As many know, I have tried to reach a state of acceptance in that my marriage is roadkill and a thing of the past. So, I am focusing totally on me...trying to be "stronger, faster, better" so that..should a woman find me desireable again in my life, I will try to minimize my chances of this happening again.
I started my call out reviewing my sitch, however, I had already written him a summary. We spoke for an hour but the main points:
many women live with something subconsciously called 'anticipated criticism'. Whether it's clothes, men, appearance, etc. They are viewed by others and silently or openly criticized. By filing for full custody, that was an attempt to strip her of everything womanly/motherly...that she is not a good mother...that she faced the potential of not being a good mom in the eyes of other women. This 'unleashed hell'. He stated that most women will tire of this as they move on.
he understood about how the atty felt about this, about wanting me to file for full custody at the time..understood how it can't be approached right now, but, instructed me that THIS angle is the one way to eventually defuse this (see below)
he shot down one principle we use here about validating/agreeing (Always Agree) with everything a WAW says. He explained that it works with men in sales tactics/negotiating...that it is a tactic for diffusing reistance to something other than the buyers preconceived desire.. but almost never works with women
I discussed a common 'man' thing here...explaining how clear it seems now...the feelings of being totally responsible...and he explained that all you could do was 'work with the tools you had at the time.' It's a lesson now.
he smacked me when I told him some of the wuss things I had done or said in the past (never again) and he told me one of the biggest mistakes men can do is ask their W's about what decisions to make re: their job (not implying that a woman shouldn't be made aware of what's going on)
he is not in agreement with certain attitudes here that, tho' unspoken, we all know: that if you end up getting D'd...you are a failure...that it is wrong to think that D is not an option if the M is destructive..that frequently people are abandoned here if you file, etc
he asked me what I thought my role was now? When I asked with regards to H? Father? provider....he said no. He told me that my job was leadership/authority and negotiator.
at NO time did he BASH MY WIFE. The only 'criticism' he told me was, as per my sitch, the multiple young men, Botox, dieting, etc....implies her self-esteem is 'subterranean...way below negative numbers.'
he stressed the importance of positive thinking. One must NOT say , "I cannot fail". One MUST say "I will have courage and succeed."
His recommendations:
have a long term (30,60,90) plan for after the appraisal...that my main goal is to defuse the anger by working with her during custody issues...to tell her that it was filed for X,Y,Z reasons and DID NOT reflect on her as a mother/woman at the time....etc
to continue to be positive and if I was greeting her before, continue to greet her. If she responds negatively, respond with non-rhetorical, non-threatening questions. Eg: W: Spare me the warm fuzzy greetings Me: XXX...how does that response help our situation? or...what does that teach the children when you say that in front of them?
And then, respond to any other responses with questions. Anger should be ignored, etc.
in response to the feelings we all have here...about the past..as above, he reiterated that we could only function with the tools that we had in the past..that it is a lesson...learn from it...and leave it there and move forward or the negativity and blame will remain in your new life and destroy you
Finally, he emailed me back and told me that in spite of what happened, I was way ahead of many other of his clients and that it seemed like I 'had it all together'. When I responded back that it still 'stings' when she goes out, he responded that, and, at the risk of having women here get angry, I post it if it will help some other men here:
Quote:
It doesn't matter what she's doing. That's her and another guy's problem, not yours. There's no reason for it to sting. You know there is nothing there and she's chasing somebody else because SHE'S damaged goods, NOT because YOU are. Keep things in perspective because you're the one above all others who has to keep a clear head and well-defined priorities through this mess.
I understand that many will disagree with some of this. It may come across as mostly 'manstuff', but, I hope that it helps some of my followers and I know that ALL OF YOU, as we all do, will choose THOSE things you find applicable...and discard THOSE things that you disagree with.
FIB
Me 55; XW 47; 2 kids (S13, D11) Bomb 05/19/06 Original thread http://tinyurl.com/yg2ou2t Last anniversary 04/25/10, Divorced 5/12/10 Status: Loving father of 2 beautiful children;
I certainly do not see anything over the top in what the counselor said, certainly nothing anti db'ing.
m-54 w-44 children-4 bomb-sept 21 2007 t-21 m-20yrs bomb-sept 23 2007 divorced but not giving up hope, not yethttp://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubb...rue#post1224023
One hour was $127...he has half hour sessions. Was well worth it. Some 'standers' don't accept him because he is not afraid of forcing you to take a hard look at your M. He would NEVER tell you right off to file after an affair. OTOH..in other circumstances, he might ask you why you are.
FIB
Me 55; XW 47; 2 kids (S13, D11) Bomb 05/19/06 Original thread http://tinyurl.com/yg2ou2t Last anniversary 04/25/10, Divorced 5/12/10 Status: Loving father of 2 beautiful children;
fib- thanks for sharing that...I am a women left by a husband and it seems to me like even if you reversed what he said, it made sense...maybe the roles thing could be off but I dont know when you are left ..someone has to lead your new single family..
I like the part about not worry about what they are doing.....it made sense what he said....it really did and it even makes you feel a little better....
HI Grace and BM...thanks craig and 2nd chance. I started out here with the DB coaches. I had DB Chuck and, in the beginning, he had great advice and helped to keep me on track. I said goodbye to Chuck and had a mutually emotionally goodbye after I 'saved' my marriage in Dec. '06. I highly recommend them for newcomers here.
However, in the death throes of my marriage, I am going back to square one...working on me. At times, I look back on my marriage and, although a loving and dedicated H and father, I am disappointed at many of the things that I did or said to destroy the attraction. Although I believe that...if I was making a million bucks a year, my STBXW would have feigned happiness and still ended up in the backseat of cars with 26 year olds....I intend to never go back to that person.
The old FIB is dead and buried.
The man I spoke with is a 'man coach'. He is pro marriage. He is pro woman. His book is about great relationships and marriages. He is about keeping attraction alive in an M/R. He is about leadership and authority but not about chauvinism and sexism. His book is mainly directed at men yet many women buy the book and give to their H's. I sent one or two newsletters to my sis and she thought she sensed some 'anger' in there, but, I don't. Like everything, you must use the stuff that applies to you and discard what doesn't.
I am back to reading this stuff...to hammer in the last nail. He has a newsletter that comes out daily and I highly recommend it to everyone. It could even help women...to see what men are telling men to keep things interesting and hot.
Some friends, who are standers, refuse to read his stuff because they believe that he is anti-marriage and everything is on the woman. Not true.
Anyone who tries to tell you, eg, to plan a secret getaway, pack HER bags for her...to know her clothing size.....to shop for her...to listen...yada yada....is not anti-M etc. But it is more than that.
I like his stuff. It's too late for me...for my M. I wish I had known this stuff sooner. Water under the bridge. I know it now.
FIB
Me 55; XW 47; 2 kids (S13, D11) Bomb 05/19/06 Original thread http://tinyurl.com/yg2ou2t Last anniversary 04/25/10, Divorced 5/12/10 Status: Loving father of 2 beautiful children;
Dear 25.....I am taking my morning time to write to you. For many years, you have often posted incredible things to me. It is quite apparent the thought that you put into your posts and, also, VERY OBVIOUS how much time you take to write them. You have supported me both spiritually and emotionally during the last two years plus of my life which were undoubtedly the worst ever. I want to take a moment and just say thank you.
You should never underestimate what several paragraphs of yours can do for a person. Ofttimes it would be your letters that would lift my heart and spirit after taking a verbally abusive attack from my STBXW. OTOH, it took strength to read some of those posts that, on the outside, appeared to be supporting my wife, when all they were really trying to do was show a woman's perspective on how MY stuff could be perceived. I learned.
I always read your comments..whether they are on my thread or others. They give perspective and I daresay that it is critical for us men to read the posts of women such as yourself so that we grow and better understand our differences.... so that we do NOT repeat those little things that destroy attraction or impede communication.
In other words and as said on someone elses thread, rock on dude FIB
Me 55; XW 47; 2 kids (S13, D11) Bomb 05/19/06 Original thread http://tinyurl.com/yg2ou2t Last anniversary 04/25/10, Divorced 5/12/10 Status: Loving father of 2 beautiful children;
OK...I totally agree with your doctor post on page 1. Funny thing is 25, I think my problem was JUST the opposite. My problem is that I wanted to be home with my family. I DIDN'T want to get called in at night. My son and daughter would cry (and still do complain) when I get paged.
I chose my family over my practice. Although THIS is not the DIRECT reason why I had volume issues, it was certainly a contributor. I loved my W and I loved my kids. If I could dodge a case or a call to the ER, I would....so that I could finish building the gym set in the backyard or not miss a day trip out east to the Hamptons.
It was when my W had to work in my office that I made the BIGGEST error. I treated her like an office manager rather than my wife working in my office. When the stress became apparent, I would say to myself "I have to get her out of here". But, she would 'normalize' for a bit...and...I didn't. She would see some of my occupational hazards...like...getting angry with a nurse over the phone over what I perceived as a 'stupid' phone call. It was more like my job destroyed attraction more that it was the 'wife of the doctor' thing.
There will always be a tightrope with my job...a balance between home and being called to help the sick. Unless I do what my W once said to me (why don't you become a football coach), I will be tied to getting called out in the middle of the night.
Some of the 'doctor facts' that are out there include: -doctors have one of the highest divorce rates -doctors make terrible parents because of lack of focus on the kids vs their patients -doctors have one of the highest crash rates with regards to flying private planes: because of feelings of 'omnipotence', they will takeoff under adverse weather conditions that most flyers would not. They also buy bigger and more powerful planes (one in particular called a Bonanza) that brings on a crash.
No doubt there was SOME control issues but, more than being a doctor or a surgeon, I think these were my OWN 'poor programming' issues from the type of family that I grew up in.
Finally, I think that...the combination of diminishing reimbursements and my STBXW's inability to have those tangible things...and that she might have to work....killed it for her. Expressions of doubt and weakness helped kill attraction as well. She blamed me for everything.
FIB
Me 55; XW 47; 2 kids (S13, D11) Bomb 05/19/06 Original thread http://tinyurl.com/yg2ou2t Last anniversary 04/25/10, Divorced 5/12/10 Status: Loving father of 2 beautiful children;
PS how much longer is the situation with you and your w under the same roof, going to last?
The appraisal of my practice is the hold. It takes awhile. It should be completed by the end of February and then THIS will allow them to move onto the final issue...custody and visitation. I am predicting that the marriage between my wife and I will be dissolved by early/late spring.
Although staying under the same roof together has been miserable, I am now able to see what the one advantage of it is: it forces a settlement and helps to keep things dragging on ad infinitum. It is to XXX's advantage, if she truly despises, to get this done as soon as possible.
Originally Posted By: 25
Plus of course, People change. All of this makes me ask, as your wife is now, well, would you want to marry the woman she is today?
The answer is a resounding NO. When I look at my W now...and look at what minimal pictures of us are up on the wall, I don't see the same person. My W is about tight jeans, personal trainer, shopping, dieting, younger men. She is angry in an unhealthy way. She is self-centered.
No. There is nothing there now and when I do wince, it is remembering the woman I walked down the aisle with.
Most know here that....despite being photographed cuddling with my kids...attempts at false arrest...lying to me...stealing my media card, etc...that I have ALWAYS tried to treat her with respect, keep communication open, and even as only a few months ago, tell her that her hair looked beautiful.
Originally Posted By: 25
Do you have any New Year's resolutions or goals or steps planned out for your program of GAL and PMA?
I didn't formally make any but I have some goals. As you know, I've dropped the classice 'divorce weight' and kept most of it off and I'm in good shape. I need to continue a more consistent exercise schedule. My GAL continues....coaching girl's lacrosse...coaching baseball...better attitude at work...and working on me. I ordered a new set of reeds for my Fireside bagpipes and intend to return music into my life as I had put my pipes down (er...literally and figuratively, LOLOL) during this whole thing.
FIB
Me 55; XW 47; 2 kids (S13, D11) Bomb 05/19/06 Original thread http://tinyurl.com/yg2ou2t Last anniversary 04/25/10, Divorced 5/12/10 Status: Loving father of 2 beautiful children;
