...don't talk to her about how much you appreciated the sex.
This is a very bad habit of mine I simply must break. I do thank her many times. From now on it's just, "Wow that felt wonderful honey."
S&A the more I read NMMNG the more I realize that I must break those "Nice" patterns that I have stuck myself in. I know W likes the strong me much better. She's been waiting years for me to man-up. What took me so long to see this in myself?
It just took a few months after reading what you were saying for it to finally soak in. That and just admit to myself that I really am my own worst enemy and that it has been me holding myself back.
S&A Thanks for returning to the board in the nick of time and giving me that final kick in the pants to wake me up. Ouch! I needed that.
Its great to hear the change in your mood. In future - when things get difficult again as they often do (that's life) - back away and remember the last couple of days and what made the difference i.e. you changed your mindset. > your mood > your actions > her reactions: these all changed as well. Just remember - your mind is the engine of your whole life - your thoughts are its fuel, and your willpower the ignition key (or something like it anyway). So don't clog up your engine with crappy fuel.
That doesn't mean you can by the power of thought alone "change" your wife into a sexual diva, but as DQ says, the vibe you bring to the marriage is a great incentive for her to really get in touch with herself.
Plus, the manning-up thing is primarily for you. You might want to see how your new approach with your wife helps you in other areas of your life.
S&A
"A man can be destroyed but not defeated" - from The Old Man and the Sea, by Ernest Hemingway.
Which I take to mean that every man has within him a spirit of relentlessness and optimism. Its already there; he just has to cultivate it.
Reading your post makes me realize how so many of the problems in my own M have been my fault. As I withdrew from her she lost her trust in me and the "energy" in our M was gone.
As our resentment for each other grew it made it impossible for us to be close again. I'm working very hard to get past my resentment but I don't know what to do to help W get past hers. The damage was done to both of us.
I feel about my W as you feel about your H. Only half of the damaged M is actively working to find a way back together. If only the other half would make a tiny bit of effort to meet us it could be done, we could get there so easily.
For now her resentment remains and I have to just ignore it somehow as I work on myself.
Reading your post makes me realize how so many of the problems in my own M have been my fault. As I withdrew from her she lost her trust in me and the "energy" in our M was gone.
As our resentment for each other grew it made it impossible for us to be close again. I'm working very hard to get past my resentment but I don't know what to do to help W get past hers. The damage was done to both of us.
I feel about my W as you feel about your H. Only half of the damaged M is actively working to find a way back together. If only the other half would make a tiny bit of effort to meet us it could be done, we could get there so easily.
For now her resentment remains and I have to just ignore it somehow as I work on myself.
Cinco
I am so glad my random thoughts give you insight!~!~
Take heart... yes it is hard to avoid her resentment. But don't try to avoid it or change it or anything. WORK ON YOU~
I FIND THE MORE I WORK ON ME? The more energy I have and the more I am able to get thru moments that are less than delicious.
I am so sure you are ready and you are going to really do this. I know it in my heart.
IT is not selfish please keep this in mind. It is the greatest gift you can give to yourself and actually to her by default.
When I find the passage again I will post it for you. But it goes something like when you genuinely transform yourself and do work on you they cannot help but change. It is impossible.
But it has to be genuine Cinco~ it has to be for you and only you. No more worrying boaut how you caused her to shut down. K? It is over and done with ... she is with you and you need to move forward and rejoice in that. Keep reading NMMNG~ I challenge you to every time you think a negative thought tomorrow? Turn it around.
For example... 1} She is feeling sad cause of me.. I created her sadness I am not doing enough for her \or whatever negative thought you have
~TO*~
I am feeling sad cause of me... b/c I have not forgiven myself for the past b/c I am still living in the past b/c I have not loved myself enough
and ~*NOW*~
what can I do change that?
Realize she just is feeling down. Not try to "fix" it.
2} She doesnt want me to give her a hug...
~*TO*~
I dont want to give her a hug b/c .... she doesnt want me to she has better things to do with her time she will just push me away.
Then? you give her a hug w/o attaching it to any outcome. Just b/c you wanted to. She will feel the difference. See... and it is about you... not her.
I hope I made any sense at all. Please try it //// it will lighten things up tremendously.
And when you are done reading NMMNG? If you would read? Loving what is........ Byron Katie I think it would change your life. {{{ whenever you are ready}}}}. I know your spirit will know when.
Take care love... all my best to you and the MRS.... God bless.. Ali
{{{ Lets both ignore their resentment and as ours melts away let keep each other posted to the Miracle that awaits.. my H in a few short weeks of me only focusing on me? Is becoming more gentle. Not *perfect* but more gentle and love able. }}}}}
I do not have the internet at home anymore,, but I will keep checking on you. I am rooting for you... there is no place to go but UP!~!~
I'm in a funk like Lucky. A SL is NOT something to be saved just for special occasions, it should be always there. Nothing since my birthday and nothing will happen for Valentines day (not entirely her fault but I know it's a no-go for Saturday. Just too much happening that day).
I guess I should be grateful we've broken out of the old two-times-a-year mold. My b-day and our wedding anniversary were the only two days "special enough" to warrant obligatory sex. Even that wasn't guaranteed nor all that special sometimes.
Even after having the, "If everything that I desire is right here with you W, why would I ever want to leave?" conversation... It still isn't sinking in with her. We fix this now or I'm through. No wonder she doesn't trust that I won't leave... because I'm about to.
By being a wimp and putting up with this for so long, I have created a M where only the bare minimum requirements of sex ever happens between us. Stupid "Nice Guys" stay because it seems to be the right thing to do. A "normal guy" would have left as soon as it was apparent that his needs were no longer being met in the R with no changes in sight. For us that would have been 18 years ago when I was 30, I could have easily started my life over then.
I know I'm supposed to feel strong enough in myself to not need sex. When we go for more than about 10 days between times it just plain messes with my head. I can't change who I really am, I won't hide my sexuality any longer. I can't change her, she has to decide for herself.
I wish I had hope for us finding a meeting point that we both could live with. Right now I don't see it. I know everyone here has seen my pattern: I'm happy as a lark when we are sexual. I'm sad when I'm left wondering when the next time we ML will be.
I keep fooling myself into thinking we've truly made a breakthrough. All I have done is stir things up only to have them settle back to where they've been for too many years.
The only "real changes" are happening within myself in facing my reality that I can't stay in a M like this. I do keep hoping for a miracle change in her and that what keeps me here for now.
I'm in a funk like Lucky. A SL is NOT something to be saved just for special occasions, it should be always there. Nothing since my birthday and nothing will happen for Valentines day (not entirely her fault but I know it's a no-go for Saturday. Just too much happening that day).
Says who? Her? Why are you coming up with excuses in advance?!? Cinco, maybe you should just go for it in a full-blooded way. She can only say no. "No" big deal.
I guess I should be grateful we've broken out of the old two-times-a-year mold. My b-day and our wedding anniversary were the only two days "special enough" to warrant obligatory sex. Even that wasn't guaranteed nor all that special sometimes.
"Grateful" - again - the wrong mindset. Gratitude (to her) simply doesn't come into it. There's been progress - you're going to push for more - and keep pushing.
There is no such thing as obligatory sex. IMO its a thoroughly bad idea. An expectation that leads to laziness and resentment on both sides. Spot the difference:
"Oh, its my Birthday, I should have sex, I deserve to have sex, I expect to have sex, sex will come, because its my Birthday."
"Its my Birthday, I'm a year older, I feel great. Its been a great day. They were great presents. It was a great meal. I feel like having sex. With you. Because I want to. Because I want you.
Even after having the, "If everything that I desire is right here with you W, why would I ever want to leave?" conversation... It still isn't sinking in with her. We fix this now or I'm through. No wonder she doesn't trust that I won't leave... because I'm about to.
Okay Cinco - what has she done/ not done now? What have you done/ not done? I am no fan of lazy, complacent women, but why is it always her fault when things die down? She must really love that air of resentment you emit.
By being a wimp and putting up with this for so long, I have created a M where only the bare minimum requirements of sex ever happens between us. Stupid "Nice Guys" stay because it seems to be the right thing to do. A "normal guy" would have left as soon as it was apparent that his needs were no longer being met in the R with no changes in sight. For us that would have been 18 years ago when I was 30, I could have easily started my life over then.
But there have been changes - what happened just a few days ago?
I know I'm supposed to feel strong enough in myself to not need sex. When we go for more than about 10 days between times it just plain messes with my head. I can't change who I really am, I won't hide my sexuality any longer. I can't change her, she has to decide for herself.
Messes with your head? So are you seriously stating that if you don't have sex for 10 days your mental health suffers? Sex is your medicine??? It is that precise problem that your wife senses in you, and hangs all her issues on. Your desperation thinking. And if you leave this marriage - who is responsible then for meeting your needs, which woman suddenly gets that duty? Its not exactly a great chat-up line, is it? "Let's go back to my place - I haven't had sex in 10 days and its messing with my head - I must have sex!"
I wish I had hope for us finding a meeting point that we both could live with. Right now I don't see it. I know everyone here has seen my pattern: I'm happy as a lark when we are sexual. I'm sad when I'm left wondering when the next time we ML will be.
Because you have still not taken power over the issue. Why be left wondering? Why not decide when you are going to "take" her?
I keep fooling myself into thinking we've truly made a breakthrough. All I have done is stir things up only to have them settle back to where they've been for too many years.
You stir her up. She settles down. You stir her up... etc. I for one, do not see this cycle as a problem. Let's cut to the chase - once you "stir" her up - does she satisfy you? Is it good sex once you get her on the starting grid? Or does she "fail" in your eyes?
The only "real changes" are happening within myself in facing my reality that I can't stay in a M like this. I do keep hoping for a miracle change in her and that what keeps me here for now.
Hmmm. She may not have changed, but I think your communication with her has definitely improved. Sex is well and truly on the agenda again. Will any improvement ever be enough for you? Do you resent the fact that this is so much effort. Would you rather she was "easier"? I wonder if fear is holding you back? Look at DQ's latest thread.
S&A
"A man can be destroyed but not defeated" - from The Old Man and the Sea, by Ernest Hemingway.
Which I take to mean that every man has within him a spirit of relentlessness and optimism. Its already there; he just has to cultivate it.
S&A writes::: Will any improvement ever be enough? Do you resent the fact that this is effort. Would you rather she was "easier"? I wonder if fear is holding you back?
???? ~WOW~!~!~????~~~
Great post S&A~ I was hoping you would post to Cinco~ when I was posting back. I can't pull him thru this funk I thought to myself but you can!!!!!!!!!!!!! WTG~
Wow I summoned you with my thoughts...
I also resented the fact that I had to make so much effort,,, why coukd not hubby just love me for me?
I know hubby resented me. IT HURT SO MUCH. When I would try he would have so much resentment and he even admitted when I have had "him" in my mouth? he was still resenting me. I knew this and it hurt... it was far better not to try.... my heart was safer.
Ouch! I needed that.
