Hm. Attractive. Hadn't even thought of that. I was just being more of my normal self and that self just doesn't accept a lot of disrespect. I'm sure she's angry but I could really care less. Feels good to be a good dog.
Carlos I am so glad you did that.... No more BS from her.... You stand firm on what you believe. What's wrong with that??? You were not being rude. She may be angry but she will get over it. And yes, firm and assertiveness are attractive traits in general, I think.
Keep up the good work...my friend.
NW626
Me:33 STBXW:38 S:3 It's not whether you win or lose, it's how you fight the fight....!!
I agree with the others. Part of this process, if not most of this process is about healing ourselves and making ourselves whole. Calling your W out on unacceptable behavior is a good thing, particularly when the motivation is to show your child how to be.
One of the few things we control in this mess is our own feelings (I know I am the poster child for crying and feeling low, but the fact of the matter is, that it is almostentirely my own doing). I think it was great that you took care of your needs in that situation.
Hi NW and V - thanks to both of you for your vote of confidence as well...I feel like it was a step in the right direction - back toward myself...
Here's the email I got from her in response to what I said last night: ................................ Hi Carlos,
I appreciate the idea of treating each other with respect in front of S2, and in light of that, think that your behavior last night was completely inappropriate. I did say hello to you last night. Because you didn't hear me say hi, you got loud, sarcastic and aggressive, saying that I was exactly like [the husband of my first wife], and saying GOOD BYE in a way that sounded crazy. Your aggressive response was really unjustified and over the top, and much worse than what you seemed to think you had a complaint about. I hope you are continuing with your anger management classes-- it seemed like you were trying to intimidate me, especially since I did say hello to you.
I think that going forward, if you have concerns like this, it would be better if you address them in an email rather than put on a big show in front of S2.
I would also like to remind you that when I pick S2 up from your house at 6.30, I would appreciate it if he's ready to go around that time. I actually called before I got to your street, and still had to wait for you to bring S2 out. I work long hours, and still have a lot to do when I get home, and would like to get there as soon as possible.
Best,
.........................
And this is how I responded:
W, I understand what you're saying, but that is not how I was last night. I think it's troublesome for you to be so rude to me in front of S2. You often turn your back on me as I'm talking - and you certainly don't say hello to me when I greet you. That kind of behavior sends a message to S2 - and I don't think it's the right one at all. You don't have to like me - but for the sake of S2 it would be best for you to take some time to consider how you interact with me as well. If I seemed loud, sarcastic or aggressive to you last night, I apologize. That wasn't my intention. I was actually laughing through all of it because I just sometimes think it's so very strange that our relationship has fallen apart to such an extent. I mentioned [XW's H] because I know that you understand how rude that sort of behavior is in terms of him - and how he behaves - and I really just wanted you to see what it's like.
As for getting S2 ready for you by 6:30 -that's just not something so cut and dry. Sometimes you get here well after 6:30 and sometimes (like last night) I have to calm S2 down before coming outside - since there are times when he protests having to leave, and I try to do my best to get him relaxed and happy before heading out the door. This isn't easy on him, W, and while I understand that you work late hours and want to get him right away - I have to make him my priority - and if he's having a rough time getting his shoes on and out the door, I will not rush him - I will make sure he's fine first. Best, Carlos
............... Now I know it's best not to respond to her emails right away, etc, and I did take my time in responding some...but my gut just said - no, this is about my son, and I am not going to pussyfoot around his well-being. She can make all the accusations she wants...but her note tells me that I got my point across loud and clear....we'll see if she's any more respectful now.
I shared her email with my T this morning - and he wasn't surprised by it at all. He responded by saying that normally when a man goes to him and talks about his W - he takes everything the man says with a grain of salt - but that when I went in to talk with him, he just believed me - and that he could tell from what I was saying that my W's "issues were deep rooted." It's interesting - because I went in there this morning with a lot of sympathy for my W and a lot of sadness for what she's going through - but he focused me on talking about me and the positives in my life instead - and reminded me that I have to live like she is out of my life, because she is...other than contact over our baby.
He then asked me what my ideal partner would be like - in the future - beyond this process of growth and healing that I'm going through...I said she would be self-confident, independent, strong, compassionate, kind, not jealous of my children, intelligent and not entangled with me. He said he was happy with my hopes since I wasn't looking for an "un-W" or just the opposite of my W - but for positive qualities in a person. I don't know if/when I'll meet someone new - but I do know that this relationship with my W is dead. If it ever becomes something again it would have to start from scratch - provided that I'm still interested in starting over with her...and right now, with the person she has become, that just doesn't interest me anymore - and this, despite how much I love her...
I think it is a good idea that you are calmly and rationally explaining your feelings and beliefs about normal polite behavior. It is remarkable that she read so much aggression into what soundls like a very calm exchange between you.
I know this cannot have been easy for you to do, but you handled it with grace.
Hi Veronica, I'm doing okay today, thanks. It did surprise me how much she saw in that exchange - since I didn't raise my voice at all and just tried to sound as a matter of fact as possible...Still, to her, the aggression she sees is real - and I think she really does feel intimidated by assertiveness. That's actually something our MC pointed out to her in session once - that she, my W, confuses assertiveness with anger - both in others and in herself - and so when someone is assertive, she reads it as anger - and when she's trying to be assertive, she does so through anger (I had forgotten about our MC saying that until just now).
Throughout our R there's been an issue of how she interprets my moods - and is often wrong about them. She used to tell me I was angry when I didn't have an ounce of anger me, or she would ask me to calm down and relax whenever I felt just happy about something...it was as though she had to control my emotions by defining them.
I'm curious to see how our interaction will go tonight. This morning I also sent her the note I had written...since it just seemed like a good time to let her know that I am no longer playing into the dynamic that she is insisting on seeing - and that I am very prepared to move on with my life - just as she is prepared to do so for herself.
Now I know that she is going through a process...but I also see that she isn't doing anything to examine herself or to improve herself - and is still very determined to find all fault with me - that's fine - she can do that...but when I think about our past in more detail it becomes more and more obvious that I might just be better off by extricating myself from her and her family - that way I can also provide our son at least half a stable family to grow up in - whereas if we stay together, I think it could remain an unhealthy environment.
I should mention that I went to see The Wrestler last night - the new Mickey Rourke movie - and I thought his acting was incredible- just incredible. It was a powerful movie - and extremely depressing - and when I got home around midnight I just walked into the house and wept like I had never heard myself weep before...the movie just struck a cord in some ways - about the loneliness of burying yourself in the myth of your identity at the expense of taking care of the harsh reality of your life...It made me think of my father, who identified himself in the myth of the successful physician and who now struggles with being retired...and it made me think of the myths I had been inhabiting about myself - and what I might have been on course to lose if I didn't pause and take stock of my obligations to reality - to my kids especially. It's a slow-paced film - and nothing like Rocky - but it is well directed and the script is pretty good. Even some of the cheesy lines benefited from actors that know how to deliver them in ways that sounded natural and convincing - and not so first-draft. If anyone is in the mood for a depressing, well-written and sometimes very blood movie (all in the wrestling), I would recommend it...just be sure you're not alone afterward...like I was...
Hey Carlos I think I will pass on the movie now. I don't think I am ready yet...LOL V is right, you have handled your W with such a grace and calmness, and it is just very unfortunate on how she interprets your feelings. Slight warning, this has potential to turn into pi$$ing match, and try not to have anything for her to document in general, text, email.....etc. Just need to protect yourself, my friend.
You are doing great. I can see your confident is higher than ever. Keep up the good work. NW626
Me:33 STBXW:38 S:3 It's not whether you win or lose, it's how you fight the fight....!!
Hi NW: I am feeling more confident - and more like myself in many ways...I think I just had to go through some extreme sorrow to get here - maybe like it was just pushing that sadness out to make room for me again...don't know...but that's how it feels.
I think you're right that this exchange could become a pi$$ing match - so it ends now in that last note I sent her...there's really not much more to discuss. When I asked my T today about whether or not I should respond to her emails - especially the ones with accusations in them - he said, "it doesn't seem to me like she's asking you anything, so there's really no reason to respond." I thought that was clever.
Anyway...my plan now is just to be kind, request respect, offer respect, and just continue to try to be her friend - even though I can see that she doesn't want me as a friend at all...that's okay with me now.
I think that your approach is the way to go, being kind, friendly and giving and seeking respect are all very healthy things. Good for you.
I am sorry you were alone after that movie. That is the movie H said he wants to see when we had lunch on NYE. I think he identifies with Mickey Rourke's character's disillusionment. I have not seen it yet. I had said I was interested in seeing it and Hsaid maybe we'd see that together next. But from your description, I think he'd be better off seeing it alone.
I know you have been feelig a lot of sadness lately. How are you doing? Do you feel like you are moving through it, even if very slowly?
Hi V, I think it will be much easier to be kind and respectful since I've sent her that letter - and just felt like it was something of a release from her. She just has nothing over me now - no way to control me - and even her anger can't get to me the way she wants it to. I'm doing okay - still feeling some lingers pangs of grief - but nothing like last night or the day before (or the day before the day before).
Have you seen Slumdog Millionaire yet? That's a great movie - a lot more uplifting (even through its moments of real sadness).
The Wrestler is definitely the type of movie that depressed men would enjoy...okay...so that doesn't make a lot of sense...but I mean that sometimes when I'm really down (i.e. last night) it just feels cathartic to see something that lets some of the emotions ride to the surface...and such it was for me last night.
