids. He didn't drink. He thought I hung the moon. He made time for me. He needed me. And I wanted those things from my H. None of it was money. No new cars. Just time and effort.

So there you go.

Hope you enjoyed your day/evening.

Melissa

[Hope4us]

I don't know Mel, reading your latest response, it seems like you think I was commenting about your sitch, or accusing you of some things. If that's the case, you misunderstood. I was talking about my W. If you just needed to vent, no problem, vent away.

I'm not sure how I feel about Friday night. We left to go to the wedding, and the drive over was pretty quiet. W talked some, but it was pretty quiet. We got there, checked in to the hotel, then went to the reception.

Sat at a table with a group of people I/we used to work with before we moved over here. Had a good time. W was very talkative with everyone, which was good. She even gave a big hug to C, a friend of our who knows about W's A. No, I didn't tell everyone, but here is how C found out. C and her H both took Karate lessons where S20 did. I worked with C. Through work and karate, we became friends. Worked on a couple projects with her. They got married and bought their first house, which was a nice small house, but it needed a lot of work and her H has no skills in fixing up houses. At work one day, C was telling me how their bathroom was a disaster, but they couldn't afford to hire someone to fix it up so I told her I'd do it for them. Spent about a week fixing it up and that made us closer friends.

So one time about a year ago, I was in the home office for some meetings and I stopped by to talk to C. I asked how her kids were doing....great....I asked how her H was and she said, "well, I guess I should tell you, we're separated". I asked what happened and she said he'd had an A while she was pregnant with their first D and she forgave him and then he had another one shortly after their second D was born. She then said she didn't want to talk about it, but how was my W? I just looked at her and it came out, "I know what you're going through". And she said "W???" and I said yes.

And W knows she knows. So when C came up to us at the wedding and W jumped up out of the chair and gave her a big hug and told her she looked good and they had a nice conversation, I thought it was big.

We left the wedding and went to see our friends who just built the house. I know W was nervous. She had about 5 glasses of wine at the reception, and didn't eat anything, and with her only weighing about 110 lbs, she was pretty drunk. But we went to our friends house and had a really nice evening. W had a couple more glasses of wine. Oh boy. We stayed a while, talking, laughing, etc. Our friends are planning on coming to our house sometime soon and the W's are going to go shopping in Amish country.

All good right? Well, not so much. W made some comments to me and did a couple things throughout the night that really had an affect on me. I didn't call her on them because she was drunk and never would have remembered anyway, but there were a couple of things that just made me really wonder why I'm even trying.

Stupid things. Things I'm sure she used to justify the A in her head. And it hit me hard.

So then on Sat morning, I get up, take a shower, oh yeah, she slept on the couch in the hotel room, and went down to get some breakfast. I sat there for a while and then made up a plate and took it back to our room for W. Eggs, sausage, toast and coffee. Does she thank me? No, makes a comment because I didn't put hot sauce on her eggs. I know she was trying to be funny, but WTF?

Lets just say the ride home was quiet. She tried to talk to me some and I was polite, but I just couldn't bring myself to be my happy self and act "as if". Couldn't do it.

Funny thing is, some of the comments she made and the things we talked about with our friends convinces me even more that she's planning on staying and is getting better and feeling closer to me, but that just makes me ready to say F it even more. Everything is great for her, but what about me? When do I get ANYTHING I NEED?

Ok, I've rambled enough. We'll see what today holds.

Talk to you soon.

[Mellenmack]

H4U,

I'm sorry. Wasn't trying to come across that way. I get that your W wants a new car. I don't know if she wants the new car so much, as to have her opinion matter about the new car!

I'm sorry the weekend wasn't as great as you expected. But I'm glad that she feels like staying. But yeah, sooner or later, you gotta start feeling better, too.

melissa

[Hope4us]

Thanks Mel.

Yes, everything indicates to me that she wants to stay, but why do I feel like leaving?

I don't know, maybe everyone goes through this, that just when it seems their spouse may be figuring everything out, that we start to examine just what that means. And the more I think about it, the more I realize I NEED more from her. More than I've got from her our whole marriage. Wow, kind of sounds foggy huh?

Rest assured, it's not. It's a realistic examination of our marriage. And it's true. Maybe early on she was giving me what I needed, but in the last number of years, not so much. And I'm just not sure I can see her ever filling me up the way I need.

Another perfect example. Last night, S16 is going to his YMCA basketball game. He calls me about 20 minutes after he leaves and says he has a flat tire. I put some clothes on and head out the door saying to W "I'll be home in a little bit". NOTHING. So I'm walking out and I say "ok, see ya", kind of like having both sides of a conversation with myself. THEN she replies.

So I go to change the tire (about a 20 minute drive), can't get the thing off so I have to call AAA, sit there for probably an hour waiting on them, get it changed, stop by a store to pick up W the apples and carrots she takes in for lunches (we didn't have a chance to get to the store this weekend) and head home.

I get there, doesn't ask me about the car. Doesn't say thanks for picking up the apples/carrots, basically doesn't acknowledge my doing anything.

Now I'm not looking for a medal. But a simple acknowledgement that I made the effort to pick up stuff for HER lunches, after being outside in the cold and snow for an hour and a half taking care of our car, would have been nice. But she's so self absorbed, that she can only think about how everything affects HER. And I'm not OK with living this way anymore.

I'm tired of feeling like I'm the one that had the affair. I'm tired of throwing myself on the sword taking ALL the blame for everything that's happened. Being alone for the rest of my life would be better than living like this. Guess I see where WAS's get to when they decide to walk away.

Don't worry, I'm not going to do anything drastic yet. But just how I've been feeling the last few days. I'm just tired of the crumbs....

[Mellenmack]

H4U,
I think to an extent, you are kind of like my H. I think he is to the point of feeling like I am not doing anything for him. It's a little different though. And he didn't feel that way until he found out about the As. He has rewritten our history. He has no objectivity anymore.

Did you read that part of DB, or was it somewhere else, where those people had a chart? Maybe you could keep on in a diary for yourself. You make a checkmark or write down the time every time she does say thank you or she does do something appreciative towards you. Then you get a realistic view of the things she really has or really hasn't done. Even in the course of a day, people forget. If she could see it, too, it might help either remind her to say thank you/please or it might show her how much you are appreciative compared to her. There could be bennies but there could be negatives, too. Not sure. If you do it, I would be interested to know the fallout.

I hear you being tired of the crumbs. I have been willing to take whatever crumbs and I'm tired, honestly. I never believed he loved me enough...the whole time we were married. And him refusing to even work on the marriage just shows I was right. He didn't love me enough. We'll see. I read somewhere...about it being funny how we love our kids no matter what they do to us...we tell them or show them how they are wrong, but even if they make the mistake we love them anyway...why don't we treat our spouses like that?

It is added to my list of things to do differently next time if there is a next time. Honestly, I am paranoid to even think about a next time. I am paranoid to ever have to go through this again, from the other side. Being left. Abandoned. It makes me want to puke.

Hey...you said you were tired of crumbs, so you got puke!!

No complaining!! At least it's something DIFFERENT. lol...

Take care.

Melissa