You sounded alot like what my wife might have said to me but about affection and not sex. It took her walking out the door to wake me up but because there is a OM we probably are done for. You on the other hand...
You are putting so much pressure on your W that I'm sure it's annoying. Nobody likes pressure or being told they need to work on things. What you have been doing is having the opposite effect to what you want so you need to stop.
I know at first you'll think she'll be happy but once you pull back she will notice. This happened to me but it took me about a month to see it. You need to stop all R talk and stop showing affection. Also stop saying ILY first and really put an effort in pulling back. After some time if that doesn't get her attention then think about a trial separation.
I hate to say this but sometime you have to go to some extreme measures to wake someone up but don't give up on her just yet. Today I am a completely different man than I was on e year ago and it was from my W leaving. If she knew I could have been this way she said she would have been happy forever. It's too bad her mind is clouded by the OM. Just make sure you don't fall into the A trap like she did.
Last edited by RobD70; 01/26/0909:05 PM.
Me:38 W:40 Bomb/EA 03/08 Recon twice 1/09 W files for D Story
I said long ago that the decision to leave would be so easy if we were constantly fighting or there was some abusive language involved. When we went to counseling years ago the counselor was baffled as to why we were splitting up. We interact so well and do really love one another... the trouble is in the bedroom.... sigh.
Originally Posted By: Jayce
I can't imagine how hard your W has been working to stay away from any real conversation since you've been off work & she was home & D was at school every day.
I really think her running out and getting a job, any job, had more to do with avoiding the hard conversations I have been trying to have with her. That and it is a great excuse since she'll now be too tired for sex. She actually said, "Don't expect anything out of me, I'll be exhausted."
I may be wrong but the way that W and I interact we in all likelyhood would remain friends even after a split, if it comes to that. I even had a work buddy that had a relationship like that after his divorce. He still has dinner occasionally with his boys and ex-W. He even happily relocated to Pheonix when his ex-W's boyfriend's job moved there. My W said once, "You know if we were ever to split up that is how we would probably be."
Originally Posted By: RobD70
I know at first you'll think she'll be happy but once you pull back she will notice.
I had pulled back since about Christmas time. Our trouble is when I pull back we end up in the ML once every 3 months mode, which is totally unacceptable for me.
Don't worry about my falling into the A trap. Been there done that 7 years ago and it did cloud my opinion. This time this is about only W, Me and our M. She claims there is no resentment over anything but I am not sure that she is just unwilling to admit it. How do I know if she won't tell me what is on her mind? The dialog won't happen without pressure and until it happens we are stuck.
She refuses to go saying that it accomplishes nothing. The funny thing is, MC is part of what helped us to reconcile when we almost divorced 7 years ago. I guess it only worked to convince me. lol
Back then, I had tried to get us into MC for a long time to try to figure out how to put us back on track. When I had finally thrown in the towel and walked out, only then did she beg me to go to MC. I had checked out of the M at that point. No connection left and I was ready to move on. I went only for her sake to help her understand why I was leaving. Over time I slowly wanted to give our M a second chance.
She has a very hard time opening up, even to me. A stranger? Forget about it. She will only make these hard choices as a last resort it seems. If I have to walk out again this is my last time though. I hope it won't come to that but I am prepared to if I must.
We did talk again last night and I will post more in a little while.
Cinco, Let us know when you can ,about your talk. I still can't thank you enough for recomending Duffy. I love her. Oh and of course for being you.!~!~
Last night and this morning were two R-talks where we say so much I can't remember all of what we said but I will try. Sometimes I wish I could record those talks but I know that would be wrong, plus we'd probably say even less than we already do to each other.
Last night we sat together on the couch again watching TV. I put my arm around her on and off and we held hands too. On commercials I even stole a few kisses from her. One time though she seemed more interested in the TV than me. I said "quit paying attention to that and pay attention to me instead." It was all quite playful and really felt nice.
When we got into bed I wanted to look into her eyes and tell her how important she is and how much I do really love her. There is a TV in there too and of course as soon as she gets in there to go to bed it is turned 'on'. The way it is set up her back is to me in bed to face the TV. If I had it my way, there would be no TV in there at all. This is something that she thinks helps her to go to sleep. Anyway by the time I wanted to relate my feelings to her she was all glued in on the damn TV. "W, would you give a little of your undivided attention for a moment so I can tell you something?"
Her reaction was that I wanted to R-talk. She got all pissy and her defenses were immediately up. "Oh not this again, haven't we talked this to death enough lately?" Her reaction set me off, I hate it when I let even her tone determine how I will interact with and what I end up saying to her. She turned off the TV all pissed off and said "Ok what do you want to talk about you have my attention now." This put us in complete darkness (appropriate I guess, we're still in the dark about one another).
"Why am I the least important thing in your life? It seems like you'd rather watch that thing than to hear me tell you something intimate. How can we communicate and get close to each other if we don't set aside time for each other? I am the last thing you think of at the end of the day and then you are too tired for me." I said more things I can't remember it all. Things about how it hurts me to be so low on her list of priorities. Also about how I end up turning my back on her when I can't find a way to reach her and how much that hurts us both.
Finally we got to the heart of the matter I asked if there was something that was holding her back from really getting close to me. "Trust holds me back. H, I don't trust that you won't leave me again."
H - "Well, if we can keep the dialog going between us and learn how not to be so defensive about it maybe we can find a way to be close to each other again. We have to keep R-talking how else will we ever work through this? I don't feel comfortable with it either but it has more to do with knowing it will cause a fight than not wanting to talk about us."
In the end I did get to hold her and tell her that she is really important to me and that I do really love her. It didn't have the meaning I had first intended after our battle of words though.
Part 2 will be this morning's R-talk. (It may be tomorrow before I can post this as I have a rehearsal tonight.)
In the end, at least you landed in the spot you wanted to. The TV is a problem here too. I think it soothes and provides an escape just as much as alcohol does.
I hope that she's going to be ready to face herself one day soon and stop escaping there. Could it be that she is avoiding her own pain, not just you (even if the past with you is part of the cause of it)?
"Trust holds me back. H, I don't trust that you won't leave me again."
This is huge for her Cinco. She was vulnerable with you. She is using not trusting you as a wall. It keeps her safe.
I have felt like this a lot. That feeling she is "holding" onto for dear life is *part* of what is keeping you 2 from feeling more connected?
I dunno , I do think you need to keep talking to her and even if it gets uncomfortable? She needs to know that she can be honest and you are going to keep trying and then be loving just like you were in the end of this convo.
I am excited for you. "
Quote:
We have to keep R-talking how else will we ever work through this? I don't feel comfortable with it either but it has more to do with knowing it will cause a fight than not wanting to talk about us."
I'll post again in the morning but the talk this morning had a lot to do with keeping the lines of communication open. We have been stuck in a place where we'd just avoid the tuff topics for so long that it is hard to get things started again. Neither of us wanted to rock the boat or start a fight, so our interaction turned to just politics, religion, our D16 and day to day stuff, grocery list and the like.
We got so we never talked about how we feel about one another and our needs, wants and desires. I feel like the lines of communication are open again. I intend to keep them open too.
The lack of trust... this I will have to work on because if there is no change from the way we are now I can't stay. I have to let her know I am here trying so hard to make this work for us again.
The TV and the radio... yes these are escapes. I guess in the olden days it would have been books.. She is avoiding really looking at the pain. I have done the same with my music and alcohol.
We are taking a step in the right direction at least. I hope I can keep us talking now.
Cinco said: Neither of us wanted to rock the boat or start a fight, so our interaction turned to just politics, religion, our D16 and day to day stuff, grocery list and the like.
I LOVE THIS. You know you're a good match if talking about politics, religion, and your kid DOESN'T result in a fight! That is a beautiful thing, Cinco.
