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4kids,

Thank you for posting. What you said to me nourished my spirit. Thank you.

Tom


Letting Go Tom; JUST DO IT!
previously hopeful_husband

my A: Fall 05
W found out: Feb 06; separated immediately
W pursued D, final 7/11/07

me: 43
XW: 34
D8
S3
joint legal/physical custody
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 212
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JOURNALING:

Having trouble sleeping. Moving on Sunday. Good and bad. Good, in that I have a place to go locally. Bad, in that I have allowed myself to sink this low. My new full-time job, once moved, is taking care of me; developing and demonstrating new productive habits daily in order to get back on my feet financially and emotionally.

2009 is going to be a great year; vastly different than the past 10 years. Why? Because I have the capacity to live my life differently and better and I am making the conscious decision to do so. I deserve better and I am going after better. I demand better of myself and I will be the most demanding 'boss' I have ever had. Yesterday was yesterday. I can't change yesterday. Sunday evening starts my new life with the new me.


Letting Go Tom; JUST DO IT!
previously hopeful_husband

my A: Fall 05
W found out: Feb 06; separated immediately
W pursued D, final 7/11/07

me: 43
XW: 34
D8
S3
joint legal/physical custody
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 212
S
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OP Offline
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Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 212
JOURNALING:

Today, around 12:30 my phone rings and it's XW:

XW: Hi, where are you?
Me: Packing.
XW: Yes, where are you right now?
Me: Packing, so that must mean...never mind, the short answer to your question is I'm home. What's going on? (I know she wants a favor.)
XW: Well, can I bring the kids by for a little while?
Me: Well, I'm packing and I can't really keep them out of the mess too...what's going on? What happened?
XW: I .... She goes into a long explanation about work needs yadayadayadayada....
Me: Since I got the gist in the first two seconds, and didn't really want/need her long explanation, so I cut in and said, "Bring my kids to me. I'll make it work."

The long and the short of this is that although their presence is somewhat of an inconvenience to me packing to move, I'm happy to spend this time with them. I'll make it work and get everything done. I always do. That's my 'CAN DO!' attitude resurfacing. I love it. I am going to dig myself out of the whole I've dug for myself and move forward to make my life better for myself and my children.

When XW dropped off my children, I was pleasant and focused on my children. In reality, I'm grateful that I'm the first one she called when she ran into a scheduling difficulty between her time with our children and her work. Of course, as long as I can possibly accommodate the change in my schedule I will and I'm almost always able to swing it. So gratitude is the new word in my life for the seemingly 'inconvenient' surprises that turn out to be blessings, especially when it comes to me taking care of my responsibilities with my children and my XW's willingness to call me first, as I have always requested. Gettin' out of my own head and into the reality of my sitch and marching steadily in the direction of disengaging and detaching, and getting closer to my desired destination of 'Letting Go.'


Letting Go Tom; JUST DO IT!
previously hopeful_husband

my A: Fall 05
W found out: Feb 06; separated immediately
W pursued D, final 7/11/07

me: 43
XW: 34
D8
S3
joint legal/physical custody
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 212
S
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OP Offline
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Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 212
JOURNALING:

XW just called to tell me she is on the way to pick up our children and I told her that I really appreciated her calling me as her first option to be with our children when she had a scheduling challenge. She said, "Of course."

I then apologized for even considering her an option to bail me out of my self-inflicted jam. She said I didn't need to apologize, but I said yes, I do and I mean it. I told her I was so disappointed in myself for failing to do the right things to get myself out of my jam; for not doing what is necessary to care for my children properly and for impacting her my failure up 'til now. I told her that I've been wallowing in my own 'stuff' and I am mostly ashamed that I have pissed away my time and wasted my God-given talents and abilities during the past 1-1/2 years. She thanked me for telling her what I did and for the first time ever in my sitch I am focused on me and NOT my XW.

I feel a renewed energy and focus to help myself and to get back on track being a man of God who was born to lead both myself and those around me, including my beautiful and perfect children. My recent troubles are a huge obstacle for me to overcome, but overcome them I will. I will do what I know I am capable of, which is to initiate all of the actions necessary to right my path and my situation.


Letting Go Tom; JUST DO IT!
previously hopeful_husband

my A: Fall 05
W found out: Feb 06; separated immediately
W pursued D, final 7/11/07

me: 43
XW: 34
D8
S3
joint legal/physical custody
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 212
S
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OP Offline
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Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 212
JOURNALING:

Went to dinner with XW and our children for Valentine's Day at the request of XW. While at dinner, XW hands her cell phone to D8 and D8 starts texting with the D13 (Brit, sexually active child with a single father who neglects her) of XW's ex-DH#4. I ask XW,

Me: What D8 is doing?
XW: She's probably texting.
Me: Is this something you allow at the dinner table? Texting with whom?
XW: Brit.
Me: I have concerns about D8 having unmonitored time or conversations with Brit. I've told you that. (D8 still has the phone and is continuing to text.)
XW: I keep a very close eye on our children. I haven't even been in contact with Brit in 3 weeks. (Of course, I don't know this to be true, but I find it strange that D8 is regularly texting Brit using XW's phone when I am present.) You don't even have a right to say anything with how things have been going.
Me: (Knowing my 2 children are across the table.) I think you need to spend some time thinking about what you just said to me. Then I was quiet and finished my dinner.
XW: Asking D8, does Brit say anything inappropriate or things she's not supposed to?
D8: No
Me: I'm still quiet, wondering what would possess XW to ask an 8-year old if her idolized 13-year old friend says anything inappropriate or wrong when they talk or text. I know D8 worships Brit and would never sell her out. In addition to that, whatever Brit says D8 thinks is 'cool.' Not gonna get a straight answer out of an 8-year old, that much I know. D8 doesn't want to lose access to her older buddy.

XW went on about her business being pissed off about me expressing my concern about D8's unfettered access to Brit, which in my mind is not conducive to our behaving like loving, concerned parents. XW believes that I should defer to her judgment about people and who she brings around our children after her parade of DH's and other 'good friends' who I knew from the get go were not good people and that has all been borne out. But again, I didn't say that XW couldn't continue on in the relationship of this 13 year old misguided little girl, I simply told her I had a concern about D8 being left alone with Brit and didn't want them having unmonitored conversations.

Throughout our entire separation, D, and aftermath, including XW moving DH#3, the real-life little criminal with whom she made TWO domestic violence calls to the Sheriff, I never once told her that she didn't have a right to tell me anything. If I sound a little bent, I am. XW has the gall to text me the following: I'm done trying with you." I simply responded with an, "OK" text. Thank you, frank_D. A bit later, I left her a VM asking her to call me back. She probably won't, because she believes she is right, and the two glasses of wine she had at dinner plus her back ache won't do anything to dissuade her from that opinion.

I do know that I will get a call this weekend for her to apologize. As of this moment, I am not of the mind to accept her apology because it won't be to set thing right and show remorse for her behavior towards me in front of our children, plus telling me that I don't have a right to express my concern for our D8. This has generally been a rinse and repeat cycle for her and I am tired of alternating between being the whipping post and the leaning post. I want to be kind, and I don't want to punish her, but my hope is that she will see that reacting the way she does is counterproductive and hurtful. I know, wish on....

Well, we'll see. But I know I am right that I will receive a phone call apology. I am looking for direction on how to respond to it. Bring up what was said to me? Not? I simply need to enforce my boundaries for acceptable behavior towards me when we're alone and when we're in the presence of our children. I know it's not a lesson for me to teach her, but enforcing my boundaries will certainly send a message that XW cannot ignore.


Letting Go Tom; JUST DO IT!
previously hopeful_husband

my A: Fall 05
W found out: Feb 06; separated immediately
W pursued D, final 7/11/07

me: 43
XW: 34
D8
S3
joint legal/physical custody
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 212
S
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OP Offline
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Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 212
JOURNALING:

I knew it was a mistake to leave a VM tonight. XW is still pissed off and thinking that I was calling her a bad parent because I expressed concern about our D8 having private conversations with Brit. I can't wait 'til my D8 becomes sexually active and exposes herself to STDs and/or pregnancy. It's beyond me how XW believes that she has all of this under control and I'm just blind and/or ignorant of her 'reality'.XW continues on swearing at me on the phone and calling me by name within earshot of our children. Well, I don't control her and I know that I will hear from her at some point tomorrow to apologize after she has time to stew in her juices and think rationally. I am done though, trying to reason with her. I cant' be rational with someone who isn't rational often enough. She spends a great deal of time defending indefensible positions in an indignant way. THAT I cannot help and I will not take it on. I understand that I am having a rough go of it lately, but my present state is not a permanent state. Sadly for my 'old' XW, hers is. As my friend Miguel told me in his thick Spanish accent, "Be like a turtle. Pull your head and your legs inside your chell and let the chit bounce right off of ju." So, that's what I'm gonna do, let the chit bounce right off of me.

BTW, I'm not mad. I'm just sad. I needed to vent and this is my appropriate place to vent.

One last edit: I asked XW if I heard her properly that I have NO right to express concern about our children. Her response, expletives deleted, was that I had no idea about what I was talking about and I should think about that before I call her back again. Well, I have thought about it and I am not the one who has introduced our D8 to the sexually active 13-year old D of my ex-GF and I wouldn't let them have unmonitored time and/or conversations together out of shear concern, fear and my responsibility to provide guidance for my child between good choices and bad choices. Blind trust leads errant children to be errant teenagers and messed up adults. I understand that children don't grow up and tell their parents, "Mom, Dad, I wish you had been less of a parent and more of a friend." Nope, the tell them the opposite if the parent tries to befriend their child instead of parent and guide. Enough said. I've vented enough.

Last edited by still hopeful; 02/15/09 04:54 AM.

Letting Go Tom; JUST DO IT!
previously hopeful_husband

my A: Fall 05
W found out: Feb 06; separated immediately
W pursued D, final 7/11/07

me: 43
XW: 34
D8
S3
joint legal/physical custody
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 328
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Tom, I am so worried about you...

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JOURNALING:

Flicka,

Thank you for your concern. I am doing OK, it's just that the darkness seems to keep getting darker. Since I last posted, I moved from my place, received the disappointing report from my accident, am still unemployed, and on and on and on..., but I believe I do see the bottom of my free fall, which is a good thing. I'm weary from the downs in my life. Some ups would be welcome.

On the plus side, I am healthy, my children are beautiful and perfect and I am still as messed up emotionally as I have ever been where it comes to my XW. I keep working on myself in that vein, but don't seem to be making much progress.

A while back, I spoke with frank_D, and he illuminated a FACT for me that is probably quite obvious to anyone who has been following the twists and turns of my sitch. That FACT is that my reason for not emotionally divorced my XW is very simple: I don't WANT to. What he said hit me like a ton of bricks in its truth, simplicity and clarity. I am now realizing that what I WANT is much more powerful than what I think I NEED with regard to my XW. frank_D also told me ages ago that no one on this board knows me and/or all of the nuances of my sitch, and I have to do what I believe is best after considering what everyone else says, plus what I know and feel, because I am the only person who will reap what I sow.

With all of that rambling said, I am still in my sitch because I WANT to be. I believe that I have had the power all along to end my sitch long ago. I don't know what would have happened had I DBed more strictly along the way, but I do know that I still have a 'sitch' today and that is because I am still playing the hand that I dealt myself and the hand that has been subsequently dealt to me. Life is interesting in that we are not allowed to play the two hands simuultaneously and choose the path that provides the best outome for all. But that's not reality...just wishful thinking from a man looking up from the depths to which he's allowed himself to fall.

I'm holding it somewhat together, Flicka. In my journey, I have discovered that I am a good man. I remain am own biggest critic and obstacle, so I know that I must continue working on staying in the moment and making decisions in ALL aspects of my life that will produce better results. I've also seen that I am not in danger of my familty deserting me, even though they don't understand my decisions in my sitch and my feelings for my XW.

BE HERE NOW! My new mantra. I am making it my right now mantra and one that I am utilizing to change the incessant rain that my behaviors/decsions have brought forth for me.

Thanks Flicka, I'm still here. Working to keep on keepin' on in a different and more productive way in both my life and my sitch. I aplolgize that my behavior has worried you.


Last edited by still hopeful; 02/21/09 05:09 PM.

Letting Go Tom; JUST DO IT!
previously hopeful_husband

my A: Fall 05
W found out: Feb 06; separated immediately
W pursued D, final 7/11/07

me: 43
XW: 34
D8
S3
joint legal/physical custody
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 328
F
Member
Offline
Member
F
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 328
Well, you have been through some traumatic events and they have taken a toll. I trust you to regroup. I know you are a very good man and I know you will keep your plan for making the right and positive choices as they appear. You will even create good options!

Things have to get better. Just keep the faith. We will take turns. It seems possible that your W will may find herself 'growing up' while you get yourself reorganized. She has depended on YOU for sooo much.

Love to you...

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Hello Flicka,

I will just keep the faith. Thank you for believing in me. I am a good man. I will continue making better choices. I know that as I move forward, I will create more good choices for myself as well. That's all I can do at this point in my sitch, and in my life. Thank you. I feel your presence in my life all the way in Sacramento.

I read a quote from French pharmacist, Emile Coue, who around 1920 astonished the world with his work on what blocks people from utilizing our innermost powers. Coue coined the "Law of Reversed Effort": 'When the will and the imagination are in conflict, the imagination invariably wins the day.' I believe here is where I find my will to move away from my XW emotionally being overpowered by my imagination of the possibilities of reconciliation that still have not been completely extinguished. My imagination keeps me in the reconciliation 'game'.

I have been staying with XW this week to care for our children. It's been easier for me logistically without my car. I was talking with my best friend, Wil, and told him the XW 'was kind enough to allow me to stay with her this week. Wil stopped me immediately and said, "Whoa, whoa, whoa, wo, wo. She let you stay with her because it worked for her; made HER life easier." Perhaps Wil is right. Perhaps I simply want to see XW in the best possible light at all times.

I do know this, God gifted me with an amazing capacity to do great things in my life, but when it comes to dealing powerfully with my XW, I'm the neighbor down the street with a garage full of brand new, shiny tools in a brand new tool box; stickers and price tags still affixed. I've read all of the books and can talk a good game, but I haven't 'owned' by 'knowledge' by putting it all to use are fully realizing how incredibly easy it all really is with both the correct knowledge and practical application of what I've been gifted with and/or obtained through my own efforts. I am working toward being the other neighbor, the one with the time-honored, functional tools that do the job well, are a bit worn from use, and a bit tattered from age. I am working towards following in the steps of Thomas Edison, in his efforts to invent the incandescent light bulb. He made over 10,000 attempts to fashion a working example, but he kept at it, knowing the answer is near; dogged determination and tenacity put to the highest use and effect. It's his determination and tenacity that I aspire to achieve in my efforts to reconcile with my XW. I know the answer is near. I'm staying in the 'game' until my Lord tells me doing so is NOT His will.

This week has made me feel closer to XW. During our separation/divorce/aftermath (S/D/A), I've grown as a man, as an adult. I'm becoming more accpeting of myself as being perfectly human or imperfect. And in growing and learning to accept myself, flaws and all, I'm become moring accepting of others, especially XW, flaws and all. It's strangely liberating...freeing, even.

Last night was an interesting high (low, perhaps?) between XW and I. I talked to her about my inability to emotionally divorce myself from her despite the fact that we ARE divorced, and despite the fact that most of my friends urge me to do so and move on. I explained that my unwillingness to emotionally divorce myself from her has been because I havent' wanted to do so...simple as that. XW looks at me and says she gets the same 'advice' from her friends about the two of us being so 'entwined' and that she's told repeatedly that it's not normal for a divorced couple; it's like we're still married. She also said that if I had divorced her emotionally, she would be crushed. I don't know how to interpret that, so I guess I won't. That moment passed without my pursuing it further. I do know and see that she loves me, but she is still incredibly hurt and afraid of giving herself to me completely because we failed last time. I told her that speaking with her GF Sasha the other night was mind blowing for me because that was the first time that I had ever had another person explain to me what she saw in XW and my relationship/marriage and have it be spot on with how I felt and saw everything. Hope still exists for us to reconcile. Both of us have found glimpses of happiness apart, but those glimpses only make the longing for what we gave up that much more poignant.

This week with XW, she has been uncharacteristically attentive towards me and appreciative of me. I have kept my guard up to NOT take the alluringly attracive bait that her attention is for me because of the aftermath of the previous two times we wound up being intimate and I ended up being blamed. Well, I'm not even sure how it all started, but last night XW says to me, "If I wanted to have s*x with me, you would be all over that."
ME: No, that's not want. Having s*x has never been a challenge for me. You made it clear to me that last time, that THAT's not what you wanted with me.
XS: Well, I'm not drunk and I'll remember everything.
ME: That's not enough. S*x is a small part of you. I'm selfish. I've always wanted everything.
XW: I was married to you.
ME: I know. I was there. I never felt that I had ALL of you. I don't want our old R back. THAT is a recipe for disaster.
XW: I've grown to know who I am and I really like me.
ME: Good. I've grown a great deal in the time we've been apart and that has led me to understand how much growing I still need to do. I've grown so much more incredibly comfortable with WHO I am; more accepting; more forgiving of myself.
XW: So, do you like yourself now?
ME: I do.

I'm comfortable with how far I've come and that I'll always be a work in progress, but God has gifted me with an incredible amount of raw material to mold into a beautiful work of art that is me.
Passionate kissing and scintillating touching occured throughout this exchange. I got what I wanted all along, despite what I said. I undressed her. She then undressed me and give herself to me physically. I wanted to share myself with her, so I did. I woke up this morning, just wanting to sit looking at her. The bond I feel with her and for her is undeniable, despite all that 'stuff' that has passed under the bridge. I'm clear that I as I've become more accepting of myself, I'm more accepting of her. As I've become more certain of who I am, I've become more certain of who she is. I'm becoming clear that the part of her that I was inexorably drawn to and fell in love with, is the part I was wanting to change in her, was wanting her to change.
I am clear that I love her. I am also clear that I have forgiven her for what she's done. Although the behavior is wrong, she can be forgiven. I know some of my behavior has been wrong. I know I have been forgiven by the One who matters. I know she will forgive me soon.

I have several strong men in my life who are working on me separately, to urge me to USE the tools of the manhood trade to become a skilled craftsman through practical experience to realize my potential in my sitch and in life. I don't want to fail because I didn't realize my potential because of my baseless fears. As I've said in the past, my sitch is a tough nut to crack. The fact that I'm involved in it makes it that much more trying. The one thing about my sitch that I do believe is that I've always had the power to determine the fate of my sitch, and that would have been to end it all ages ago. I am happy that the path that I have chosen has kept us both on the same 'playing field' playing the same reconciliation 'game.' I believe more now than ever that we both want us to work out, but both of us are extremely scared of failing again and taking ten steps backwards. Neither of us wants that for ourself, for the other, and for our children.


Letting Go Tom; JUST DO IT!
previously hopeful_husband

my A: Fall 05
W found out: Feb 06; separated immediately
W pursued D, final 7/11/07

me: 43
XW: 34
D8
S3
joint legal/physical custody
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