... this translates to "expectations" which translates to "not detaching" and you sometimes call it "not settling". I think in piecing and for the rest of your married life you will need to detach. Heck, we even need to detach from our little one's when they throw a temper tantrum and even they have quite a big ego!
Practice not taking your spouse's behavior personally. He is the product of the hand dealt to him by circumstance and genetics and the relationship dynamic that you are at least partly responsible for. You committed your life to him for better or worse. You have two beautiful kids together. Life is unpredictable, circumstances change. You owe him your love thru' all this. What if he met all your romantic and other expectations and the next day got hit by a truck or had a stroke that made him unable to speak or move. Would you abandon him then? My hunch is he's afraid to take the plunge and come home mainly for this reason that you do not accept him for who he is but what you expect from him. In fact to him it seems that nothing he does is good enough for you - whether its an IPOD, a beautiful dress, a kiss, whatever, ...
I dont want to spend the rest of my life being completely detached from the man beside me. I dont agree with "full-total" detachement. I am fully detached now and cant love him. I think he was detached from me when he went after new interests. There is a fine line between detachement and not caring. He crossed that line nearly 2 years ago and that enabled him to fall for someone and abandoned us. I detached recently and you know what happened. I am trying to ATTACH now.
Of course I take the way he treats ME personally. I will not just pretend.
Frankly, I dont feel I owe him anything anymore. I think I gave him everything, my soul, my heart, my mind, my body, time, patience, understanding, love, support, everything.
And I dont know about me but I am sure that he would abandon me if I was hit by a truck. He has done it already. He was driving the truck and left me behind... K
If I could make a decision with no consequences, I would divorce him.
Ditto, I think I came to a similar conclusion at the start of this year when we entered the new year with W not talking to me. I mean after all we had been through she was showing she hadn't changed, still showing her old patterns of behaviour. But I've put that to the back of my mind now cos those sorts of decisions have big consequencies on others, so we can't do it.
For now I have pulled back (kind of detachement)and I am heading in my direction, W is following very slowly.
K it's a big struggle and one whe have to go through and show we are the bigger person, I know you're already doing it, but we just have to keep doing it.
Hey K.... I like that there is a contrast in approaches from the piecers, I cant say how I would behave as I hadnt gotton to this place, this forum feels pretty personal (not so specific as the DBing stuff we used to help each other with!). I understand that there is a fine line between detached and not caring. Perhaps if you feel loved and secure its easier to detach and not take things personally, but not so easy when someone has not taken steps to make you feel loved again and secure, after an A. Or maybe just more time needs to pass...?
OK guys, I need your help here. Following you will find directly translated -as best as possible- our communication via email of this morning.
Me : As you have realised, I cant pretend that nothing has happened. I feel very angry and hurt. Very hurt. While we were apart, I had managed to think that you made your choice and that was it. I was respecting your choice and moving on. You didnt matter to me as my H only as my kids' dad. Now, that we are trying to renter each other's lives, I have needs, requests and a great big anger. I know that for you it would be better to "move forward" and not look back. Unfortunately this isnt possible, I cant do it, I am not able to do it. The way and pace you choose for us isnt taking us anywhere and it really is bad for me . I think it is time to talk.
His reply: Your anger, which sometimes causes my anger, is a very big setback factor to what we are trying to do. Whatever progress we make, a moment of yoru anger, a misunderstanding, sets everything back. I am very hesitant and on guard. That is why I am "stagnant". They told us at MC that "we are not ready yet" and I have kept this on my mind. I am afraid that they maybe right and the timing is not good and as a result this effort will go wasted. Of course that doesnt mean I feel we shouldnt try because of what they said or because of our anger. Let's talk, I have bo objection to that. But, please, not about issues for which I have no other answers to give. For the things you are asking, I am thinking what else I could tell you to satisfy you. But I dont have anything else. In any case, lets' talk for whatever you want.
The Mc told us that she could see the anger and that we are not ready to consider ourselves reconcilliated or move in together and that they agreed with taking it slow.
They also told him he has to make a choice regarding time, risk to give, listen etc etc... Obviously those parts escaped his memory. I am pissed off he is trying to set boundaries to the talk, he means the OW issue of course, and honestly I wanst going to talk about her. Right now, I dont want to talk to him at all. I want this to end. I see no reason why I should convince him to love me. I see no reason why I have to sell myself again as a product. I am not sending an email back at the moment. I had one drafted but was too mean and mad and I will sit quiet for while. K
OK, I am furious. "Ok, let's talk I have no objection?" You see, to talk with him is like asking for a favor. He is doing me a favor. I thought of sending this back:
The way I see it you have more reasons to talk to me about everything and give explanations, state your oppinioin and express your feelings. You see, the way this is going you are going to lose, very soon, the woman you love and your family and granted you caused all this by just taking the easy way out when the going got tough, the natural thing would be to do all and everything in your powers to stop that from happening.
MC never said "dont try you are not ready". She said "you are not ready to go ahead, move in and pretend you "fixed" this. She said you need IC, she said you need to choose between work and me, she said we need to work hard and commit to saving this marriage, she said it is difficult because a lot of time has passed" and you translated all that to take some more time off Honestly, I dont feel like doing anything else. It's a shame and it will always be a mystery to me, why the hell you wanted back if you were not prepared to do what it takes...?
Do yourself a favor K and delete the draft copy of the email. No amount of reworking it will help tone it down. Start over.
Your H is entitled to set boundaries on what he is willing to discuss right now. That doesn't mean that it couldn't be addressed at a later time.
The question here K is not whether your M can be restored but if you have enough love left in your heart for your H as your H and not just as the father of your children. Can you see the possibility of a future with him?
I'm sorry this is tearing you apart again K, but the end result of the ripping in your soul will be the right decision for you.
Love and hugs to you K. Seriously, I'm rooting for your M but whatever you decide to do, I am behind you 100%!
T19 M15 S19 XH47 M43 bomb12/4/07 PA5/07 S12/26/07 D final 11/17/08 Back together with no defined R 05/2010 confused....to say the least!!!
DONT SEND IT !!! DO NOTHING IN HASTE! Its an angsty day.. you got to think VERY carefully before speaking as it can affect the whole course of your life and you might regret it later. I was just reading about htat.. seriously, just sit on it... send him an email thanking him for his and say you will thnikn about what he says and reflect on it and speak to him later in the week, or something. Dont do it... !
Ok, sorry, dont know what else to say at mo about his email, but seems that unresolved anger IS an issue between you.
Please sleep on it, dont react, give it 24 hours.. post here instead, see what people say.
OF COURSE I AM ANGRY!! I am angry he is acting like a coward, avoiding what could be annoying to him, setting boundaries about what to be discussed when he PROMISED he would tell me everything, finding no time for me, saying not ONE good word for my cooking , my dressing, my shoes, my eyes, my whatever, just being there and thinking I shoudl be grateful he is back... I am angry at myself for choosing him to be my H.
His reply: Your anger, which sometimes causes my anger, is a very big setback factor to what we are trying to do. Whatever progress we make, a moment of your anger, a misunderstanding, sets everything back. I am very hesitant and on guard. That is why I am "stagnant".
They told us at MC that "we are not ready yet" and I have kept this on my mind. I am afraid that they maybe right and the timing is not good and as a result this effort will go wasted. Of course that doesnt mean I feel we shouldnt try because of what they said or because of our anger.
Let's talk, I have bo objection to that. But, please, not about issues for which I have no other answers to give. For the things you are asking, I am thinking what else I could tell you to satisfy you. But I dont have anything else. In any case, lets' talk for whatever you want.
...looking at some of the things that jump out.. he is NOT willing to take responsibility (yet?) for what has happened. I hear the blame in his voice. I think he is trying to ignore the middle bit (his leaving and the OW) as though that didnt happen and try and move forward from the point that led to that in the first place. He doesnt seem to want to take the blame for where you find yourselves, being about the S and his A? He keeps saying its YOUR anger, YOUR fault? Thats not good! What does he expect though, after what happened??? Has he ever asked yuo to forgive him for leaving? Or asked you if you have forgiven him?
Its ridiculous he says he as "no other answers" and says "I dont have anything else".. thats just being avoidant and cowardly, as you say. He is very defensive. He is afraid, he said so himself. He's cautious. Maybe (this might sound silly).. he doesnt want to get hurt? He cant seem to appreciate or emeliorate your hurt either. He's stuck in still thinking whats best for him.
Can you skip the S and the OW and talk about the year BEFORE all that and what led him to leaving?? Unpick that end of it? The S and OW are only a symptom afterall, have you two talked about what led to the S?
Did you write back, or wait?? I can see you are hurt and angry, its all getting to be a bit of a mess isnt it, resentments on top of past hurts.
I am reading that he is not willing to accept that in order to go forward you have to look back. I don't see how that can be a reason able expectation. If nothing else, you would want to recognize the mistakes you made together, so that you can avoid going down the same road again. And, he wants to put all of the responsibility for things not moving forward again on you. Because you are angry that things are not moving forward! Not realizing, or wanting to see, that if things were moving forward, you would probably be less angry!
I don't know what you should do. He doesn't want responsibility, yet he needs to take it on. Of course, none of us are perfect, but he is the one that left. If you talk to him, I think that you might try to clearly state why you have to look back. Tell him he doesn't have to answer the questions right now, but that you would like him to understand why you need to have answers. And tell him that your anger is more about what isn't happening now, rather that what happened in the past.
